190a5 vs niki

[Void56]

190 a5 with small gun package vs. niki ..............any suggestions on what to do if you were in the a5 seat? Because i have tried and tried and tried it never works. Even when forcing a overshoot, yu always end up with an important part missing cause that nik is bound to get just a few in and that makes all the diff.

[CraneMan]

If I were the 190 I would keep up my speed and E and go for more of a  BNZ approach. In my opinion with a good pilot in the 190 and a good pilot in the Nikki the 190 dosn't stand a chance.

[Qrsu]

If you've filmed it, I suggest posting it on here so we can all see where you go wrong.

One thing is for certain. You have a superior roll rate in the 190 that you can use to your advantage. I believe (I don't fly it often) the N1K2 has a fairly average to poor roll rate. You can dictate the direction of turns much quicker against an aircraft like that.

190s are good in the vertical (up and down), not so much in a flat turn. In a situation where you want to make the bandit overshoot - use your superior roll rate to start in one direction, pull gently (think vertical as well) and once he's made a move on your initial turn, snap your roll in a different direction and break.

A quick example that I could think of... He's coming in from your high 5 o'clock position. Start a nose low turn into him (right). Once he starts hauling his nose to point at you or in front of you, allow him to come in closer (800-600 yards) then reverse your turn, heck keep rolling right and finish up with your lift vector pointing up and left and haul back on the stick. In the the 190, you should be able to do this so quick that he won't be able to follow you and overshoot.

 There's no absolute way though. You have to practice and experiment. Use that roll rate to create different angles and surprise your opponent.

Use them in the offensive too!

Good luck. 

[humble]

The 190 has a pretty significant performance edge down on the deck. The nikki's "sweet spot"'s are at about 9k & 15K while the A5 is worse with alt...period. At 5k or so the nikki does under 350 with WEP and its climb rate begins to fall off rapidly. So if the 190 driver takes the fight to the deck and works an E fight from the deck to about 5k he's got a decent chance. If you try and fight the nikki over those alts then your in trouble....now relative pilot skills make a big difference in the 190 but the nikki has better climb and reasonable speed and more docile handling.

[Cajunn]

Here is what I suggest, come in with a lot of smash and strike fast:

http://www.mediafire.com/?3wmjmoxq3wr

make sure you have the "E" advantage always, never get slow and never try to turn with the N1K in a 190, any flavor:

http://www.mediafire.com/?nhqoovyjgug

[A8TOOL]

Here is what I suggest, come in with a lot of smash and strike fast:

http://www.mediafire.com/?3wmjmoxq3wr

make sure you have the "E" advantage always, never get slow and never try to turn with the N1K in a 190, any flavor:

http://www.mediafire.com/?nhqoovyjgug

Sorry Cajun, not sure these two films can be of help to anyone.

The first was a film of you coming down on someone who didn't even know you were there.
The second was an easy kill on a 2 weeker that didn't even try to avoid being shot at. He probably wasn't able to see where you went being so brand new and didn't know you were there either.

If you want we can try and make a film together, just PM me.

[Cajunn]

Sorry Cajun, not sure these two films can be of help to anyone.

The first was a film of you coming down on someone who didn't even know you were there.
The second was an easy kill on a 2 weeker that didn't even try to avoid being shot at. He probably wasn't able to see where you went being so brand new and didn't know you were there either.

If you want we can try and make a film together, just PM me.

My intentions were, that when your in a fw 190-A5 you have to have nearly a clear advantage in some area. The 190-A5 doesn't climb with the N1K and it Doesn't turn with it and if your new to the 190 series like I suspect the OP is the 2 example's or clearly his best chance at defeating a N1K. They might not be the best example's for a better player, but for someone new trying to defeat a N1k in a FW190-A5 its his best shot until he accumulates a better understanding of the A5 and better tactics. I have better tactical films using the A5 but nothing that would help him without some TA training with a Trainer, or I respectfully suggest MjTalon, as he is one of the better 190-A5 pilots IMO. And if the OP is not new to the series then my apologies! 

