Late War Uberplanes

[SpyHawk]

Just weighing in on the late war (prop)Uberplanes debate.

I say give the Luftwaffe their Dora-9.
I say give the RAF their Spit XIV.
But I also say
Give the Japanese their Ki-100.
Give the USN/MC their F4U-4 (let the player choose between cannon and MG armament in the hangar).

[indian]

F8F  

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Tommy (INDIAN) Toon
Member Of The 1st Aces High Trainer Corps.
Everthing else is just Second place.
Indian's Homepage

[funked]

Ki-100 was not superior in performance to the Ki-44 except at high altitude.  You might want a Ki-84.  

[SpyHawk]

Well, that's fine. I say let the Japanese players, and/or players who fly or would fly predominantly Japanese planes choose which one they want. My only restrictions I'd say are that it would have to have been produced and entered squadron service AND seen combat.

[Spritle]

Since the Ki-84 was the 3rd most produced fighter by Japan during the war I think it more than qualifies.  

[Zigrat]

No Cannon armorment for the f4u-4
no
just say no
no
just say no

This way, people who choose to fly the c hog wil be outflown and run down like dogs by their f4u-4 counterparts  

[juzz]

Hello?! WarBirds already went through the whole "cannons on the F4U-4" thing...

And how about giving the Russians a late-war uberplane? Like the La-7R.  

[Toad]

Wonder how many LW guys would fly a Dora with a six MG/no cannon gun pkg.  

[SnakeEyes]

Most LW pilots wouldn't know what to do with 6x50s.  

"What, you mean I have to get more than three or four hits?!?  Blasphemer!!"  

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SnakeEyes
o-o-o-
=4th Fighter Group=

[gatt]

Give axis fiters the same laser-modeled machine gun then ... and no one will whine  

In RL 2x12,7mm Breda-SAFAT were enuff to shoot down Hurricanes and P40s ....

 

[Toad]

Gatt,

Perhaps you can give us a comparison of the ballistic data for the US .50 cal and the Bredas?

Muzzle Velocity, Projectile Weight, Drop at various ranges?

I'd like to see the stats side by side.

[Nashwan]

I don't know if the question is mischievous or not, but here are some stats. From http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/8217/fgun/fgun-pe.html
Browning .50 M2 12.7 x 99 (48.5 g) 750 rpm  870 m/s  30 kg
MG 131  13 x 64B (34.6 g) 900 rpm  730 m/s  17 kg
Breda-SAFAT  12.7 x 81SR (36.7 g) 700 rpm  760 m/s  29 kg
UBK  12.7 x 108 (48 g)  1050 rpm  850 m/s  21 kg

[gatt]

Nash data are quite correct. What actually isnt possible to model is the reliability of the Breda-SAFAT. Those 12,7mm were very difficult to jam and were very reliable even in the difficult North African theatre. Moreover, the a/p, tracer, incendiary mix of the Breda was lethal and the gun looked like a lite 15mm cannon more than a simple heavy MG.

[Toad]

 

Originally posted by Nashwan:

Browning .50 M2 12.7 x 99 (48.5 g) 750 rpm  870 m/s  30 kg

Breda-SAFAT  12.7 x 81SR (36.7 g) 700 rpm  760 m/s  29 kg

Nope, not mischievious.

I just figured maybe he knew something I didn't know, which is quite easy to do!

What I see here is that the Breda fires a significantly lighter slug at a significantly lower muzzle velocity.

Generally that would indicate that the .50 would significantly outperform the Breda.

However, you need the ballistic coefficients of the projectiles as well to get a more inclusive picture that would show trajectory differences as well.

[Gorf]

I say the requirements be produced and entered squadron service AND in route to the front... not nescesarily seen combat.