Defining bad game-play

[bmwgs]

so your saying this NOT lame game play, being the 4th or 5th in on a guy?

No, I'm not offering an opinion either way.  Your the one that took it upon themself to be the judge of what "lame" is.  It was your post and your words that I responded to. Your the one that puts words in someones mouth (in this case text), when they question one of your statements.  Do you read before you type?

I made a simple statement, and I will stand by it.  I have been picked by the biggest names in this game while engaged with more than two other cons.  Do I get upset over it?  Nope, I'm just stupid enough to up another plane and go back in for more.

Fred

[The Fugitive]

OK, lets go back a bit...

If you consider picking "lame" game play  Your list just got real short.

Fred 

I don't understand how one item mentioned (ganging, or being the 4th or more in on a target) would shorten my list of lame/poor game play? Remember we are tlaking about game play, not game PLAYERS.

I actually read quite well, and I stand by my post.  Your list will be very short even including what you stated in this post.

Fred

Again you post, basically the same post with out trying to clarify what your saying. The post where you made this quote I had clarified that any more in on a 3 on 1 is a lame play. So still not understanding what you mean I ask you strait out if you belive the statment is true? (being the 4th guy in), you replied...

No, I'm not offering an opinion either way.  Your the one that took it upon themself to be the judge of what "lame" is.  It was your post and your words that I responded to. Your the one that puts words in someones mouth (in this case text), when they question one of your statements.  Do you read before you type?

I made a simple statement, and I will stand by it.  I have been picked by the biggest names in this game while engaged with more than two other cons.  Do I get upset over it?  Nope, I'm just stupid enough to up another plane and go back in for more.

Fred

First off, if you have no opinion either way, why are you posting?

Second, I suggested a list of what I thought the majority of players would think are lame/poor game play I didn't try to put any words in your mouth, I just tried to get an idea of what you were trying to say.

Third, seeing as all of this is speculation, and opinion, you can say, and stand by anything you want. Unfortunately, your posts made no sense to me in relation to the quotes you quoted.

Lastly, we are discussing poor game play in this thread. While I agree there are some lame/poor game PLAYERS noobs and vets alike, its not what we are discussing. You said "I have been picked by the biggest names in this game while engaged with more than two other cons.  Do I get upset over it?  Nope, I'm just stupid enough to up another plane and go back in for more." You should get mad about it, its lame game play, and we don't need it. There are plenty of people playing this game to shoot down, tho I'm sure not to many of the are easier target than someone already busy with 2 or 3.

[bmwgs]

OK, lets go back a bit...

I don't understand how one item mentioned (ganging, or being the 4th or more in on a target) would shorten my list of lame/poor game play? Remember we are tlaking about game play, not game PLAYERS.

Game players, game play, can't have one without the other.  So in any discussion concerning game play, the way that players play the game would have to be included.

Again you post, basically the same post with out trying to clarify what your saying. The post where you made this quote I had clarified that any more in on a 3 on 1 is a lame play. So still not understanding what you mean I ask you strait out if you belive the statment is true? (being the 4th guy in), you replied...

Never really been the fourth guy in.  I have been in a group of 4 and even more after a single con.  Sort of works like this.  I spot a con, I start to engage the con, four others join in, I'm getting lined up for the shot, you think I am going to break off because 4 others decided to join in, not me, I will continue what I started.  I have no control over what other players do, so if 4,5, or even 20 want to join in when I am engaged with a con,  then there is nothing I can do about it.  Yet you would consider this lame play.  So be it, but if I had to break off every time a country man joins the fight, I would be flying in a lot of circles.

First off, if you have no opinion either way, why are you posting?

Because I want to.  Is there some rule that I'm not allowed to enter a opinion or make a statement concerning a post?

Second, I suggested a list of what I thought the majority of players would think are lame/poor game play I didn't try to put any words in your mouth, I just tried to get an idea of what you were trying to say.

Well, I thought I was very clear, but I guess I need to spell it out a bit more.  What I am and was saying is the very players you would put on your list, which I sure it would be some very prominent names, do the very things you call "lame".

Third, seeing as all of this is speculation, and opinion, you can say, and stand by anything you want. Unfortunately, your posts made no sense to me in relation to the quotes you quoted.

Can't help that, in my opinion I couldn't make it any clearer.

You right about not understanding the posts because your subject seems to change witht the wind  You speak of lame game play and then include ganging.  I am saying that nearly every one in this game including vets will pick if the opportunity is right, and it doesn't matter how many others are engaged.

