Fix the Wirble

[Bronk]

On the contrary, it is worded that way.... says nothing about Pilot Fatigue, its under flight characteristics.  But nice try.

Do impart to the durability of the airframe , I do not think the airframe was over stressed by hanging bigger guns off it. It would however take more pilot input to maintain the same maneuverability as it's smaller gunned sibling.  More pilot stress?


We'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

[SmokinLoon]

First, I complately agree with correcting the Wirby.  The fact that there were only 100 ever built (or so hear) and they dominate the AA game is a bit confusing in itself.  There is nothing stopping them from being deployed.  If HTC were to apply the same sort of logic to their gv scoring as they do to their aircraft, it would be... well... nevermind.  It would still be goofed up.  

The wirby currently fires as if all 3200 rounds are linked via a belt fed mechanism.  I'm not sure how they would incorperate a dealy in firing unless they were able to mimic the delay in how a tank fires but yet allow for a string of 40 rounds (the wirby has 4/10 round magazines, yes?) to be fired without delay.  

The other thing that gets me is that it seems as if the Wirby can take a lot more damage to its hull vs a Pzr before being destroyed.  Odd.  

[Dadsguns]

Do impart to the durability of the airframe , I do not think the airframe was over stressed by hanging bigger guns off it. It would however take more pilot input to maintain the same maneuverability as it's smaller gunned sibling.  More pilot stress?


We'll have to agree to disagree on that one.

You may fail to agree, any stress to the pilot is the result of flight characterstics and not the pilot.

"The large size of the ShFK-37 cannons and their magazine feeds (capacity 40 rounds) determined their placement into aerodynamic pods under the wings of the IL-2. Because of the large magazine housing on the cannon, it was needed to significantly lower the construction features of the wing (the aircraft's axes).This not only made the cannon housing construction difficult (the cannon was attached to a shock-absorber; during firing it moved together with the magazine) but also required the making of large aerodynamic pods. The mass of the cannon and its components equaled 302.5 kg. Besides the cannons and MG's, the Shturmovik also carried 8 rocket platforms RS-82. Bombs were also carried but only to a maximum capacity of 200 kg. "

They utilized a shock absorber in the cannon pods to help with the shock to the wings, surely some ingenuity involved just to get this thing to fly.

[Rich46yo]

I think someone just doesn't want to get proved wrong. I landed a 14 kill sortie after I died with 13, so I think 17 is possible, dontcha think?

So yesterday you got killed by a WW with 13, got killed by your server with 17, and then also landed a 14?

Kid you are a God of cartoon Mossie pilots.

The other thing that gets me is that it seems as if the Wirby can take a lot more damage to its hull vs a Pzr before being destroyed.  Odd.

Ive noticed no difference. Not from tanks or IL2s. Most of the time 1 hit from a tank is enough just like "most of the time" one well placed 37mm volley from an IL2 is enough.

[Bronk]

They utilized a shock absorber in the cannon pods to help with the shock to the wings, surely some ingenuity involved just to get this thing to fly.

Shocks were used to help alleviate stress on the air frame when firing.  I fail to see how they needed them to get it to "fly".  BTW the nose still gets pushed around noticeably if you fire more than a short burst.

Edit: I imagine Pilots might have been warned "NOT" to fire under heavy G load as it might cause a stability issue.

[Spikes]

So yesterday you got killed by a WW with 13, got killed by your server with 17, and then also landed a 14?

Kid you are a God of cartoon Mossie pilots.

Far from it. It's not that hard with 4 laser 20mms in the nose.

[Bronk]

Ive noticed no difference. Not from tanks or IL2s. Most of the time 1 hit from a tank is enough just like "most of the time" one well placed 37mm volley from an IL2 is enough.

Got to agree with you on this one. Once turreted easy kills.

[MjTalon]

WW shouldn't be perked, learn tactics to take it down. Only takes a few pings from anything over .50 calibre round to deturret a WW/Ost.

Come in directly 90 Degrees about 5-6k over the tank and 1-2 seconds of fire from a P47 will turret a wirb. Climb out, rinse, repeat. You might get caught once or twice but a wirb is so easy to turret. All you have to do is set up a proper attack and fire at the top of it.

