Author Topic: Squadron Mission Assignments  (Read 2753 times)

Offline Shifty

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #45 on: July 25, 2009, 01:30:48 PM »
Fencer,

The reason this came up was because of VF-17 pulling bomber duty in four straight FSOs.
Bug is the VF-17 FSO commander we asked him to look into it last month when we got buff duty for the third straight FSO and almost got a fourth in that same scenario because another CIC tried to put us in buffs two weeks in a row. It has nothing to do with Bug's record before he came into VF-17. It's always been about VF-17 not Bug.


JG-11"Black Hearts"...nur die Stolzen, nur die Starken

"Haji may have blown my legs off but I'm still a stud"~ SPC Thomas Vandeventer Delta1/5 1st CAV

Offline AKKaz

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #46 on: July 25, 2009, 02:10:30 PM »
This is just me thinking in print here and nothing more. But it makes sense to me that small squads would not tend to get bomber duty. Why?  Well usually you need some numbers to take a target down, putting 2 or 3 small squads together to accomplish this, would tend to lead to the job maybe not getting done IMO.  Not saying they would not try, but a larger squad knows itself, their CO knows everyones abilities.

There is one target and one mission commander, they will work better as one. Several smaller squads together could lead to the proverbial "Too many chiefs, not enough indians"

My squad, we take what were are given, we do our share of bombing, some attack ( though I'd like to do more, but thats just me) and we get fighters, usually as CAP.

Anyways thats just my take, not saying its right or wrong. Just seems to be the common approach to me.

<S>


Looks like Becinhu beat  me to this one, sorry

It might be in best interest of some very small squadrons to "sister" up with a larger squad.  We have the 613th joined up with us just for the reason you mention above. 

With smaller squadrons, until the time that they either have more of their members fly FSO or recruit to larger numbers, by joining another squadron in FSO takes care of alot of concerns.  Also it helps with mission and unit cohesion for them as they are married up with different flying styles each week.
AKKaz
Arabian Knights

Offline Viper61

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #47 on: July 25, 2009, 03:04:28 PM »
Bug good point to bring up in general.  And there have been several good replies.  And here is my normal long winded reply  :)

Having CIC'ed a few of these myself I always send out a "Plane ride request" before i publish the orders and for the most part i am able to give the responding squads what they want.  The Plane ride request is a technique that we have gotten away from in the last few months and we should all go back to sending them out.  And as most of you know from my emails you get asked:  What do you want fly?  What did you fly during the last Frames?  What kind of a mission profile would you prefer?

When I select squads for missions its normally based off of squad size and abilities.  There are squads in this game that not only have a pack of killers in them but they are organized and can organize others.  Bug your guys being one of them the AK's are another.  Those squads get the hard missions accomplished so i give Strike Commands to those squads or if I need squad of killers to hold a gap I'll place the 412th or 9Gaip into that hole and know they will hold it and kill at the rate of 3 to 1 or better.  Sometimes you just need shear "Mass" of a good large squad to defend a target and i place a large squad there like 332nd, LCA or the 68th.  Most importantly there are a few squads that read the Op Orders and if they don't like it they will alter the plan which can make or break an overall mission if timing is critical and you don't show up on time.  Those CO's and squads I place into locations where a higher level of control can be placed on them.  "Fencer" is widely known for his bomber abilities which then implies that if he can hit nearly any target his squad or "Strike package" will as well.  Yes i have given him Strike Package missions because of past performance.  I'll place VMF-251 into more complex strike package profiles because i like the way Saxman plans his missions and coordinates with other squads.  Also without naming the squads there are few squads i will never place into bombers as it would be a waste of talent over their abilities in fighter AC.  Yes i have a little black book on you all  :noid

Small squads I normally "attach" to other larger squads as scouts or to hold gaps etc.  Regardless of abilities of the small small squads like 5th AF who give better than they get, in this game the smaller squads are at a BIG disadvantage regardless of their abilities.  Also a 5 man bomber force just cant carry the ORD poundage needed to distroy most targets.  If a 5 man squad runs up against LCA manning at 27 they would likely die or at least be pushed out of sector.  So I attach them to larger elements.  If they are attached they "probably" will not get the perked or primary AC.  Just a fact as an attachment you can't expect to run the show.

There are a few squads in this game that you know will not always "man" at the strength you can count on so I will not place these squads into locations where the battle will become pivotal.  Example:  11-15 man squad shows up with 2 to a FSO and the 2 that do are not from the leadership team and have no idea what to do.  Had that happen to me one night as CIC and I wont forget it either.

Lastly when i send out a ride request and the squad doesn't answer it........ well they get what i select for them not only in plane types but in squad missions as well.  To me that says a lot if none on your email list can answer a email.  Historically I only receive replies from 50 - 75% at best.  What I will say is that before I send out a ride request i can almost guarantee who will respond.  Bug your one of them who always responds quickly and to the point  :D and Daddog with his normal "Put us in where you need us we just love being here".  Or AKDogg with his normal reply for all perked AC LOL.

