Rockets, realistic effects? More info needed.

[Vermillion]

Since JABO is pretty much suicide, I hadn't really done much with the rockets in the game, until the last couple of nights.

Me and some of my squaddies decided to start playing with rockets, when we were attacking bases which had their acks down (ie vulching).

Basically, they are useless.

I flew many missions with the P-38 with 10 rockets, and fired them singely, salvo'd in pairs, salvo'd in 4's, or even fired them all 10 at a time.

It seemed to me that they have no blast effects at all. If you didn't score a direct hit (which I couldn't do), they had no effect on acks or enemy aircraft.

In one case I dived down to vulch a Spitfire taking off, and salvo'd four rockets. Now imagine a box drawn around the spitfire that is nose to tail long and wing tip to wing tip wide. All four rockets hit within this box (I saw the flashes), but not direct hits. The spitfire took off and when it later died, I didn't recieve an assist. In real life, the blast effects from a single rocket at this distance alone would have disabled this plane. Let alone four rockets all around him.

In a second case, there were two planes sitting on the spawn point not moving, one that had just barely moved, and one that was less than a plane length from the spawn point (4 total). I rolled down, and volley fired all 10 rockets into them. Flashes splashed all over the spawn point and the first 1/8th of the runway. Nothing. All planes took off, and evidently didn't recieve any damage, since I didn't get any assists. On a second pass over that end of the runway, I saw the tiny craters from the rockets, riddling the spawn point, so I know my aim wasn't very far off.

Unfortunately I forgot to film any of this, but I will try to start getting some film. Maybe in the TA.

Does anyone have any data on the amount of explosives in the rockets we have? The American 5.25 inch rocket, the German Wgr 21cm rocket, and the British rocket that is used on the Typhoon.

Maybe I am wrong, but from my reading, and the film I have seen of rocket attacks from WWII, Korea, and Vietnam, rockets were quite effective against soft targets such as aircraft and light vehicles.

This especially concerns me with the "coming soon" vehicle set.

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Desperately trying to figure out why Kamikaze Pilots wore helmets"

[Minotaur]

Verm;

I have read at least one account were 4 Typhoon fighters with rockets sank 2 out of 3 ships.

Concerning AH the only use I find for rockets is taking out buildings.  Of course, guns seem equally effective at doing this.  

Practically since my first day in AH I have been goofing with rockets.  I agree with you, rockets are very cool, but up till now useless.

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Mino
The Wrecking Crew

[Tac]

Being a P-38 only pilot, and a hopeless Rocket user, I HAVE to say something  

I've been able to knock out AAA using rockets, but only if the rocket hits it directly (those AA gunners are made of iron, those 'kets hit 2 ft from them and they rub it off and keep aiming those laser guided guns!)

BTW, rockets are great for Head-Ons against bombers *evil grin*.

[funked]

The WGr. 21 are much bigger than the 5.25" rockets.  You shouldn't even have to get them that close to a bomber to kill it.  Heinz Knoke's book "I Flew for the Fuhrer" has some vivid accounts of what it was like to use these rockets - they were devestating.  However the current WGr. in this game appears to do nothing unless you get a direct hit.

[Westy]

 Verm, the other night I swear a salvo of two rockets took out a taxing B17 at F21. They hit on the right wing real close to the root.
 Other than that fluke for me you're right on the money as regard rockets.
 I wish HTC would tell us effective range of use, blast diameter, etc...
 I'd rather hope they'll have an FAQ on the rockets up on thier front page soon. Especially with vehicles coming.

-Westy

[Vermillion]

Tested this some more in the Training Arena with Kieren yesterday.

Now I will say we were able to get kills against each other, but thats with the "target" guy, sitting still on the runway, and with salvo's of 4 or more rockets at a time.

From what I could tell, if there is a blast effect its very small. Most likely the size of the "crater", which looks to be about the size of a tractor trailer's tire.

There were several rockets that hit extremely close to me when I was playing "target" that I figured should have killed me, but didn't scratch me. One right off the nose of my P-38, it literally couldn't have been more than 5 yards distance.

We filmed the action from both the shooters plane and the target plane. The problem is that as a target (the angle I wanted the film from the most) your film doesnt' show the enemy rockets, impacts, or craters. And trying to judge the exact distance of the impact from the target, from the viewpoint of the attacking aircraft is pretty much impossible.

Any ideas on how to do better testing ?

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Desperately trying to figure out why Kamikaze Pilots wore helmets"

[Kieren]

Maybe have someone go otr, then bail, and walk around the target to watch?

[Westy]

Or bail over the spawn point and float down slowly from 2k or less.

I'll do it next time I'm online with you Verm.

-Westy

[This message has been edited by Westy (edited 03-20-2000).]

[Vermillion]

Tried something very similar with a B26 and using exterior views.

You can see the hits slightly better, but it doesn't give you much in the way of recorded evidence, or the ability to analyze numerically the distances we are seeing.

Any explosive of bomb experts around here, that can tell us the effective blast radius of different weapons?

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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Desperately trying to figure out why Kamikaze Pilots wore helmets"

[Fishu]

Rockets useless? nah, just has to aim  
I Just came back to test P-38 for a bit, made one air to ground attack, first ack I missed due to nose pulling up with compressiong and trims no use... second wen't with another bomb.
Then was first on the list to go, I had 10 rockets, dumped 8 rockets at it and got it!

It wasn't lucky action  
I like to use rockets when I have fast speed and diving in at about 20-40 degrees.
Then you'll just aim bit above the target and launch rockets.
Because I had 10 rockets, I just launched each of the rockets with aim bit higher.
(if one explodes before the target, another will hit)


And WGr rockets are air to air rockets, which are supposed to explode in air, not on impact.

[Vermillion]

Fishu, I'm not arguing that you can't hit something with one   difficult, but yes you can hit with them.

I'm just arguing that they should have a much larger area of effect. Based principally on the film I have seen of their use in combat.

If I had a scanner here, I have several pictures of rocket attacks that are quite effective to a respectable distance. On trains, railway junctions, buildings, ships, and submarines.

Check out the Rocket Technical Data thread I started in this forum. I would love if anyone has anymore technical data on them.

Oh and the Wgr 21cm? My info says it was orignally a ground to ground weapon that was later adapted to aerial use, by changing the fusing.


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Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Desperately trying to figure out why Kamikaze Pilots wore helmets"