[Dadsguns]

Shocks were used to help alleviate stress on the air frame when firing.  I fail to see how they needed them to get it to "fly". BTW the nose still gets pushed around noticeably if you fire more than a short burst.

I was refering to the added weight to an aircraft that already had poor flight characteristics, which by adding the cannon pods made it even worse as pointed out below.


On a side note, I found this about the wirble..... http://www.historyofwar.org/articles/weapons_wirbelwind.html   Notice the range at which it fired

Here is some more about the ROF for the WW   http://www.wwiivehicles.com/germany/flak-panzers/wirbelwind.asp

So if you increased the range and slowed the traverse, you would have a more historically correct vehicle.

[caldera]

WW shouldn't be perked, learn tactics to take it down. Only takes a few pings from anything over .50 calibre round to deturret a WW/Ost.

Come in directly 90 Degrees about 5-6k over the tank and 1-2 seconds of fire from a P47 will turret a wirb. Climb out, rinse, repeat. You might get caught once or twice but a wirb is so easy to turret. All you have to do is set up a proper attack and fire at the top of it.

My convergence on .50s is at 300. Where do i aim from 5-6k in order to turret the wirbletard?

[Spikes]

NOT a perk thread, please leave perking it, out of here.

WW shouldn't be perked, learn tactics to take it down. Only takes a few pings from anything over .50 calibre round to deturret a WW/Ost.

Come in directly 90 Degrees about 5-6k over the tank and 1-2 seconds of fire from a P47 will turret a wirb. Climb out, rinse, repeat. You might get caught once or twice but a wirb is so easy to turret. All you have to do is set up a proper attack and fire at the top of it.

[Bronk]

WW shouldn't be perked, learn tactics to take it down. Only takes a few pings from anything over .50 calibre round to deturret a WW/Ost.
Sigh    OP asked to have it model adjusted to be more like its RL counterpart. Try reading the OP again.


Come in directly 90 Degrees about 5-6k over the tank and 1-2 seconds of fire from a P47 will turret a wirb. Climb out, rinse, repeat. You might get caught once or twice but a wirb is so easy to turret. All you have to do is set up a proper attack and fire at the top of it.

No kidding really. But it's ability to swing those guns around and fire in quad mode without end... need to be addressed. The turret was in fact hand cranked turned and was clip fed.

[Bronk]

I was refering to the added weight to an aircraft that already had poor flight characteristics, which by adding the cannon pods made it even worse as pointed out below.

You have yet to provide any documentation on that. As I said HT doesn't use pilot recollection he uses hard data. Argue with him if you like.

As to your ww adjustments you forgot about being clip fed. 2 gun continuous np quad needs adjustment.

[Anaxogoras]

Summary of Thread:

Mr. Evidence: "We have evidence that the wirbelwind's model has some inaccuracies, namely turret traverse speed, and firing duration."

Peanut Gallery: "Stop whining!  You suck!  If you're getting killed by wirbelwinds you don't know what you're doing."

Mr. Evidence: "Excuse me, I'm not talking about killing or being killed by wirbelwinds.  I'm talking about the accuracy of how they're modeled in the game."

Peanut Gallery: "Pathetic whiners like you are always saying perk this!  Perk that!  Learn some tactics before you come here to complain."

Mr. Evidence: "Do you speak English?"

Peanut Gallery: "Stop whining!"

[WWhiskey]

Thanks for pointing out realism, but I'm talking about a different kind of realism. Not the Side realism, the 13 kills realism, but the model realism. Yeah, a Mossie can't have 13 kills in real sortie (well, Maybe). But did a Lancaster dive from 6K to carpet bomb a CV? Did B24s and B17s carpet bomb GVs in the war? No. I'm not talking about real life flying, but the flight model itself. The Shermans turret got fixed, for added realism, so why can't we fix a couple minor problems on the Wirble, for added realism

I was flying that low because the fight was OTD.

the golden BB that shot you down is probably the most realistic part of this game