Out-of-Range Kill Recording *Dons the Flame-proof PJs*

[Saxman]

Well, this will probably earn some flames, but here we go:

You only receive credit for a kill if the plane you shot down remains within your visual range.

This has a historical precedent, as confirmed kills were only rewarded when someone actually saw the plane go down. Anything else was generally only considered a probable (in the US forces. IIRC, the Germans didn't award "probables." It was either a confirmed kill or it wasn't).

If you damage an enemy aircraft (fuel, engine or wing) you don't get credit for the kill when he bails or augers if you don't stay within visual dot range. This would help cut down on incidents where an enemy aircraft is completely flyable, you saw his wing off, but someone half a sector away gets the kill instead because he caused more damage to the component than you. If he's out of visual range he still gets the death/bail/captured, but you just don't get credited with the victory. Because frankly, it's silly to put some holes in a plane and fly away, only to receive another kill three minutes into your landing approach.

[ScottyK]

 Im all for that but most people will not because it will be considered to ''realistic''.    To tweek what u have suggested i say u have to LOG your kills in the tower (a menu with all vehicle/plane types listed and checkoff which type and how many) and those go towards your score if you in fact care about that.

[Ghosth]

Think it through, this is just going to further encourage timid flying.

Doesn't matter HOW badly shot up you are, if you can get clear, he won't get the kill.

[stodd]

-1.

[AWwrgwy]

Do I get credit for the plane that I shot off half a wing that I see plummeting to the ground but somehow manages, out of my sight, to pull out and land with his damage?

I'm sure my "gun camera film" shows half a wing coming off. 

"There's no way he could have survived...."

My wingman saw it too.

 


wrongway

[Saxman]

Think it through, this is just going to further encourage timid flying.

Doesn't matter HOW badly shot up you are, if you can get clear, he won't get the kill.

On the flip side, it would encourage people to stick around because you'd have to actually stay in the fight to get the kill credit.

[trigger2]

On the flip side, it would encourage people to stick around because you'd have to actually stay in the fight to get the kill credit.

I agree, the issue with this would be the person 1/2 a sector away getting the 1 magic shot to the wing after you fill the pilot with 20mms and somehow... they don't die... The damage modeling/kill modeling is whack, and we all know it, but it seems that there's no perfect way as of late to get it just right. I DO think though that this would be an improvement to what we already have, so I give my support. +1

[Flipperk]

What about bomber pilots? If your flying at 30K at 150MPH and you knock a WHOLE wing off a plane and he doesnt bail but just falls till he hits the ground...you would be well out of range of him and wont get the kill...

[Saxman]

Modifications could be made for clear fatal damage (IE: fire yes, smoke no). The point is to stop guys from being credited on kills when they're well out of the fight (as in the specific case I mentioned: putting a few rounds into a wing that ends up hanging by a thread. You leave the area while his plane is still perfectly flyable and he continues fighting, and someone else finishes him off with a snapshot. You're gone, but you get the kill).

After thinking about it, I also disagree with Ghost that it would encourage timid flying. I don't think a guy who would break off after having his engine smoked or half a wing shot off is timid. I find nothing wrong with a guy with a fuel or radiator leak, missing a flap or any other control surface that makes his plane difficult if not impossible to control in combat looking for an opening to get out. A timid pilot seeks to avoid being in this situation to BEGIN with. If you get hit it's more often because you're actually COMMITTED to the fight (or you try to run away from someone in a co-alt state who has a faster plane....) This would actually do more to DISCOURAGE those timid types, because then they can't get kills in their stratospheric Tempests and Runstangs by making one high speed pass and running away.

[Guppy35]

As one who has been in some seriously wrecked planes that I've either managed to get on the ground, or I've been so low and slow that my crash didn't cause an explosion, I do tend to believe it evens out in the end.

Nothing funnier then having 10 guys shooting me to pieces at 0 feet, lose or clip a wing on the ground, roll it into a ball, end up upside down and in flames but no kill because I was too slow to blow up

[Saxman]

As one who has been in some seriously wrecked planes that I've either managed to get on the ground, or I've been so low and slow that my crash didn't cause an explosion, I do tend to believe it evens out in the end.

I don't think your landing technique is applicable to this discussion.

[Chalenge]

-1

If I shoot a 262 in the head but he can still fly well enough to get out of visual range he is still headshot and the history of gun film doesnt matter.

[Halo46]

There are just too many variables as I can see. Just the other day I bounced an F4U who didn't see me because he was focused on a set of Lancs. I came in and put a burst into his belly flaming him. In real life he probably would have bailed immediately and I would probably have a kill based on gun camera footage. He may, however, had tried to dive and extinguish the flames since he was around 12k, though I doubt he would have been successful. I didn't follow this guy to the deck and he managed to get a ditch. I am okay with that because I chose not to follow him down to give the coup-de-grace since he was near his fleet. One of those lucky escapes that just happen. I have no problem not getting the kill, it was the bounce that made me more excited.

[AWwrgwy]

Question:

Is the OP's concern with someone getting credit for a plane that runs away and subsequently crashes (delayed kill) or not getting credit when a plane runs away and is "killed" by someone else and the someone else (the OP) only gets an assist?

Doesn't really matter.  Just looking for motivation.


wrongway

[Saxman]

Question:

Is the OP's concern with someone getting credit for a plane that runs away and subsequently crashes (delayed kill) or not getting credit when a plane runs away and is "killed" by someone else and the someone else (the OP) only gets an assist?

Doesn't really matter.  Just looking for motivation.


wrongway

I'm pretty sure my intent was clear: to stop situations where you shoot up a plane and YOU leave the area, but still get the kill after you're a sector away. I've been on both sides of this: I've put fire into a guy who remains perfectly flyable and for whatever reason I'm unable to finish him off (out of fuel and need to RTB so can't press the attack. Can't press due to enemy numbers or positioning, etc) and egress out of the fight. A minute away from landing all the sudden I get the kill after someone else finishes him off. I've also sawed the wing off a plane that showed absolutely no external sign of damage (no missing parts, no smoking, etc) and some guy 25 miles away got the kill because he put a single 30mm round in that only knocked him down to a handful "hitpoints" left on the wing but did no other damage.