Author Topic: History Buffs: Question for you!  (Read 1795 times)

Offline kilo2

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #60 on: June 20, 2009, 06:17:50 PM »
It was there but didnt engage any ships it with the rest of the japenese fleet fled after the 4 carriers were sunk.
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Offline AWwrgwy

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #61 on: June 20, 2009, 07:31:50 PM »
It was there but didnt engage any ships it with the rest of the japenese fleet fled after the 4 carriers were sunk.

Well, I know.  But it was there.

 :aok

On the other hand, the Mushashi, sister ship to Yamoto, was sunk by airpower while heading to Leyte.  It took seventeen bomb and nineteen torpedoes hits to do her in.


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Offline Masherbrum

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #62 on: June 20, 2009, 08:14:54 PM »
Well Masherbum wasnt intentional but funny none the less. Lets imagine You say the "Iowa class ships were the pride" and I say "the washington saw 10x combat. But i guess".   :rofl What would you assume? Maybe you dont have a damn clue what you are saying :O

You're the child calling others names (that's twice you've done it).   Imagine yourself reading a book.   The HMS Hood is NOT A "Battleship" but was included, negating "the original poster's idea in the first place". 
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Offline Masherbrum

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #63 on: June 20, 2009, 08:16:08 PM »
It was there but didnt engage any ships it with the rest of the japenese fleet fled after the 4 carriers were sunk.

So you argue the USS Washington and then try to use the same "argument against Wrgway"?  We got it. 
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Offline Guppy35

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #64 on: June 20, 2009, 08:24:23 PM »
Twice. It saw combat twice. You can almost say 3 times cause He was torpedoed by USS Skate in Dec. '43 and had to return to Truk for repairs. From there He was at The Battle of The Philippine Sea in June '44 where Yamato fired its guns for the first time in anger. Unfortunately it was their own fighters the Yamato fired at. In Oct. '44 the Yamato again saw action in The Battle of Samar where the first day it was attacked by aircraft and the 2nd day Yamato engaged the Taffy-3 task group and Yamato was credited with sinking an escort CV and a Destroyer. Had yamato stayed on course and finished the fight it would probably have ended up a shooting duel with a Yank Iowa class BB. However Yamato was damaged and the IJN withdrew it. This was the only surface action the BB ever got into.

Of course last was Operation Ten-Ichi-Go where Yamato got all blowed up at and sunk. Its true tho for most of the war it was a floating hotel. Its sister BB even more so. Musashi's only combat action was as a floating target for USN dive bombers and Torpedo planes.

Yamato actually had its share of sea time but the IJN was awfully conservative about losing it. When they started losing their large fleet CVs they became even more leery because they knew they just couldnt protect the thing from Allied air power. They kept adding AA guns to its Hull but even this didnt protect the Yamato that much. http://combinedfleet.com/yamato.htm

Yamato actually didn't do much of anything against Taffy 3 as it changed course to avoid 3 torpedos from the USS Herrmann and took itself out of the fight.  It didn't sink anything and spent a lot of time dodging FM2s and TBMs.  It did not sink Gambier Bay, Johnston, Hoel or Samual B Roberts.  The Fast Battleships of the USN were with Halsey too far away to do any good.  Had Yamato kept coming it probably would have been the BBs of Olendorf including the rebuilt Pearl survivors that would have been shooting at it.  Hard to say how that would have gone as US fire control radars were quite good.  West Virginia scored on her first salvos at 22,000 yards at night when Olendorf crossed the T against the Japanese fleet in Surigo Straits
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Offline Selino631

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #65 on: June 20, 2009, 10:13:46 PM »
what about the Italian Navy?
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Offline Rino

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #66 on: June 20, 2009, 10:22:08 PM »
     They were great at stopping British torps and cruiser shells :)
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Offline Guppy35

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #67 on: June 20, 2009, 11:49:54 PM »
what about the Italian Navy?

If you are serious, I'd suggest some research into the Washington Naval Treaty of 1922 and the London Naval Treaty of 1930 and then 1936.  Italy was one of the countries involved along with the US, England, France and Japan.

The arms race before nukes was capital ships.  You projected power and were a player if you had the navy to back it up.
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Offline kilo2

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #68 on: June 21, 2009, 08:12:09 AM »
You're the child calling others names (that's twice you've done it).  Imagine yourself reading a book.  The HMS Hood is NOT A "Battleship" but was included, negating "the original poster's idea in the first place". 

I said Masherbum Wasn't intentional. That means I didn't mean to do it. It was a typo a funny typo. The Hood was a battleship just because the English called it a BattleCrusier doesn't really mean anything. It was around The Same Tonnage as a Iowa Class Ship and only one foot Shorter. The main difference between a battlecrusier and a battle ship was speed the Hood went just as fast as a Iowa class battleship so one could say it was more a battleship. I wasn't Arguing with wrngway. Lets play this back for you maybe you will understand. HE  says "The yamato was part of the midway invasion fleet" I respond "It was there but it didn't engage any ships" wait that sounds like I agree with him hmmmm.


