Defiance

[AWwrgwy]

ya know something that really irritates me as of late is all the WWII movies that all carry a jewish plight undertone.

dont get me wrong, what happened to them was horrible, it never should have happened and it shall be a blight upon the german race for many years to come. these things i acknowledge and understand so there is no need to remind me of them in this thread.

my point is that many people struggled against the nazi occupation of their lands and they were heroes in their own rights, but because they had nothing to do with the jewish plight their stories go untold by the american mass media (movies ect). i find this to be deplorable.

were those involved in the french resistance less brave? had it not been for their efforts D-Day would have never been possible.

what about the russian civilians trapped in stalingrad during the german siege. they had no food no weapons no heat they lived in tunnels and basements their own government had written them off as an acceptable loss, but still they gave no aid to the german soldiers.

what about the yugoslavians, theirs i believe was one of the biggest undergrounds and eventually turned into an actual military force.

i again repeat, what happened to the jewish people was disgusting and horrific, but there are other stories that should be told also. WWII was not about only the jews, many others sacrificed everything, including their lives. they have earned the right to be acknowledged.

FLOTSOM

But remember, there are those who deny it ever happened.....


It's just easier to find an underdog and a villain this way.  Cut and dried.

Don't want to spoil it for anyone any more than I already have, but there was an interesting prayer said at one point in the movie that made me say hmmmm.


wrongway

[Shuffler]

There are and will be many other stories other than just the Jewish ones.


Here is the trailer in HD... much better...
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=-J4mN-W-p0A&feature=related

[gpwurzel]

Apologies for bumping a rather old thread - just watched this film and its excellent. Maybe not 100% accurate - I'm aware of the Bielski story from other sources - but a very moving story.

Sure, this is just my opinion, but if you haven't seen it, I recommend you do.


Wurzel

[Angus]

I am definately going to see this one. About time to mention the Russian Partisans who fought a gruesome battle against the Nazis. And they did become a menace.

[Obie303]

This movie doesn't hit the U.S. for another week (January 16th).  But, since it's been almost 4 years since I've actually gone and seen a movie, I'm very interested in this one. 

Keep those opinions coming.
Obie

[cpxxx]

Well Flotsam, there have been hundreds of movies made about the war. Covering many aspects of the war from any number of angles. Not just English speaking movies. As far as I know this hasn't been done before. Thus it is worthy of attention. In any case Hollywood movies are notorious for over emphasising the American side of things to the point where other countries contributions are overlooked. The Brits are always whinging on about that. In reality this is a rare example of a mainstream movie dealing with the subject. Jewish resistance is not very well known.

[Obie303]

Well Flotsam, there have been hundreds of movies made about the war. Covering many aspects of the war from any number of angles. Not just English speaking movies. As far as I know this hasn't been done before. Thus it is worthy of attention. In any case Hollywood movies are notorious for over emphasising the American side of things to the point where other countries contributions are overlooked. The Brits are always whinging on about that. In reality this is a rare example of a mainstream movie dealing with the subject. Jewish resistance is not very well known.

I agree with this statement.  That's why we've got books on the subject.  Never underestimate the power in knowledge that is gained by reading a book.

Obie

[Anaxogoras]

Jewish resistance is not very well known.

Jewish resistance is not well known because there was almost no resistance to speak of.  Granted, there was the uprising in the Warsaw ghetto, but its uniqueness leaves the psychologically-minded historian scratching his head.  The lack of Jewish resistance is well documented by Raul Hilberg, who spends a portion of his The Destruction of The European Jews trying to explain why more didn't fight to the death long after it was apparent that their extermination was imminent.

[FLOTSOM]

In any case Hollywood movies are notorious for over emphasising the American side of things to the point where other countries contributions are overlooked.

i completely agree with this. we americans are exceptionally conceited and self centered about any history we can lay some kind of claim to.

additionally if we dont like the rest of the worlds reality, even about their own history, thats ok, cause we will just make a ton of lame and factually inaccurate movies until, with alot of sex and theatrical special effects to enthrall the masses, we convince the mainstream that our version of their history is the right one.

just look at the block buster movie 300. it is so disgustingly inaccurate it makes me ill to think about how big a joke it makes of those that really lived and died at Thermopylae. i read Herodotus when i was 7ish and have taken that story as a moral standing ground for my life ever since. so although i am not Greek, i am never the less insulted on behalf of those who are and whose history has been so perverted in that movie.

FLOTSOM

[Anaxogoras]

just look at the block buster movie 300. it is so disgustingly inaccurate it makes me ill to think about how big a joke it makes of those that really lived and died at Thermopylae. i read Herodotus when i was 7ish and have taken that story as a moral standing ground for my life ever since. so although i am not Greek, i am never the less insulted on behalf of those who are and whose history has been so perverted in that movie.

FLOTSOM

Well said.  If you like ancient war histories also check out Thuycidides, who is generally regarded as the first scientific historian in the west (he leaves the gods out of it).  His account of the Peloponnesian war is excellent, and totally undermines the Hollywood fantasy of Spartan aggressiveness.  If anything, the Spartans were supremely cautious, to the point of fault, and it was the Athenians who were risk-takers in battle.

[Saxman]

If you want to attack 300 for accuracy then you need to go back about 20-odd years because the movie was based virtually frame-by-frame on a comic book. Blame Frank Miller, not the movie.

[Anaxogoras]

Blame Frank Miller, not the movie.

Burn him!

[Ack-Ack]

Isn't he the guy that filmed Cold Mountain - A movie set in the US CIVIL WAR - in fricken Romania?

Because he can't enter the States or he'll be arrested.


ack-ack

[Ack-Ack]

I understand that this is a "Hollywood" movie and that the facts are sometimes way off from being historically accurate.  One thing that bothered me was most of the books I've read about regarding the uprisings in Poland by the Jews and the Polish underground, none of them ever mentioned these groups joining the Soviets in attacks against the Germans. 

There was a large Polish Communist partisan army that was organized and equipped by the Soviets.  The Soviets refused to let the Western Allies lend air support to the Polish underground resistance fighters during the Warsaw uprising because those resistance forces were largely made up of anti-communist partisans.  It wasn't until they were pretty much beaten and destroyed as an effective resistance force that the Soviet let the Western Allies finally help out in the way of air support and supplies.  This was done so Stalin could be sure that he could install a friendly communist puppet government after the war.


ack-ack

[Simaril]

Apologies for bumping a rather old thread - just watched this film and its excellent. Maybe not 100% accurate - I'm aware of the Bielski story from other sources - but a very moving story.

Sure, this is just my opinion, but if you haven't seen it, I recommend you do.


Wurzel

Heard an interview of the guy who wrote the book -- said he wasn't even aware of the story till he was researching what eventually turned into Schindler's List. Called up a source, told him he was researching the story of Schindler's saving 300 Jews -- and the source (who turned out to be one of the brothers in THIS story) said something like "300? Bah! How'd you like to hear about people who saved 3 THOUSAND??"