Author Topic: p-47's kill Tigers  (Read 3256 times)

Offline SectorNine50

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #15 on: March 21, 2009, 06:24:05 AM »
Bullets will ricochet off of any surface, all the matters is the angle.
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Offline StokesAk

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #16 on: March 21, 2009, 09:28:33 AM »
They are uber.  :noid
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Offline Spikes

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #17 on: March 21, 2009, 09:41:15 AM »
Our Tigers do not have the fuel trailers to catch on fire.   
That's the first thing I caught in the vid.
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Offline ScatterFire

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #18 on: March 21, 2009, 10:20:14 AM »
so the WW2 vet who actually did it in real life, is a liar..
Listen to it again.  He didn't say they killed the tank, he said they were TOLD to do it that way.  Big difference  :aok

Never been in the army, have you?  What you are told is effective and what is reality is not always the same thing.
Quote
you cant kill ANY armor in this game with 50 cals, no matter what.

You can knock a turret on the weaker tanks with it.  You can track them.  You can kill lighter armor like the M16

The .50 cals of the day didn't have the power to get through heavier armor except maybe at point blank range with concentrated fire.  Notice how "concentrated" the fire was in that video, the pilot wasn't any better of a shot that I am  :rofl
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Offline Helm

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #19 on: March 21, 2009, 10:44:20 AM »
   I have been an armor buff all my life (46 yrs old).   During that time I have studied the subject extensively.  I build museum quality models so therefore I have to study every nut and bolt on a vehicle I model.  I probably own 200+ books on Tanks.

   I have never seen a single photo nor have I ever read a single reference to Tiger Tanks towing fuel trailers.  The only real use of Tanks with fuel trailers was very early in the War.  These were mostly used in the invasion of France and to some extent the invasion of Russia.  Fuel trailers were mostly used by Panzer IV-C's with very limited use by Panzer IV-D's.  By the time the IV-D was out in significant numbers the practice had been mostly abandoned.  I have seen a few Panzer III-E's with fuel trailers.  These photos's are extremely rare.  There was also some limited use of Fuel Trailers by the Africa Corps but this too was very limited, and very early. 

   Fuel trailers were phased out and Wehrmacht went to welding on racks to hold countless "jerry" cans.  Many Panzer III-F's, G's and H's were  covered in "jerry" can racks.  As well as countless Panzer IV-E's and F1's,  also many StugIII-F's  and G's were buried in fuel cans and drums. 

    By the time this pilot was attacking German armored formations on the move,  fuel shortages were the order of the day.  Most tankers were hard pressed to have fuel in their internal tanks, much less have fuel trailers or lots of "Jerry" cans stowed on board. At this point of the War there may have been some tank,  somewhere,  towing a trailer, but this practice was far from wide spread.

    Due to the fear that Allied soldiers had of Tigers Tanks, many many times Panzer IV's were reported to be Tigers.  In fact the British did not allow the phrase "Tiger Tank" to be used on the radio due to the panic those words caused.  Tigers were being seen everywhere by everybody.  I have watched this film very carefully he does appear to strafe a Tiger II.  If you watch carefully,  you will see that what is burning is on a different stretch of the road from where the King Tiger was moving.

    "Bullets bouncing off the road and hitting the underbelly of a Tiger tank?"  This could be possible but not probable.  If you take a moment to look at a Tiger Tank or Tiger II you see that the "road" wheels are interlocked (overlap).  This leaves very little room for  bullets to pass through and strike the road surface.  In fact from the side I would say it's close to impossible. If you look carefully at a Panzer IV you will see there is lots of room between the "road" wheels for bullets to bounce up so it may be be possible to impact the bottom of a Panzer IV using this method.  From the data I have read on .50 cal ability to penetrate Armor plate. A .50cal round would not be able to penetrate a Tigers bottom armor under ideal circumstances,  much less after bouncing off the pavement.

    Also I have seen countless photos of wrecked Tiger tanks and I have never seen a photo of one that was disabled from underneath by anything except a mine....or a demolotion charge.



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« Last Edit: March 21, 2009, 10:47:01 AM by Helm »
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Offline Karnak

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #20 on: March 21, 2009, 01:53:56 PM »
Here we go again on this issue I had bought this up a long time ago & was assaulted no end.
I have spoken to this fellow. http://www.p47pilots.com/P47-Pilots.cfm?c=incP47BiographyHome.cfm&vm=BIO&pilotid=80&p=Joseph%20P.%20Celauro he to confirmed that they did do this & from what he recalled they were instructed to so on tanks. He said the most effective thing they used on tanks was napalm as it burnt all the oxygen up & collapsed the lungs of the crews & essentially cooked the crew inside the tank as they could net get out due to the flames. He told me you have to remember that with 3 squadrons from a fighter group all doing this at the same time on a column it was guaranteed to destroy all vehicles no matter what they were.


Napalm, yes, .50 cals, no.
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Offline redman555

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #21 on: March 21, 2009, 02:09:23 PM »
if u listen... they said they shot  the trailer of fuel BEHIND the tank... cause it would set tiger on fire...


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Offline ooKUsh

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #22 on: March 21, 2009, 05:03:33 PM »
Sheeeesh they were only going out for a picnic, all their sandwiches fried, not forgetting the deck chairs and travel rugs all nicely packed into their trailers...........lmao trailers please!
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Offline LTARogue

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #23 on: March 21, 2009, 07:20:52 PM »
If only the Wehrmacht had their trusty wirblewind in the column :)

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Offline caldera

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #24 on: March 21, 2009, 07:39:46 PM »
If only the Wehrmacht had their trusty wirblewind in the column :)

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Offline Wingnutt

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #25 on: March 21, 2009, 09:23:20 PM »
WW2 Air Combat Veteran:  "this is what we did, it worked this way"

Aces high Cartoon Pilot:  "You dont know what your talking about old man, let me get my X-52 out and show you in this game I play"



Offline Karnak

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2009, 11:28:55 PM »
WW2 Air Combat Veteran:  "this is what we did, it worked this way"

Aces high Cartoon Pilot:  "You dont know what your talking about old man, let me get my X-52 out and show you in this game I play"



I really dislike your particular kind of buffoon.  People mistake what they see all the time.  They believe erroneous things all the time.  WWII vets are not demi-gods and they are not infallible.

Further, you denigrate the people who have studied the issue as "cartoon pilots" as though we are basing our opinions in any way on this game.

There were no Tigers destroyed by .50 cals.  It was impossible to do it the way our pilots thought they were doing it.  You cannot defy physics like that.  The post battle inspections at the time verify everything those of us in this thread have said about it not being possible.
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Offline DamnedRen

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #27 on: March 21, 2009, 11:46:00 PM »
Well I think if someone bails and the attacking plane gets to close to the chute then the chutist should be able to shoot and perhaps pilot wound the guy. That has been done...ya know. :noid

Offline JunkyII

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #28 on: March 22, 2009, 02:30:45 AM »
50 cals are able to penetrate steal, got to find it but saw a 50 light up a BMP and it caught fire
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Offline SectorNine50

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Re: p-47's kill Tigers
« Reply #29 on: March 22, 2009, 05:35:19 AM »
50 cals are able to penetrate steal, got to find it but saw a 50 light up a BMP and it caught fire
Were these modern armor piercing 50 cals?
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