Rolling Perk Set

[deSelys]

Lazs,

Even a straight RPS is unfair if you look it that way.
Would you consider that an A6M2 or a Bf109E4 play in the same league as a Brewster Buffalo? In an early war arena, 95% of the people will sit in Emils or spitfires, so they can BnZ Morane-Saulniers, Curtiss Hawks and the like to death...This kind of whine will never stop.

The only way to have exact parity is to allow players to fly only ONE particular aircraft. An arena full of Spits I...Fair? Absolutely....Boring? utterly...

[eskimo2]

I would love to see it at least tried out.

eskimo

[Vermillion]

Ok I'll be the nay sayer.

I hate it.  And I honestly think the silent majority of players would hate it.  All it is, is a disguised RPS that uses perk points.

Its just like the Combat Theater. Thread after Thread with hundreds of posts saying "I LOVE IT, and I'll be there every day", " I'll fly nothing else", and all the other rah rah cheerleading.

Where is the CT now? Its a ghosttown.

I know for a fact that many people left Warbirds and came to Aces High just to get away from the RPS and the Axis versus Allied arena.

Lets not ruin Aces High too.

[SOB]

Like Verm said "RPS in disguise".  I don't like it.  Nice presentation tho'.  


SOB

[Zippatuh]

I don't care for it either.

Zippatuh

[lazs1]

If you had an early war 'area' in the arena I can think of more than half a dozen planes right off hand that would have parity or... close enough... 109e, spit one, A6m2, ki43, p40, F4f3,hurri one, mig1, yak1, p39, 202 etc.   I'm sure others can think of more.   All these planes have strengths and weaknesses but all are on a parity level with each other just... suited to different pilot styles.

There would be more VIABLE choice in the early war "area" than there is in the entire current arena plus... you would still be able to fly anything else in the arena by simply clicking on a different field in a different 'area'.

If you went a step further and had a late, or "perk" area.... you would then have half a dozen viable planes in mid war and half a dozen in late war for upwards to 20 or more VIABLE planes all in the same arena.

contrast that with the 4 or 5 viable planes we have currently and the 2 planes that are allmost 30% of all usage with no chance for the important and fun early war planes.

And nooo.... I don't have a fancy chart but i figure anyone with the brains gawd gave gophers can visulize what I am saying.
lazs

[hblair]

The idiotic/stupid lazs system will never work.

<g,d,r>

[deSelys]

Originally mumbled by lazs1:
If you had an early war 'area' in the arena I can think of more than half a dozen planes right off hand that would have parity or... close enough... 109e, spit one, A6m2, ki43, p40, F4f3,hurri one, mig1, yak1, p39, 202 etc.   I'm sure others can think of more.   All these planes have strengths and weaknesses but all are on a parity level with each other just... suited to different pilot styles.

Yeah, right....P40 or P39 against A6M2, you call that parity?

 

Lazs again:
There would be more VIABLE choice in the early war "area" than there is in the entire current arena plus... you would still be able to fly anything else in the arena by simply clicking on a different field in a different 'area'.

If you went a step further and had a late, or "perk" area.... you would then have half a dozen viable planes in mid war and half a dozen in late war for upwards to 20 or more VIABLE planes all in the same arena.

Well, suppose I fill a Tempest to the top, add droptanks, then I head towards the early war area where I wreck havoc...Will you agree with this? Won't it 'spoil your fun' a bit?

If planes can't fly from one area to another, it's just about the same as different areNas....

[bowser]

"...Yeah, right....P40 or P39 against A6M2, you call that parity?...".

What's wrong with this matchup?  Sounds good, and historical too.  I think you're missing the point.  Equal doesn't mean identical.  Each has their own strengths and when used properly makes for a fair fight.

bowser

[LLv34_Camouflage]

Originally posted by lazs1:
While the new guys are flying around in 109E's or Hurri ones.... The vets and those who have saved "perks" can fly untouchable planes therby racking up even more idiotic perk points?

I see what you mean. The "5-10" points per phase that I suggested, definately doesnt apply to all planes. But thanks for pointing it out! I just realized that this is where the math I thought I'd never need in life comes handy!

In the picture above, the perk cost decrease for each plane is linear.  Take for example the Tempest:

The cost in each phase, 1 to 5:
80...60...40...20...free

Instead, it could be made exponential:
400...200...100...50...10

I can't speak for the others, but atleast I would personally think twice before taking off in a Tempest during phase 1.

But like you said, nothing stops the "rich" vets from doing so. Which is one of the key concepts behind the Rolling Perk Set: if they are willing to pay, they can rack idiotic amounts of perk points from the easy 109E and Hurri kills.

What do you think, Lazs?

Camo

[ 10-18-2001: Message edited by: LLv34_Camouflage ]

[janjan]

I can't see the difference from now...200 perks will give you 262 which acts just the same as La7 or Dora for early plane set. Actually 262 is much more disparity.

IMO rolling perk set would give more chances to newbies than the current system since the favourite T&B:ers, Spits for instance, are much more competitive.

Also it would provide much more closed performance planes fighting each other and hence better fights!

[Sky Viper]

Originally posted by LLv34_Camouflage:
Hi!

