Author Topic: Please give us LW gun selection..........  (Read 1321 times)

Offline SageFIN

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2001, 11:23:00 AM »
Just curious, if the Spit happens to be a one with machineguns and cannons, how could the selector switch give you an advantage over that? AFAIK a Spit pilot can choose between firing mgs, cannons or both at will.

Offline Glasses

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2001, 04:05:00 PM »
NO sage more firing individual cannons or pairs of cannons to fire. Means ammunition runs out a lot less faster and means not wasting the "special kind" in some la7.

Offline HoHun

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2001, 05:32:00 PM »
Hi Sage,

>Just curious, if the Spit happens to be a one with machineguns and cannons, how could the selector switch give you an advantage over that? AFAIK a Spit pilot can choose between firing mgs, cannons or both at will.

The Spitfire's trigger was a pneumatical valve situated on the steering yoke. Pushing down either end of the button would trigger MGs only respectively cannon only, pushing down the entire button would trigger both sets of weapons simultaneously.

(Why pneumatically triggered? It was much better than the WW1-style bowden cable trigger which would have some delay due to the elasticity of the cable. Cyclists will know that effect :-)

The Luftwaffe fighters used electrical triggers with "A-Knopf" and "B-Knopf" (trigger and pushbutton on top, respectively).

Later grips had even more buttons - the first hints of HOTAS :-) I'd speculate that these could be used for a third weapon set as well. (At least, one of them was used for air-to-ground ordnance.)

Willy Reschke's "JG 301/302" describes quite clearly attacks with 13 mm, 20 mm and 30 mm cannon fire each triggered at a certain distance to the target. I don't think he was manipulating circuit breakers in a switchbox while making a life-or-death gunnery pass at a Flying Fortress :-)

Alfred Price' "Fw 190 in Combat" describes Sturmgruppen attacks, including a failed one where a pilot doesn't get the weapons to fire since the heavily armed replacement plane he flew for the first time incorporated an additional arming switch in the gunnery circuit. Obviously, there was some freedom for the units to arrange electrics as required :-)

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

Offline Wilbus

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #18 on: November 08, 2001, 08:16:00 AM »
Allready exists to some extend in AH, only plane it works is the P51 D though, the thing is called "select weapon", by using it you can select wether you want to fire primary guns or the 4 guns with the secondary fire button in the P51. It's been there for as long as I can remember.

Verm, most A8's had it like that, although some had extra buttons etc that made it possible to chose other combinations, this was however, just for some planes and not all that was built.
Rasmus "Wilbus" Mattsson

Liberating Livestock since 1998, recently returned from a 5 year Sheep-care training camp.

Offline HoHun

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #19 on: November 09, 2001, 01:21:00 AM »
Hi Wilbus,

>Allready exists to some extend in AH, only plane it works is the P51 D though, the thing is called "select weapon", by using it you can select wether you want to fire primary guns or the 4 guns with the secondary fire button in the P51.

Historically, the pilot of the P-51D had no way of firing anything less than the full complement of weapons, which could be either 6 or (if the inboard guns were removed) 4 guns.

Here's a quote from the P-51 Pilot Training Manual:

"This manual isn't intended to give you instructions in gunnery, but here's a tip - before you take off on a gunnery mission, be sure your guns are correctly loaded and charged, and that you know how fully loaded they are. There's no way of counting the number of rounds once you're in the air."

(There was no way of charging the guns once in the air, either.)

Other American aircraft differed - in the FM-2 Wildcat for example, the pilot had remote gun charging handles for his 4 machine guns besides his seat, which he could use to charge individual guns or even to clear jams, albeit manually handling the 0.50"s probably detracted somewhat from flying. The pilot also could select either firing inboard, outboard, or both pairs of guns simultaneously by a seperate selector switches. He only had a single trigger, though.

The Luftwaffe's gunnery equipment was a bit more sophisticated: Their aircraft not only had individual triggers for the different weapons, but also graphical (sometimes numerical) ammunition couters, breech position indicators, electrical (or, like in the case of the MK108, pneumatical) charging mechanisms, and their guns automatically cleared jams as soon as the pilot released the associated fire button when the weapon stopped firing.

>Verm, most A8's had it like that, although some had extra buttons etc that made it possible to chose other combinations, this was however, just for some planes and not all that was built.

Since not all that were built featured the extra weapons, this makes sense :-)

Looking at the Fw 190A-8 stick grip, it's obvious that it features A-Knopf, B-Knopf, and B2-Knopf, which is addressed as "bomb release button". It would be logical to assume that on aircraft that were not intended to carry bombs, the B2-Knopf button was used to individually trigger the extra armament, like for example the 30 mm outboard cannon.

Regards,

Henning (HoHun)

Offline GRUNHERZ

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #20 on: November 09, 2001, 04:23:00 AM »
No wonder about the P51 guns......  :rolleyes:

Its easy to fix for the FW190 tho. Just set up the backspace key to do the following.

Trigger 1 can fire either 13mm MG131 / 7.9mm MG17 (like we have now) or the inboard pair of 20mm MG151 cannon.

Trigger 2 can fire all cannon (like we have now) or just the outer pair of cannon.


That should be very simple, HTC have allready done this on F4U1C, Typhoon, N1K2J, and Tempest. The 190 is the only multi wing cannon plane that cannot seperate its cannon fire on two different triggers and its prolly the only one in AH that really needs it and prolly the only one in RL with this degree of selection anyway.


Its clear that this needs a simple change.

Offline ra

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #21 on: November 09, 2001, 05:07:00 PM »
<<<Other American aircraft differed - in the FM-2 Wildcat for example, the pilot had remote gun charging handles>>>

All US carrier fighters had this arrangement.  They didn't want armorers charging the guns below decks where an accidental discharge could blow up the carrier.

ra

Offline fats

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Please give us LW gun selection..........
« Reply #22 on: November 11, 2001, 09:52:00 AM »
--- ra ---
They didn't want armorers charging the guns below decks where an accidental discharge could blow up the carrier.
--- end ---

That's some nasty Hispano damage model they had in WWII...


// fats