[humble]

not sure what flavor of 190 this was, filmed a 190 hop by request a while back. Not a 1 on 1 clip but gives you an idea of how you can "semi T&B" the thing at low alts and do OK with it....

http://www.az-dsl.com/snaphook/190%20hop.ahf

[NaughtyN]

Assuming equal pilots skills the NIKI will have the edge in that fight, due to its better overall performance.
Even when the A5 is coming in with an E advantage a well flown NIKI will equalize that and than gain the upper hand. As humble mentioned the A5 has a speed advantage down low and in a fight for my life i would use that to return home and come back another day.

As we are here in a game and beside our ego nothing is hurt when we get shot down, you can try to work with that advantage. Try to keep the A5 fast while forcing the NIKI to bleed its energy in hard turns, while you keep the pressure on him using the vertical. If the fight gets slower, either get ready to put the breaks out and avoid a wingline overshot or judge the right moment for an extension.

But even than if the NIKI pilot doesn't go for the "easy" shot, he might just climb out to an altitude where he has an performance edge.

[WMLute]

Assuming equal pilots skills the NIKI will have the edge in that fight, due to its better overall performance.
Even when the A5 is coming in with an E advantage a well flown NIKI will equalize that and than gain the upper hand. As humble mentioned the A5 has a speed advantage down low and in a fight for my life i would use that to return home and come back another day.

As we are here in a game and beside our ego nothing is hurt when we get shot down, you can try to work with that advantage. Try to keep the A5 fast while forcing the NIKI to bleed its energy in hard turns, while you keep the pressure on him using the vertical. If the fight gets slower, either get ready to put the breaks out and avoid a wingline overshot or judge the right moment for an extension.

But even than if the NIKI pilot doesn't go for the "easy" shot, he might just climb out to an altitude where he has an performance edge.

Actually, except for @ 10k, the 190a5 has the speed advantage high or low.  Saying that the niki (was another poster) has a "Sweet spot" @ 15k is 100% wrong.  15k is one of the huge drops in the niki's performance between 10 and 20k.  15k would almost be the BEST alt for a 190a5 to fight a niki at (under 20k that is).

The niki is fastest at 10k and @ 19k, with its "best" all around alt to fight at @ 7k ish.  (Blend between speed and climb)

Under 15k the niki has the better climb (w/o wep) and 12k and under they have roughly the same climb with wep.

You can beat a niki in a 190a5, but you have to out fly or out think them.  A better merge, using the roll of the 190 to setup a vector for a shot, posibly bleeding E at the start to get position for a shot, etc, etc...

If you try to match the niki move for move you will lose in the long run.  Don't get stuck in a constant immel/yoyo/turn etc as the niki will steadily gain position.  If you are doing the same move more than once/twice you are going to be giving away position.  The KEY is to get in position quick and get the shot.  The longer the fight goes the more the advantage goes to the niki driver.

I have had several very good a5 drivers make me nervous right at the start of the fight.  Heck, last week I had a guy durn near shoot me down in the first 10 seconds.  But as I said as the fight progressed I gained position and shot 'em down.

Try to shoot them down in that first 10-15 seconds.  Most niki drivers fly with 100% throttle and like dummies don't use the nikis flaps (which drop @ 220kias and are one of it's biggest advantages).  You can use that against them and get position early in the fight and hopefully a kill shot.  The A5 will bleed E quick and the combo of that and its superior roll should give you a couple decent snap shots early in the fight.  If you miss those shots early on, you might consider extending and "reset" the fight.  Prolonged stall/knife fights should be avoided.

[Oldman731]

Actually, except for @ 10k, the 190a5 has the speed advantage high or low.  Saying that the niki (was another poster) has a "Sweet spot" @ 15k is 100% wrong.  15k is one of the huge drops in the niki's performance between 10 and 20k.  15k would almost be the BEST alt for a 190a5 to fight a niki at (under 20k that is).

The niki is fastest at 10k and @ 19k, with its "best" all around alt to fight at @ 7k ish.  (Blend between speed and climb)

Under 15k the niki has the better climb (w/o wep) and 12k and under they have roughly the same climb with wep.

You can beat a niki in a 190a5, but you have to out fly or out think them.  A better merge, using the roll of the 190 to setup a vector for a shot, posibly bleeding E at the start to get position for a shot, etc, etc...