I won't mind having a "Master List" of who's flown what or how say over the last 10 frames and i would take that into consideration as I planned and i stress the word "consideration".  But don't force me into placing a squad into type of AC as that then forces me into placing them into a mission profile type that I may not want them in or they can likely accomplish.

What would help me more is a list of historical manning strength, lose to kill ratio's, objects destroyed, bomb hit percentages.  That is more relevant to planning over what someone flew.  But in the end if I am the Side CIC I am going to plan a mission that we can accomplish and win.  And hard missions will get the "perked" AC and Strike Package command and control functions will go to the squads and CO's with a history of being able to organize it and accomplish the missions especially after the first bullets fly past the windshields.  I would like to believe that when others have CIC duties the 325th VFG comes to mind in a positive way and we are placed into the fight where he believes we can do the most for the team.  And if that is in Fighters and not Bombers so be it we can do both well I think.

Bug to the very first email you posted:  Yes the 325th VFG hasn't had a true bomber mission lately in fact I can't remember being in a bomber since the last 8th AF missions over germany about a year ago I think.  But we have flown several JABO's in fighter AC last night being one of them (F-6's and ORD's).  But also I would add that the 325th VFG has been on the sides where "defending" was more of a primary mission than attacking and I think that contributed to the 325th VFG being placed into fighters more than bombers as well.

Lastly and for whats its worth to all:  About a year or so ago the 325th VFG was going through a phase in which we got crap planes and missions in my opinion.  I looked internally and saw why.  We didn't have good manning numbers and we weren't completing missions to standard and were getting wiped out to the man in nearly every mission.  So i took actions internally to correct that and I think we are in a better position today then back then and the logs show it.  I would hope that the 325th VFG is now selected for missions based on ability and past performance and not just selected as a "filler" squad because they don't recognize our squads name.

 :salute
Viper 61
Ops Officer
325th VFG  

Offline Shifty

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #48 on: July 25, 2009, 03:38:45 PM »
Good post Viper.
<S>

Fencer I appreciate you sharing your CIC tools. That looks to be very useful, thanks.

JG-11"Black Hearts"...nur die Stolzen, nur die Starken

"Haji may have blown my legs off but I'm still a stud"~ SPC Thomas Vandeventer Delta1/5 1st CAV

Offline CHAPPY

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #49 on: July 25, 2009, 04:40:43 PM »
I don't think they are "getting over".  I know they are getting over.  I'm hoping to eliminate that somewhat, not gonna deny that.

 :rofl

Offline daddog

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #50 on: July 25, 2009, 06:17:32 PM »
Excellent post Viper.

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Offline oakranger

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #51 on: July 25, 2009, 10:32:46 PM »
It might be in best interest of some very small squadrons to "sister" up with a larger squad.  We have the 613th joined up with us just for the reason you mention above. 

With smaller squadrons, until the time that they either have more of their members fly FSO or recruit to larger numbers, by joining another squadron in FSO takes care of alot of concerns.  Also it helps with mission and unit cohesion for them as they are married up with different flying styles each week.

353rd FG has three member of Jg-54 flying with us.  I think it is a great idea to have a small sqad to join a larger sqad
Oaktree

56th Fighter group

Offline FiLtH

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #52 on: July 25, 2009, 10:33:11 PM »
  I like that chart, good job. <S>

    

~AoM~

Offline Big Rat

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #53 on: July 26, 2009, 09:41:53 AM »
Great post Viper61 :aok

 :salute
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Becoming one with the Hog, is to become one with Greatness, VF-17 XO & training officer BigRat

Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #54 on: July 26, 2009, 09:46:39 AM »
Nice work bug.  But the 334th has flown bombers twice in this most recent FSO, not just once, for a total of 3 out of 6 frames.
gavagai
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Offline TheBug

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #55 on: July 26, 2009, 10:10:00 AM »
I have to update it to include frame 3, and put the actual frame names at the top of the columns to make it clearer. 

Stampf's example is definitely an attack mission.  Sometimes an attack mission may get listed as fighter if I am going strictly by what the logs show, but it is AHwiki so if you see a mistake feel free to correct it.
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Offline Qrsu

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #56 on: July 26, 2009, 10:27:11 AM »
Good idea, Bug. Just edited our last Frame.  :salute
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Offline CHAPPY

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #57 on: July 26, 2009, 03:14:33 PM »
As long as the information is updated weekly it might be a good tool.

« Last Edit: July 26, 2009, 03:30:51 PM by CHAPPY »

Offline Halo46

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #58 on: July 26, 2009, 05:26:12 PM »
Wow, really Bug?   :huh
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Offline TheBug

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Re: Squadron Mission Assignments
« Reply #59 on: July 26, 2009, 06:59:56 PM »
“It's a big ocean, you don't have to find the enemy if you don't want to."
  -Richard O'Kane