Author Topic: My own airplane  (Read 1571 times)

Offline Enker

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1553
My own airplane
« on: April 17, 2009, 04:19:19 PM »
If I wanted to design my very own airplane and built it, what all should I know/specify/have to build one? Also, where could I learn more about how airfoils affect flight?
InGame ID: Cairn
Quote from: BillyD topic=283300.msg3581799#msg3581799
... FOR TEH MUPPET$ TO PAD OUR SCO?E N to WIN TEH EPIC WAR OF TEH UNIVERSE We MUST VULTCHE DA RUNWAYZ N DROP UR GUYZ FIGHTERZ Bunkarz Then OUR SKWAD will Finarry Get TACTICAL NOOK for 25 KILL SCORE  STREAK>X

Offline Baumer

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1739
      • 332nd Flying Mongrels
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2009, 05:41:41 PM »

NOTE: This is only a joke




In all seriousness this is a very broad question and their is no easy answer. If you are really serious about designing and building your own aircraft, you may want to start with the EAA.

http://www.eaa.org/homebuilders/

There are others' here that can give you good advice and direction as well.

Good luck,
Baumer
HTC Please show the blue planes some love!
F4F-4, FM2, SBD-5, TBM-3

Offline Nemisis

  • Persona Non Grata
  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4086
      • Fightin 49'ers
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2009, 05:56:19 PM »
I would agree with Baumer on most points but be carefull about your info and try to get an independet oppinion as one screw up can ruin the whole thing :noid. Fly high and may you never run out of gas :salute!
All man needs to be happy is a home, his wife, and a place in the world

Col. 49Nem, Armor commander of the 49th

Offline MiloMorai

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6864

Offline hitech

  • Administrator
  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12425
      • http://www.hitechcreations.com
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2009, 06:23:01 PM »
If I wanted to design my very own airplane and built it, what all should I know/specify/have to build one? Also, where could I learn more about how airfoils affect flight?

Question 1. What do you want to use the plane for?

Question 2. Do you have any type of back ground in mechanical engineering?

HiTech

Offline BnZs

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4207
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2009, 06:54:34 PM »
If I wanted to design my very own airplane and built it, what all should I know/specify/have to build one? Also, where could I learn more about how airfoils affect flight?

If you wanted to build something you are actually going to fly in, I would *strongly* suggest plagiarizing someone else's design. :D If you want to get innovative, try RC.

The X-Plane series is kind of fun if you want an easy-to-use interface for fooling around with modifying airplanes and flying them in a sim.
"Crikey, sir. I'm looking forward to today. Up diddly up, down diddly down, whoops, poop, twiddly dee - decent scrap with the fiendish Red Baron - bit of a jolly old crash landing behind enemy lines - capture, torture, escape, and then back home in time for tea and medals."

Offline Enker

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1553
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2009, 09:20:35 PM »
Question 1. What do you want to use the plane for? I plan on just flying it for fun, maybe taking up kids at the county fairs for a ride, as it beats lawn mowing.

Question 2. Do you have any type of back ground in mechanical engineering? None at all.

HiTech

If you wanted to build something you are actually going to fly in, I would *strongly* suggest plagiarizing someone else's design. :D If you want to get innovative, try RC.

The X-Plane series is kind of fun if you want an easy-to-use interface for fooling around with modifying airplanes and flying them in a sim.
I think I will try out RC planes first, because shop class isn't really a "safe" class to take at my school...


Thank you all for your replies! You will probably see me flying my monstrosity a week before we get the F-15.

 :salute
InGame ID: Cairn
Quote from: BillyD topic=283300.msg3581799#msg3581799
... FOR TEH MUPPET$ TO PAD OUR SCO?E N to WIN TEH EPIC WAR OF TEH UNIVERSE We MUST VULTCHE DA RUNWAYZ N DROP UR GUYZ FIGHTERZ Bunkarz Then OUR SKWAD will Finarry Get TACTICAL NOOK for 25 KILL SCORE  STREAK>X

Offline Banshee7

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6644
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2009, 09:23:15 PM »
because shop class isn't really a "safe" class to take at my school...