If you try to match the niki move for move you will lose in the long run.  Don't get stuck in a constant immel/yoyo/turn etc as the niki will steadily gain position.  If you are doing the same move more than once/twice you are going to be giving away position.  The KEY is to get in position quick and get the shot.  The longer the fight goes the more the advantage goes to the niki driver.

I have had several very good a5 drivers make me nervous right at the start of the fight.  Heck, last week I had a guy durn near shoot me down in the first 10 seconds.  But as I said as the fight progressed I gained position and shot 'em down.

Try to shoot them down in that first 10-15 seconds.  Most niki drivers fly with 100% throttle and like dummies don't use the nikis flaps (which drop @ 220kias and are one of it's biggest advantages).  You can use that against them and get position early in the fight and hopefully a kill shot.  The A5 will bleed E quick and the combo of that and its superior roll should give you a couple decent snap shots early in the fight.  If you miss those shots early on, you might consider extending and "reset" the fight.  Prolonged stall/knife fights should be avoided.

All of this is great advice, but it boils down to this:  Unless the Nik pilot is significantly worse than you, he's going to beat you if he knows you're there and if you want to fight and not run away.

- oldman

[humble]

I'm not sure I agree with that, unless outside intervention occurs the 190 can control the fight at lower alts. The 190 cant angle fight the nikki and a B&Z would just set the 190 up to die vs a competent foe....BUT a well prosecuted +E attack would allow multiple passes at minimal risk with a reasonably high probability of success IMO. The real key would be driving the fight down and then not allowing the nikki to successfully take the fight back up....

[BaldEagl]

In a 190 (any varient) against a N1K, Spit, Yak or anything of that ilk you cannot win fighting in-plane.  You have to use he 190's roll rate to continue to fight out of plane with the opponent and using the roll rate in the vertical obliques is preferable to horizontal.

In addition you'll only have a short window to execute a kill shot after which you will need to extend to re-set the fight otherwise you will be on the defensive.

Fighting like this in a 190 is one of the most challenging things you can do in this game and is the reson that most see the 190 as strictly a BnZer but it is entirely possible and quite fun and rewarding once you get used to it.

[NaughtyN]

Again assuming equal pilot skills it must be said that althought the TnB-Fighter (NIKI in this case) might not be able to outrun the E-Fighter (here FW190A5) and the E-fighter therefore can decide to end or continue the engagment, the TnB-Fighter nevertheless can avoid the E-fighters attack indifinitely.

In the case of FW190A5 vs. Niki the speed advantage is also not as great as in D9 vs. Niki an therefore makes the fight for the A5 even harder.

The E-fighter will at best get very short snap shot windows to end the fight, so good gunnery skills are essential to have a realistic chance to win.

In addition you'll only have a short window to execute a kill shot after which you will need to extend to re-set the fight otherwise you will be on the defensive.

Fighting like this in a 190 is one of the most challenging things you can do in this game and is the reson that most see the 190 as strictly a BnZer but it is entirely possible and quite fun and rewarding once you get used to it.

I think what kills most inexperienced 190 pilots is the fact, that they miss the right point at which to extend and reset the fight. I personaly have no real problem to slug it out "low and slow" in the D9, but only if notice a decisive edge in pilots ability (which doesn't happen often this days). If the other guy is smart, its very important to know the point when to drop out with enough E left so he can't reach you while extending.

With it's high stall speed the FW190 requires a bit more maneuvering room to work with.

[Vudak]

Like others have said, you need to try and kill him quick. 

Remember, you do have something very important going for you: should you decide to stay and fight, you have an almost 100% chance of surprising the living daylights out of the Nikki.  They'll NEVER expect THAT Use that initiative and shoot them down!

Further, let's look at Lute's example of a 190 pilot making him nervous at the beginning of the fight.  From the 190's perspective:

If he shoots down Lute, he's dancing in the streets;

If he gets shot down by Lute, he can shrug his shoulders.  He is, after all, turn fighting in a 190!

Really, dog fighting in the 190 is kind of like playing a scratch ticket someone else bought you.  Have fun