Author Topic: The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why  (Read 1154 times)

Hans

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« on: April 16, 2000, 06:06:00 PM »
The next tank should NOT be better than the current Panzer IV-H.  With such a small stable of vehicles to choose from, the other vehicles of a type should all have benefits and drawbacks compared to the other vehicles.

A T-34 is better in every way over a Panzer IV.  It is faster, better armed and has more armor.

A Panther is the same.  Faster, Bigger gun, More armor.

Now, a Sherman tank isn't like this.  It is faster, but weaker armed and armored.  With that in mind you don't always have to drive one.  A Panzer IV is good too, just not as good in all areas.  The two become a good counterpoint to each other since neither is better in all areas to the other.

Hans.

Offline ra

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2000, 06:47:00 PM »
The Sherman is not much faster, maybe 1 or 2 mph, not enough to be a factor.  The Panzer IV is all around better.  The T-34/76 was built in large numbers and is a good historical matchup for the MK IV.  If the Sherman is added to the game, no one will want to drive it, not so the T-34.  IMHO


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Offline Kieren

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2000, 11:13:00 PM »
I think it depends on which Sherman you model.

Give me one the one with the British 76.2mm and 100mm armor, and I will gladly drive it over the Panzer.

There are good and bad ones.

Hans

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2000, 11:34:00 PM »
Uh, no....the Sherman is faster than the Panzer IV.

The Panzer has a speed of 25mph.  The Sherman is 30 or 35mph depending on which source you read.

Offline Ghosth

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2000, 12:19:00 AM »
Personally I'd like to see a "Rat Patrol" type jeep next.  Faster and more manuverable than the M16 halftrack. Good for scouting routes and chaseing down halftracks.

The biggest thing however i'd like to see is something that will make planes think twice about diveing in on armoured columns.

Currently F4u's don't even think twice about takeing out a single halftrack.

I'd also like to see mobile 88's for those low bombers.  

As to the Sherman, bring it on.


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[This message has been edited by Ghosth (edited 04-17-2000).]

Offline Pongo

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2000, 12:22:00 AM »
The PzIvH should out gun any 76mm T34.
If they modeled the optics right they should be somewhat inferior to the Pz. It is faster, but is harder to shoot out of while moving. It may well have no radio...
The PzIVh is acctualy supperior but the refinments that make it so are hard to model in a game like this. Its bigest advantage would be better killing power.

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Offline juzz

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2000, 05:59:00 AM »
Historically the 88mm was next to useless against fast moving targets below 9000ft(can't traverse quick enough).

What you really want is a quad 20mm mounted on a tank chassis.  

Offline RAM

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2000, 06:07:00 AM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by Ghosth:

The biggest thing however i'd like to see is something that will make planes think twice about diveing in on armoured columns.

Currently F4u's don't even think twice about takeing out a single halftrack.


Oh, it is easy, Bring on the Wilberwind (I think it is spelled like that). Was a FlaK german vehicle, based on a PzIV chassis, lightly armored, but it had 4 20mm cannons  . Yeah, really those Hawgs and Tiffies would think twice before diving in a formationm with 2 or 3 of these.

The drawback is that they had same speed than PzIV, so you pay in speed the trade in armor and firepower. I think is a fair trade  .



Deinonychs

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2000, 06:13:00 AM »
Hmmm. All good points, but it seems you need something that can take out strafers and etc rather than a Sherman. Now that Ive seen you can control tanks, im getting me a sub   bbl.

Dein.

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Offline Badger

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #9 on: April 17, 2000, 07:18:00 AM »
My 2 cents worth....

Having served in Shermans for 4 years (M4A2E8) I can comment on a few things.

The Sherman would do over 30 mph (reached over 40 mph downhill once, but threw a track) on roads especially, but only in high (5th) gear.  Most of the time was spent in 3rd gear going cross country at speeds between 20-25 mph.  Using 4th gear was a stepping stone to get the transfer case into almost an overdrive state.  It usually took about 3-4 weeks to train a Sherman driver how to shift from 2nd gear to 3rd gear as it was an incredibly difficult feat.  The driver had to sit down and actually lower his seat (low and away from his periscope), use TWO hands to pull the floor mounted shift lever (at his right side) backwards, then double clutch several times.  It would ALWAYS grind into gear, even with the double clutch and until a driver got the rhythm, many times it would simply roll to a stop as the driver let the RPM's drop too low to permit the transfer case to slip it into 3rd from 2nd.  The rest of the shifts were the same, but nowhere as challenging.  Sometimes, we used to cheer when a  new driver actually learned how to make this transition consistently.

The gun was the 76 mm with a coaxial mounted 30 cal.  It was gyroscopically stabilized so one could fire "on the move" with a stable gun platform.  We used to engage targets on the MTR at about 600-800 yards while moving, but the preferred firing mode was from a stopped position.  The Sherman used "power traverse" which could rotate the turret 360 degrees in 17 seconds.  It had a manual horizontal wheel backup system, placed at the gunner's right hand, but it would take almost 2 1/2 minutes to get the turret around 360 degrees.  Having served with a lot of vets who went through WWII in Shermans (75 mm Mk4), they would always comment that the German armor did not have power traverse, especially the Tiger.  The result was that one of their major tactics was to hunt in two's and to keep moving laterally to the Tiger while firing, so as to stay ahead of his traversing speed with the 88 mm.  They also said that their 75 mm's would simply bounce off Tigers at 800 yards, so they always tried to get around their rear though high speed maneuvering in attempts to get a rear aspect shot, which was the most vulnerable part of the Tiger.

Just some ramblings from an old Sherman warrior.  Hope they help.

Badger

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Group 2 Signaler (RCAC)
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wow....that sure was a long time ago.  You guys are stirring up a whole bunch of old and hidden memories.  Some good, some bad.


Offline crabofix

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #10 on: April 17, 2000, 06:28:00 PM »

I would like to see a mobile 88 too.
To use both for tanks and aircraft.
Is it true that the famuse 88 was developed by the swedish firm bofors and let over to kruppverk, that owned a third of the stock in bofors?
Givin you a hint on a good 40mm to, made by the same firm. Would rock in a quadraset.

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Offline Pyro

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #11 on: April 17, 2000, 06:51:00 PM »
Having a .50 for AA work will make a big difference.



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Offline Karnak

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #12 on: April 17, 2000, 07:02:00 PM »
I'd like to se a T-34/76.  That could be turned ito a T-34/85 at a later date.  A Whirblewind (I certainly misspelled that), with its 4 20mm cannon, would be a great addition for AA.

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Offline Pyro

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #13 on: April 17, 2000, 07:06:00 PM »
Wirbelwind or Ostwind would be cool, but don't forget that they have an open top.  If we get into supervehicles, the Kubelblitz or the Chaffee with dual Bofors would be cool.



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Offline Pongo

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The next tank has to be a Sherman...here is why
« Reply #14 on: April 17, 2000, 07:10:00 PM »
The addition of clip fed weapons(Wirblewind and Ostwind) would change things a little too.

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