P-38 kill ratio...out of whack.

[Shuffler]

This is incorrect. Kinetic energy explanes why heavy bullets travel farther than light bullets. In that case, the energy bleed is friction loss due to drag which is the same for both bullets, but the heavier bullet has more  engery to lose. When pulling into the vertical, the kinetic engery is being converted into potential engergy in a gravitational field. It's gravity that slows the plane down not friction loss. It takes more engergy to move a heavier plane to a higher altitude than it take to move a lighter plane to a higher altitude. So the heavey plane has to convert it's engery faster to make the same manuever. In other words the mass effect cancels itself out.

So your saying that throwing your rudder all the way one way and your ailerons all the way does not create massive drag? I use this for brakes on my 38.

[CAP1]

I proposed a theory that the P-38 has superior vertical performance compared with other MA planes that the performance specs suggest it shouldn't possess, leading to a high number of 'rope' kills. I want to use film to see if my ascertion is correct. I'm perfectly fine with being wrong, and the films should show that too. I'd like to see film of P-38s performing vertical stall reversal manuevers for victories.

Thanks to any and all who post such films.

Lazerr, shuffler, Hyperion, Delerium, must have 30 among them if they filmed and saved any times they killed me in this exact fashion. I unfortunetly didn't.

i'll snip my film from the other night down to just the kill shots, and try to get it up here for ya. i don't often use the vertical.........as i should, but in this instance, i did.

[Ack-Ack]

I proposed a theory that the P-38 has superior vertical performance compared with other MA planes that the performance specs suggest it shouldn't possess, leading to a high number of 'rope' kills. I want to use film to see if my ascertion is correct. I'm perfectly fine with being wrong, and the films should show that too. I'd like to see film of P-38s performing vertical stall reversal manuevers for victories.

Thanks to any and all who post such films.

Lazerr, shuffler, Hyperion, Delerium, must have 30 among them if they filmed and saved any times they killed me in this exact fashion. I unfortunetly didn't.

If you're gonna call shenanigans, then show the proof.  What performance specs show the Lightning shouldn't have the vertical performance it does in game?


ack-ack

[Vinkman]

right.......and since the larger heavier plane can/does store more energy, this gives it more energy to maneuver vertically with.

No. It has more energy but NEEDS more engergy so it's a wash.

[CAP1]

No. It has more energy but NEEDS more engergy so it's a wash.

no...if it had more drag it would need more energy.

[Vinkman]

no...if it had more drag it would need more energy.

cap1 go out in your backyard and through bowlingball and basketball up in the air and tell me which one you can thow higher. Is it the bowling ball because it's smaller diameter means less drag?

[SunBat]

ya'll still talking about this?

[Shuffler]

Now roll them down a 20' ski ramp... which goes higher.

ya'll still talking about this?

Yes Vinkman got slimed... anyone seen that ghost???? 

[CAP1]

cap1 go out in your backyard and through bowlingball and basketball up in the air and tell me which one you can thow higher. Is it the bowling ball because it's smaller diameter means less drag?

bad analogy. they're both starting from zero.


assume they're both rolling on a track, at a given speed....say 5 mph. the end of the track goes up 10 degrees. the bowling ball will go farther up, before it comes down.

 

[Vinkman]

Now roll them down a 20' ski ramp... which goes higher.

They achieve the same height. Ke=1/2 mV^2, Pe=mgh.   If all the Ke is converted to Pe then use these two equations to determine how high (solve for H) the plane goes. You quickly see that m cancels out and H = (V^2)/g

where
m=mass
g=gravitational acceleration
h=height differential
V=velocity
Ke= Kinetic Engergy
Pe= Potential Energy

[grizz441]

This thread delivers better than when a certain SAPP member started a troll thread accusing SAPPers of P38 cheats.   

[Vinkman]

If you're gonna call shenanigans, then show the proof.  What performance specs show the Lightning shouldn't have the vertical performance it does in game?

ack-ack

I'm asking for the film (proof) you're demanding I post.  


Shenanigans is the wrong term. That implies cheating. I'm asking if the flight model is acurate or is Martix performing weird physics for p-38 in the vertical.

[Vinkman]

i'll snip my film from the other night down to just the kill shots, and try to get it up here for ya. i don't often use the vertical.........as i should, but in this instance, i did.

That would be great Cap1 Thanks

[TnDep]

This is incorrect. Kinetic energy explanes why heavy bullets travel farther than light bullets. In that case, the energy bleed is friction loss due to drag which is the same for both bullets, but the heavier bullet has more  engery to lose. When pulling into the vertical, the kinetic engery is being converted into potential engergy in a gravitational field. It's gravity that slows the plane down not friction loss. It takes more engergy to move a heavier plane to a higher altitude than it take to move a lighter plane to a higher altitude. So the heavey plane has to convert it's engery faster to make the same manuever. In other words the mass effect cancels itself out.

I might be wrong but an object falls at 2.2 feet per second reguardless of weight.  If you take a quarter and penny and drop them at the same time, they hit the ground at the same time.  If both the heavier bullet and lighter bullet is traveling the same speed, they should fall at the same rate.  If I'm wrong please explain.  I shoot alot of weapons and I figure not of the wieght of the bullet but the traveling speed of the bullet to find my 100-1000 yrds drop zones. 

[CAP1]

I might be wrong but an object falls at 2.2 feet per second reguardless of weight.  If you take a quarter and penny and drop them at the same time, they hit the ground at the same time.  If both the heavier bullet and lighter bullet is traveling the same speed, they should fall at the same rate.  If I'm wrong please explain.  I shoot alot of weapons and I figure not of the wieght of the bullet but the traveling speed of the bullet to find my 100-1000 yrds drop zones. 

no.....their kinetic energy will fight gravity differently.