Now MasherBrUM "Imagine yourself reading a book". That wasn't very friendly. Maybe you should imagine yourself with better manners. A couple of post back you said I was wrong with no explanation. Why not instead of calling people wrong and making jest, why not say wrong and this is why I think/Know your wrong. I mean that's what a forum is for active Discussion. Now above I posted some things that could be argued this is a great opportunity to practice

Ready 1..2...3......GO!
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Offline Masherbrum

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #69 on: June 21, 2009, 10:25:06 AM »
I said Masherbum Wasn't intentional. That means I didn't mean to do it. It was a typo a funny typo. The Hood was a battleship just because the English called it a BattleCrusier doesn't really mean anything. It was around The Same Tonnage as a Iowa Class Ship and only one foot Shorter. The main difference between a battlecrusier and a battle ship was speed the Hood went just as fast as a Iowa class battleship so one could say it was more a battleship. I wasn't Arguing with wrngway. Lets play this back for you maybe you will understand. HE  says "The yamato was part of the midway invasion fleet" I respond "It was there but it didn't engage any ships" wait that sounds like I agree with him hmmmm.


Now MasherBrUM "Imagine yourself reading a book". That wasn't very friendly. Maybe you should imagine yourself with better manners. A couple of post back you said I was wrong with no explanation. Why not instead of calling people wrong and making jest, why not say wrong and this is why I think/Know your wrong. I mean that's what a forum is for active Discussion. Now above I posted some things that could be argued this is a great opportunity to practice

Ready 1..2...3......GO!

It wasn't.   I'm through with you.   As I said previously, some of you need to read more before you start spouting.   

Enjoy the thread though!   :x
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Offline Captain Virgil Hilts

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #70 on: June 21, 2009, 10:51:00 AM »
Yamato actually didn't do much of anything against Taffy 3 as it changed course to avoid 3 torpedos from the USS Herrmann and took itself out of the fight.  It didn't sink anything and spent a lot of time dodging FM2s and TBMs.  It did not sink Gambier Bay, Johnston, Hoel or Samual B Roberts.  The Fast Battleships of the USN were with Halsey too far away to do any good.  Had Yamato kept coming it probably would have been the BBs of Olendorf including the rebuilt Pearl survivors that would have been shooting at it.  Hard to say how that would have gone as US fire control radars were quite good.  West Virginia scored on her first salvos at 22,000 yards at night when Olendorf crossed the T against the Japanese fleet in Surigo Straits

The problem there would be, if memory serves correct, the "Ghosts of Pearl Harbor" were carrying a lot of HE rounds, and not a lot of AP rounds, because they were tasked mostly with shore bombardment, not to mention their guns were not nearly so powerful as the 16" naval rifles of the Iowa class. It might have been real hard to take on the Yamato with mostly HE rounds. In that case, the best you could hope for is to try to wreck the Yamato's topside, the less heavily armored bridge, etc, with HE, so that the control would be greatly reduced, and then hope you could hammer her with what AP you had.

The big problem with deciding what was necessary to take out either of the Yamato class ships was that claims of hits on a ship like that during battle were not necessarily accurate, and with so many claimed, and possible, it is difficult to know which hits did what damage. Either of those ships, in their final battles, could have been hit many times after they had already been fatally damaged. Given their size, it could take hours before they sunk, even if they were fatally damaged. Unless you have a hit like the Arizona or the Hood took, you often do not know which hit was fatal.
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Offline kilo2

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #71 on: June 21, 2009, 10:55:26 AM »
Thats Cool state something with out backing it up seems like your M.O.
AS a matter of fact I have read quite a few books on WW2. Maybe you shouldnt be so pretentious. You havent adding anything to any thread i have ever seen you post in. All you do is call people out and say there wrong. Then when someone challenges that you go "im through with you" and run out, again with out adding anything. So if your done see you.

Oh and happy fathers day if your a father Masherbrum  

It wasn't.   I'm through with you.   As I said previously, some of you need to read more before you start spouting.   

Enjoy the thread though!   :x
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Offline Rich46yo

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Re: History Buffs: Question for you!
« Reply #72 on: June 21, 2009, 01:21:39 PM »
The Yamato was also at Midway as part of the invasion fleet I believe.

More than likely a Yamato vs. Iowa-fest would not have taken place off Leyte.  Halsey took the Iowa's with him, "...

"He" was at Midway. But far in the rear, with the gear. Like I said Yamato actually saw its share of sea time but the IJN was so petrified of losing him before this mythical, samurai, grand show down with the USN fantasy of theirs happened.

Of course it was all fantasy. The aircraft carrier had become the main instrument of sea power and the Yamato belonged to a different era. He couldnt even be used as a shore bombardment platform cause the Jap HE shells were either lousy or non-existant.

BTW Halsey changed his mind and ended up sending Task force 34 back south to help the 7'th fleet. Included in that task force was USS Iowa and USS New Jersey. Course the Yamato was probably still running away from the torpedoes shot at it by Taffy-3s little unarmored Destroyers when they scattered the japs like a flock of chickens.

Both the Yamato and Musashi were impressive ships but they didnt exactly have impressive service lives.
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