Exactly 6 months ago we had a big discussion about a rolling perk set system. In my opinion, now would be a good time to introduce the Rolling Perk Set to AH.

Here is fd-ski's original post from: http://www.hitechcreations.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=1&t=009308

 

Camo

I like the idea of rolling, just not perks.
Now we have Roll the Perks idea?

I'm quite opposed to the specifics of this chart.

Don't you think some gamers may fly only on the days when their favorite perk ride is free.  Or even worse, it could prevent poor/unlucky pilots from flying perk birds on higher cost days due to lack of perks.

This would add additional unbalance to the arena.

It hurts the pilot with poor connections or poor skill in the harder aircraft. They can't earn perks as fast as Discos/Deaths can take them away. So they get stuck flying Spits ALL the time?
Sorry, but I don't want to see 100 spits every flight!  

Tune the colors up to add more freedom, and cut the costs dramaticaly (lower by 60%) to provide for the "Perk Poor," and you'll have my vote.  

Viper

[lazs1]

deselys... u have no point.   the matchups are good.

The "areas" would have seperation of many sectors and... I would even like a mountain range of 40K.  many ways to keep out the dipshits.   I would also like for the early war area to be canyons... erfect terrain for those early war twisty turny planes but not so good for say a 262 eh?

hblair... don't make me notice you!

camo... jerk the math around anyway you like but... it does not solve the basic problem with the rolling perk set.   Any time you have -4 Hogs fighting p40's you have an unfair and lopsided arena.   You wish to make the unfair fights rare.   I fail to understand how that makes em any more fair or any more fun for that matter.  also....

you seen that with a simple little matchup of 6 or so early war planes I suggested that it caused "controversy"  imagine how many arguements would  ensue from as complex and arbitrary system as the rollintg perk set.
lazs

[deSelys]

Bowser,

don't get me wrong, I am an advocate of the RPS and even more of an Allies/Axis arena. This matchup is indeed historical and realistic. I just wanted to remind to Lazs that even with an early plane set of 20 different planes, 2-3 fighter types will shine above the lot, and ~75% of the planes you'll encounter in the arena will be those 2-3 particular fighters. So it won't bring diversity. Off course, as new models roll out, the situation will evolve, so some kind of diversity will arise.

I still think that in a 1vs1 fight without any advantage, the A6M2 has a serious edge upon the P40 or the P39...The allied pilot should better not waste any shot opportunity, because he won't get many...In a 4vs4 or even 2vs2 fight, the employed tactics will decide...


 

Originally posted by lazs1:
deselys... u have no point.   the matchups are good.

The Great Lazs has spoken! Truth flows out of his Blessed Mouth...  

 

Originally posted by lazs1:
The "areas" would have seperation of many sectors and... I would even like a mountain range of 40K.  many ways to keep out the dipshits (your mental age is showing, bud).

Well, if it's almost impossible for a plane to fly from one area to another, I don't see the need to group thoses area in one big arena. It's better to design smaller arenas with smaller maps (download time shorter and less ram required...). Of course, the player pool will be diluted between those different arenas...so your beloved furballs won't be as 'fun' as before...Maybe the RPS isn't that bad after all...

I also wanted to correct another of your post in another thread: when the Axis/Allied arena was launched in WB, Main Arena turned into ghost-town for months...the majority of players preferred the new settings, the rest followed the herd. I suppose some people left because they didn't like the RPS, or because they didn't like the allied/axis matchup. But most people searched for a better sky due to:
1) Hotseat's attitude
2) connection quality going downhill
3) FM of some plane badly porked during more than 1 year (ie Bf109F4 outrunning, outclimbing, outturning and outgunning the Spit V!)

de Selys

PS
 

Originally posted by lazs1:
I would also like for the early war area to be canyons... perfect terrain for those early war twisty turny planes but not so good for say a 262 eh?

You played X-Wing vs TIE fighter too much...But now I grasp why you like the low mindless furballs so much...

[ 10-19-2001: Message edited by: deSelys ]

[LLv34_Camouflage]

Originally posted by lazs1:

it does not solve the basic problem with the rolling perk set.   Any time you have -4 Hogs fighting p40's you have an unfair and lopsided arena.   You wish to make the unfair fights rare.  I fail to understand how that makes em any more fair or any more fun for that matter.

"Make unfair fights rare"?  Instead, how about "make the various historical matchups more frequent"?

I don't see what fair/unfair has anything to do with this. The fluid nature of air combat should make that kind of a view point pretty useless. Each pilot has the option to engage or not to disengage as they best see fit. It is up to the pilot to get himself in a fair situation. That has little to do with the plane types - just fight to your plane's strenghts.

In the current MA, we have 202s fighting 262.  So if I read you correctly, you are saying that right now we have an unfair and lopsided arena? What is your solution to correct that? With all due respect Lazs, so far you haven't given us many suggestions to work with.

Right now, AH is more of a late war festival. Just looking at the stats, one can draw a conclusion that people don't find it fun to fly in an early war ride. Probably because they will mostly face late war planes. Pre-43 planes have very little use. And imho, that is a shame.

Camo