Lastly, we are discussing poor game play in this thread. While I agree there are some lame/poor game PLAYERS noobs and vets alike, its not what we are discussing. You said "I have been picked by the biggest names in this game while engaged with more than two other cons.  Do I get upset over it?  Nope, I'm just stupid enough to up another plane and go back in for more." You should get mad about it, its lame game play, and we don't need it. There are plenty of people playing this game to shoot down, tho I'm sure not to many of the are easier target than someone already busy with 2 or 3.

Now you really have me confused,  what exactly are we discussing?  Since one goes with the other how can you exclude one?

Why should I get mad if I get picked or ganged by no matter how many.  It was my choice to up or engage, and it was my SA that was bad.  One other thing I don't get mad because of a game.  One has to keep it in perspective that this is a game, and only a game.

Fred

[falcon23]

I want to see an NOE mission with 12 110's,4 goons,and 6 nikis take a bish base..Thats a lucky NOE mission if it gets accomplished..

And if something was done different,say bombers at altitude,enough to take down base AND town,people would start saying something about that ruining their fun...But I bet there would not be many on the side which took the base complain,if any at all.

 And no fugitive,I was not using you as an example in my last post about people berating others on 200...I respect your opinion,I just dont agree with it whole heartedly.

[oTRALFZo]

I want to see an NOE mission with 12 110's,4 goons,and 6 nikis take a bish base..Thats a lucky NOE mission if it gets accomplished..

what would make this so hard?

[WMLute]

what would make this so hard?

No doubt.  The town would die in 30 seconds from the 110's alone and then cap. 
The niki's heavy could drop any nme GV's easy and cap.

No reason this wouldn't work.

[falcon23]

I didnt say it wouldnt work,but it  would be very difficult..

[The Fugitive]

.....snip

Well, I thought I was very clear, but I guess I need to spell it out a bit more.  What I am and was saying is the very players you would put on your list, which I sure it would be some very prominent names, do the very things you call "lame".

This is where we are having our communication break down. I never mentioned naming ANY players as lame.

.....snip

Since one goes with the other how can you exclude one?

Why should I get mad if I get picked or ganged by no matter how many.  It was my choice to up or engage, and it was my SA that was bad.  One other thing I don't get mad because of a game.  One has to keep it in perspective that this is a game, and only a game.

Fred

They most defiantly are not the same. Comparing game play, and game players is about the same as comparing apples and oranges. The only thing they have in common are that they are fruit. The same goes for game play and game players.

Game play can be changed, either by rule changes or community/peer pressure. With those changes yes some players will change, but I guaranty that there will ALWAYS be a number of lame game PLAYERS, they will never change. Their game IS to be lame, and nothing more.

You mentioned your senario for being the 4th guy on a bogie. You shouldn't be expected to pull off, nor should you accused of "lame play" the 3rd and most especially 4th guys in on that fight should be tho. Why shouldn't you have your fight? Why should you have to be worried about some loser coming in and stealing your kill? Doesn't it piss you off after fighting with some guy for 5 minutes and finally get him low E, on the deck and about to fall to the mercy of your guns and some one comes screaming in to clear your 12 oclock.?

I want to see an NOE mission with 12 110's,4 goons,and 6 nikis take a bish base..Thats a lucky NOE mission if it gets accomplished..

And if something was done different,say bombers at altitude,enough to take down base AND town,people would start saying something about that ruining their fun...But I bet there would not be many on the side which took the base complain,if any at all.

 And no fugitive,I was not using you as an example in my last post about people berating others on 200...I respect your opinion,I just dont agree with it whole heartedly.

LOL!!! I think with that many guys we could do run after run and take easily 80% of the bases attempted. 5 110s and a single goon would be enough for most bases. I remember we did "Lightning Strikes" missions. 8 38's fully loaded, and a goon. From dar circle to capture our best time was under 3 minutes.

[1Boner]

No doubt.  The town would die in 30 seconds from the 110's alone and then cap. 
The niki's heavy could drop any nme GV's easy and cap.

No reason this wouldn't work.

Don't forget to include the fact that somebody might actually up and "foil" said NOE.

Personally, I watch the map for those kind of shenanigins all the time.

Upping against an NOE or a CV attack is one of my favorite things to do in this game.

So, I keep my eyes on the map.

And I'm not alone.

[oTRALFZo]

I didnt say it wouldnt work,but it  would be very difficult..

Im not understanding, if what your saying is that its harder to do at a "bish" base. or any base. (looking for fish hooks in this statement somehow).
I can see bish base because they have the highest percentage of real estate grabbers and protecters. Most the time, rook/nit dont care about the real estate part of the deal so thats why you rarely see this pulled off. I think the attitude is just that we only really need 1 base to up and have a good time.
I just certainly hope that your not under any dilusional conceptions that it takes more than that to NOE anything. (22 per mission )
??

