Hurri IId HE Ammo?

[Nashwan]

Will the Hurricane IId get the option of HE shells for the 40mm cannon, as these were used historically?

[GRUNHERZ]

I bet it will get the "Hispano" 2 in 1 round we have now. Basically FULL HE shell ability and FULL AP shell ability in every sigle bullet.

[SKurj]

The 2lb'er (gun in hurri) will be nasty... the AP round has better penetration values than the German 37mm.
It SHOULD have selectable ammo, or just one or the other.  The difference in damage effects between the two rounds is quite large.

SKurj

[pugg666]

we're getting the IIc, not the IId
quad hispanoes in that crate, not 40's

[Karnak]

pugg666, We're getting both:

 

[Staga]

Only 15 rounds/cannon= Not much

[Jochen]

If it fires same round as standard 2 pounder used in tank, it should not have HE rounds at all. Even at the later part of war, 2 pdr didn't have HE rounds in wide use.

[pugg666]

pugg666, We're getting both:

cool, karnak are the d's pic posted on dogfighter.com as well?

[edit]
i just rechecked the news forum....how did i miss that post??

hehe

[ 08-16-2001: Message edited by: pugg666 ]

[Nashwan]

Jochen, got this from Tony Williams website at http://www.users.globalnet.co.uk/~autogun/sgun.htm
 

The Vickers Class "S" 40 mm gun was developed in the late 1930s as an aircraft weapon. The ammunition was based on the 40x158R cartridge case of the naval 2 pdr AA gun. The weapon was a long-recoil design derived from the 37 mm 1½pdr C.O.W. gun.The gun was originally intended as a bomber defensive weapon and was tested as such in a turret fitted to a modified Vickers Wellington II. This was not adopted for service, but when the need to attack tanks from the air was identified the "S" gun was chosen and special AP ammunition developed.

In 1944 the aircraft served in the Far East, mainly firing HE ammunition against road and river transport.

Tests in the Far East showed a high level of accuracy, with an average of 25% of shots fired at tanks striking the target. Attacks with HE were twice as accurate as with AP, possibly because the ballistics were a closer match with the .303" Brownings used for sighting (the HE shell was lighter and was fired at a higher velocity).

[Lephturn]

Gee Grunherz... good thing it doesn't have those magical 3-in-1 rounds the mausers have huh?  You know, AP/HE/Mine.  It's not just the Hispanos that get that treatment... it's all the guns.

Lephturn

[SKurj]

Lephturn....

If the JU87G appears in AH it probably will have AP/HE rounds +)
All German AP ammunition over 20mm I believe was AP with a small HE charge.  I cannot confirm whether or not this applies to the Stuka weapons or not, perhaps Tony can shed some light.
This also should apply to the PzIV!!

I'd also be curious as to the penetration values of the 40mm, and the 37mm German gun.  Curious how much difference aircraft speed might make..
Otherwise, neither the 40 or the 37 will ever penetrate any later war tanks.

SKurj

[GRUNHERZ]

LOL

Lephturn I bet you wish the mineshell was modeled in AH. It has something like double or more  the HE capability of the Hispano HE shell plus its lighter than other Mg151 shells so has higher velocity.

And the AH Mg151 was confirmed in tests to not even have any form of  AP round. The full 500 round 20mm ammo load of an FW190 was fired on the 20mm thick Panzer IV rear armor at less than 50ft range on the ground and no damage occured to panzer, not even the engine.

It appears that only the basic HE shell is in the AH Mg151, you know, the one with much less HE than the Hispano HE round.


Oh well.....  

[Nashwan]

The 2½ lb AP shot first used in the "S" gun could penetrate 47 mm / 360 m /30 degrees, the later 3 lb shot improving this by 9%. These figures appear surprisingly high, given the low muzzle velocity, until it is remembered that the velocity of the firing aircraft must be added to that of the shot. In the case of a 240 mph attack speed, this amounts to 107 m/s. In practice, "S" gun penetration was probably even better than this, as the usual firing distance was about 150 m

From the same link to Tony Williams' website I posted earlier.
Should be able to penetrate panzer IV from any direction, panther from sides/rear.

[GRUNHERZ]

Yes and no on frontal penetration Nashwan. The PzIV H had 80mm (50+30) frontal armor.

The other thing to add is impact angle and of curse firing distance.

Anyway who cares what the RL ability was with our "unique"   new armor model. PzIV is allready easy to kill with bombs,rockets, Yak9T, and IL2, not to mention ostwind, M3, and the best tank killer the M16.

What we need is something to kill the osti and the M16 easily, im not sure if the Hurri IID is it, but I hope is.

[Jigster]

Funny, the Bofors was a multi-purpose gun and it didn't get selectable ammunition.

[ 08-16-2001: Message edited by: Jigster ]