There's more sex, fights, and other nonsense in our vocational building at our school than actual learning  :lol
Tours 86 - 296

Offline B4Buster

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4816
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2009, 09:30:24 PM »
shop class?  :O

get your diploma first.

As far as building models go...it's an excellent hobby. About 13 years ago my father and I built a R/C P-51 mustang. It was 4 1/2 feet long or so...man that thing was a beauty. We took it to an R/C plane club (bunch of geeks) for its first flight. Two minutes into the flight it crashes and shatterd into 100 pieces   :(. Spending time with my father was well worth it though!
« Last Edit: April 17, 2009, 09:33:41 PM by B4Buster »
"I was a door gunner on the space shuttle Columbia" - Scott12B

Offline Stoney

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3482
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2009, 01:31:39 AM »
Enker,

I'm currently about a year and a half into designing a Formula 1 racer for Reno.  I'll give you two books you should look at first:

1)  Simplified Aircraft Design for Homebuilders by Dr. Dan Ramer.  This book costs about $15 or so, and will give you a sneak peak at design analysis and some of the factors inherent in the design process.  Dr. Ramer states plainly that the book is merely an introduction and references many more detailed books for specific design elements.  Work through this book over the course of a couple days, and if you like what you've read so far, go to step two...

2)  Aircraft Design, A Conceptual Approach, 4th Edition also by Dr. Dan Ramer.  This book will run you around $100 and is a textbook quality resource that's used for design classes for Aerodynamic Engineering students.  One of the classes I found that uses this book is a Masters degree capstone course, so its for real.  This book is the meat and potatoes of what was glossed over in the first book.  Strap on your Math Hat, and dust off the calculator and MS Excel, because you're getting ready to do math that (unless you were a math or engineering major) is going to knock your socks off.  Once you get through this book (over the course of a few months) you will have merely scratched the surface of the design process.  Once your design is conceptually complete, you begin the more difficult parts of actually analyzing how to turn your drawing on paper into an actual prototype.

What I'll say is that this stuff is not a casual excercise.  It is not impossible for the lay person to do as evidenced by Peter Garrison's Melmoth aircraft.  But, I'll tell you that you're going to invest a considerable amount of time and money simply doing analysis, lofting the drawings, Computational Fluid Dynamic (CFD) Modeling, Finite Element Analysis (FEA) Modeling for the structural portions, etc.  At some point though, you will have to find outside help, and that costs a lot of money.  Since my design is going to be completely carbon fiber, kevlar and kevlar honeycomb, it was going to demand outside fabrication as well, since you can't do that stuff in your garage.

Ultimately, even if I never build the thing, I have learned an unbelievable amount of stuff about aircraft, aerodynamics, materials, etc.  So, in that vein, its an awesome thing to get into, but just realize that its a whole lot of work, time, energy, and money to go from concept to finished aircraft.   
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline Enker

  • Silver Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 1553
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2009, 03:29:59 PM »
Enker,

I'm currently about a year and a half into designing a Formula 1 racer for Reno.  I'll give you two books you should look at first:

1)  Simplified Aircraft Design for Homebuilders by Dr. Dan Ramer.  This book costs about $15 or so, and will give you a sneak peak at design analysis and some of the factors inherent in the design process.  Dr. Ramer states plainly that the book is merely an introduction and references many more detailed books for specific design elements.  Work through this book over the course of a couple days, and if you like what you've read so far, go to step two...

2)  Aircraft Design, A Conceptual Approach, 4th Edition also by Dr. Dan Ramer.  This book will run you around $100 and is a textbook quality resource that's used for design classes for Aerodynamic Engineering students.  One of the classes I found that uses this book is a Masters degree capstone course, so its for real.  This book is the meat and potatoes of what was glossed over in the first book.  Strap on your Math Hat, and dust off the calculator and MS Excel, because you're getting ready to do math that (unless you were a math or engineering major) is going to knock your socks off.  Once you get through this book (over the course of a few months) you will have merely scratched the surface of the design process.  Once your design is conceptually complete, you begin the more difficult parts of actually analyzing how to turn your drawing on paper into an actual prototype.