[1Boner]

I can see bish base because they have the highest percentage of real estate grabbers and protecters. Most the time, rook/nit dont care about the real estate part of the deal so thats why you rarely see this pulled off.
??

I don't believe that for a minute!!

On any given night, it could be ANY side goin apechit taking bases!

And on occasion, its an unstopable force.

Every side does it.

I see it ALL the time.

I believe you're mistaken.

I think they care.

I think they care alot!

[bmwgs]

This is where we are having our communication break down. I never mentioned naming ANY players as lame.

You are correct.  I have no problem admitting when I make a mistake. 

I went back and saw that I misread your sentence concerning "the list".  My apology to you sir. 

Then again the list of lame tactics you mention that you could make of what most players would consider lame, those "most" player uses those same lame tactics on a fairly regular basis.

They most defiantly are not the same. Comparing game play, and game players is about the same as comparing apples and oranges. The only thing they have in common are that they are fruit. The same goes for game play and game players.

 

Can't agree here.  In an interactive game such as Aces High, you can't have one without the other.  I would agree with your statement in games where it's person vs computer, but not this game, or similar games to this one.

Game play can be changed, either by rule changes or community/peer pressure. With those changes yes some players will change, but I guaranty that there will ALWAYS be a number of lame game PLAYERS, they will never change. Their game IS to be lame, and nothing more.

You mentioned your scenario for being the 4th guy on a bogie. You shouldn't be expected to pull off, nor should you accused of "lame play" the 3rd and most especially 4th guys in on that fight should be tho. Why shouldn't you have your fight? Why should you have to be worried about some loser coming in and stealing your kill? Doesn't it piss you off after fighting with some guy for 5 minutes and finally get him low E, on the deck and about to fall to the mercy of your guns and some one comes screaming in to clear your 12 oclock.?

I'm not sure a game can be changed by peer pressure alone.  In my opinion, I would think a rules(s) change would have to go along with it. 

I get my kills stolen all the time.  Do I get mad, no, not really, sometimes it can be a bit frustrating, but then again its a game, and I always try to keep that perspective.  Then again, I try to steal certain squad mates kills whenever I can.   

 

Fred

[oTRALFZo]

I don't believe that for a minute!!

On any given night, it could be ANY side goin apechit taking bases!

And on occasion, its an unstopable force.

Every side does it.

I see it ALL the time.

I believe you're mistaken.

I think they care.

I think they care alot!

They do, but they dont..It depends all on what type of mood theyre in when it comes to protecting. Most often I notice is noone would say a word sometimes if a base gets taken.

As far as every country doing the NOE thing? When I was breiefly back fighting on the bish side, I swear you wouldnt go more than 15 mins without someone posting some mission. I noticed nits would do it really late at night. Rooks and Nits usually though, you can go an entire weekend without seeing 1 mission planner up.

[thndregg]

I'm not sure a game can be changed by peer pressure alone.  In my opinion, I would think a rules(s) change would have to go along with it. 

Agree. Otherwise this topic would no longer be resurrected every week.

[The Fugitive]

You are correct.  I have no problem admitting when I make a mistake. 

I went back and saw that I misread your sentence concerning "the list".  My apology to you sir. 

Accepted, and no problem. Misunderstandings happen in discussions all the time.

Then again the list of lame tactics you mention that you could make of what most players would consider lame, those "most" player uses those same lame tactics on a fairly regular basis.

Agreed, most people have fallen into the "Well if they are going to HO everytime, So am I!" attitude.

Can't agree here.  In an interactive game such as Aces High, you can't have one without the other.  I would agree with your statement in games where it's person vs computer, but not this game, or similar games to this one.

See the above reply. I don't think I'm a lame game player, and police myself very closely, however You can catch me doing lame things now and then when I get fed up and its about time to log. 

I'm not sure a game can be changed by peer pressure alone.  In my opinion, I would think a rules(s) change would have to go along with it. 

Oh I think it could change with peer pressure alone. There haven't been any real rule changes in years, but the game play has definitely changed.

I get my kills stolen all the time.  Do I get mad, no, not really, sometimes it can be a bit frustrating, but then again its a game, and I always try to keep that perspective.  Then again, I try to steal certain squad mates kills whenever I can.   

 

Fred

Stealing a squad mate kill is something all together different  However, picture a newb, been flying for a few weeks. Starting to get the hang of things, but 90% of his kills are getting stolen when ever he flys. How frustrating do you think it would be to him/her not having your experience to keep that "perspective"? How many people cancel their subscription due to the frustrations lame game play causes?