What I'll say is that this stuff is not a casual excercise.  It is not impossible for the lay person to do as evidenced by Peter Garrison's Melmoth aircraft.  But, I'll tell you that you're going to invest a considerable amount of time and money simply doing analysis, lofting the drawings, Computational Fluid Dynamic (CFD) Modeling, Finite Element Analysis (FEA) Modeling for the structural portions, etc.  At some point though, you will have to find outside help, and that costs a lot of money.  Since my design is going to be completely carbon fiber, kevlar and kevlar honeycomb, it was going to demand outside fabrication as well, since you can't do that stuff in your garage.

Ultimately, even if I never build the thing, I have learned an unbelievable amount of stuff about aircraft, aerodynamics, materials, etc.  So, in that vein, its an awesome thing to get into, but just realize that its a whole lot of work, time, energy, and money to go from concept to finished aircraft.   
Thank you for the resources, I just wanted something to do over the summer that had math in it, but I guess the project will be a wee bit longer than a summer.  :salute
InGame ID: Cairn
Quote from: BillyD topic=283300.msg3581799#msg3581799
... FOR TEH MUPPET$ TO PAD OUR SCO?E N to WIN TEH EPIC WAR OF TEH UNIVERSE We MUST VULTCHE DA RUNWAYZ N DROP UR GUYZ FIGHTERZ Bunkarz Then OUR SKWAD will Finarry Get TACTICAL NOOK for 25 KILL SCORE  STREAK>X

Offline Stoney

  • Gold Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3482
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2009, 03:38:37 PM »
Also, I forgot to add a resource on airfoils...

First, the veritable bible of airfoils is Theory of Wing Sections by Abbot and Von Doenhoff.  It presents just about all NACA airfoil research in one book, complete with all the math behind it.

If you're looking for a very short and interesting commentary on airfoil performance, I heartily suggest GA Airfoils by Harry Riblett.  He criticizes some of the original NACA and current NASA research and presents some of his own methods of designing airfoils--great stuff in this short resource.
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline Blake7

  • Zinc Member
  • *
  • Posts: 37
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #12 on: May 20, 2009, 02:42:16 PM »
shop class?  :O

get your diploma first.

As far as building models go...it's an excellent hobby. About 13 years ago my father and I built a R/C P-51 mustang. It was 4 1/2 feet long or so...man that thing was a beauty. We took it to an R/C plane club (bunch of geeks) for its first flight. Two minutes into the flight it crashes and shatterd into 100 pieces   :(. Spending time with my father was well worth it though!

i have had 6 home built r/c's through my life The first i had was a Pitts Special  in "Rothmans Aerobatics Display Team" livery.
Wir sind die schwarzen Husaren der Luft,
Die Stukas, die Stukas, die Stukas!
Immer bereit, wenn der Einsatz uns ruft,
Die Stukas, die Stukas, die Stukas!

Offline Angus

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10057
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2009, 10:27:02 AM »
It was very interesting to carry out the flight trials at Rechlin with the Spitfire and the Hurricane. Both types are very simple to fly compared to our aircraft, and childishly easy to take-off and land. (Werner Mölders)

Offline BaldEagl

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 10791
Re: My own airplane
« Reply #14 on: May 21, 2009, 07:05:00 PM »
Thank you for the resources, I just wanted something to do over the summer that had math in it, but I guess the project will be a wee bit longer than a summer.  :salute

 :rofl  I'm pretty sure that's right especially if you're going to design it too. 

My oldest brother (almost) built an airplane once but I think he was working off someone elses blueprints.  He cut and formed all the pieces out of sheet metals of some sort.  There were parts lying all over around his garage for a couple of years as he slowly made progress.  All the major components were pretty much complete when he gave up and sold it.  Not sure if whoever bought it ever got it finished and flying or not.

Now he's got a basement full of RC's.
« Last Edit: May 21, 2009, 07:06:39 PM by BaldEagl »
I edit a lot of my posts.  Get used to it.