Fw 190F-8!!!

[Sundog]

Ra, nobody has said we 'aren't' getting the Dora either   . After all, notice that F-8 in the pic has the same blown hood as the dora, and the only 'Perk' fighter that has been revealed so far is the Tempest.

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Sundog
VMF-111 Devildogs
'Criticism is always easier then craftmanship.'

[RAM]

 

Originally posted by Sundog:
and the only 'Perk' fighter that has been revealed so far is the Tempest.

And of course the Dora will follow as perk plane, along P51D, La7 and 109G10. Fair and square.

Ra, R versions were not "built", but modified ON THE FIELD. You can't keep track on the R versions used, because they were field adaptations, not FACTORY (as the U were). Not only that, but remember too that the R versions were not only interchangeables but could Co-exist in the same plane!!

The 500Kg+2x250kg is a configuration I have seen listed many times. And also I?ve seen 1000KG+2x50kg on the wings listed as an usual loadout.

[ra]

RAM,

I know R's were mostly field mods, but they were first tested and standardized, then made available as mods.  So, many R-versions may have been developed but never used in the field. Listing what ord a particular R could carry does not mean that that ord was actually ever used in combat.  As you say, it is impossible to know exactly which field mods were and were not used, and in what numbers.  A picture of a 190F8/R? with a 1000kg bomb hanging on it may be a picture of the only one built.

I'm hoping HTC models a 'standard' F8 with 1 500kg and 4 50kg, plus any useful R-mods that were known to be used in large numbers, like the 250kg wing bombs.  

[Nath-BDP]

Don't say anything about the F8 not being able to carry 2x250kg and 1x500kg without saying something about the P47 able to carry 10xHVAR AND 2x1000lber in wings.

[Jochen]

Ra, F-8 will be quite effective if it gets ER 4 adapter so it could carry total of 8 50 kg bombs. Also Panzerblitz rails and rockets were commonly used in eastern front and I would think that 16 rockets each capable of destroying a tank could be useful in AH too, maybe not against Ostwind because Panzerblitz had quite short range.

Hopefully HTC has enought time to model those. While the number of Panzerblitz installations are lower than total number of F-8's, I think they should be in AH because in time they presented significant portion of Lufwaffes air to ground capability in eastern front. And I think nobody believes that F-8 will become too popular, even if it has Panzerblitz modeled.

I hope we see something like this as loadout options:

ETC 501 center rack: 4 x 50 kg with ER 4, 1 x 250 kg or 1 x 500 kg

ETC 50 underwing racks: 4 x 50 kg, 1 x 250 kg or 2 x Panzerblitz rails 12 or 16 rockets total.

That would be awesome!

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jochen Gefechtsverband Kowalewski

Units: I. and II./KG 51, II. and III./KG 76, NSGr 1, NSGr 2, NSGr 20.
Planes: Do 17Z, Ju 87, Ju 88A, He 111H, Ar 234A, Me 410A, Me 262A, Fw 190F, Fw 190G.

Sieg oder bolsevismus!

[funked]

ETC 50 can not carry bombs larger than 50kg, hence the designation.

[Jochen]

I know funked... I put those wing 250 kgr's in my list because someone stated on this thread that F-8 could carry 250 kgr's on wings which I wondered a bit but didn't think it too long.

In order to have those 250 kgr's on wings plane would need ETC 503 racks and I don't think they were used in F series, only in G.

The truth is out there...

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jochen Gefechtsverband Kowalewski

Units: I. and II./KG 51, II. and III./KG 76, NSGr 1, NSGr 2, NSGr 20.
Planes: Do 17Z, Ju 87, Ju 88A, He 111H, Ar 234A, Me 410A, Me 262A, Fw 190F, Fw 190G.

Sieg oder bolsevismus!

[C_R_Caldwell]

Sundog, there is NO way that the Dora-9 will be a perk fighter.As mentioned earlier, if the Dora became a perk fighter, then a/c like the P-51D, Me 109G-10,La-7,F4U-1C (some say N1K2-J) would have to be perk fighters as well.

German pilots relieved it to be at least the equal of the P-51D, and although there are quite a few differences in handling/performance at various alts, an objective observer would regard them as roughly comparable, with the D-9 perhaps having the edge under 22k, and the P-51D having the advantage above that altitude.Why then would it be a perk fighter?

The reason the Tempest is a perk fighter is that it was arguably the Allies best low-med alt fighter, with excellent acceleration, climb, & maneuvrability.Whilst the Typhoon was an excellent air superiority fighter at low alts, the Tempest remedied many of its performance short-falls at higher alts.Although it could not compete with a 109G-10 or K-4 at 'nose-bleed' altitude, at medium alts down, it was almost unbeatable, the only German fighter able to compete at those alts being the Ta 152H, and we know that only very small numbers of those were built, so it's really a moot point.

[Nath-BDP]

Actually I wan't the D9 to be perked for one reason:

Dweebs won't flock to it and ruin its reputation.

and an aircraft being 'perked' doesn't mean its going to cost 1000 points, the D9 will prolly be perked in the 50-100 range.

[Sundog]

Or maybe the Dora will be perked in the 25 to 50 point range or you can wait for 100 perk points for a Ta-152C or Ta-152H   .
It would be nice, but maybe they are going to add a version of the Ta-152? It was on the Perk Thread List Pyro posted a few months ago.

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Sundog
VMF-111 Devildogs
'Criticism is always easier then craftmanship.'

[Sorrow[S=A]]

I would surmise it would be a perk (relativly cheap perk) because the 109 G10 is allready a match for the P-51 in Aces High. The Dora would quite simply put the LW 1 step above the rest of the planeset in the MA.
Oh- BTW that guess is based on FACT not stats, guesstimates or anecdotes. Hangtime VS Hristo PROVED the G10 in 1v1 was the superior performing plane in AH.
Hell Hang even bent the rules of the ROE to get a jump in but still lost that war. Though he never served his month in a 109 penance.
Whether the Dora is perked or not I could care less really- but please don't start snivelling that you need it to match the P-51D. In AH thats a load of toejam. IMHO it wouldn't hurt a bit to see the Dora, F4U-C, MkXIV and P-51H as low perk point fighters. And RAM- cause I know you will get in here- don't whine about it either, we all know you would happily dump 2 or 3 good sorties in an A5 to fly the Dora for the night. And personally I think your volume is just so high because you don't WANT to accept that the 109 G10 is the P-51's match. That would be like admitting you can't have the best 190 to use at your will in the MA.

[danish]

In my mind there is no doubt that the Pony is the best plane of the two *in the arena*.Fuel carried, high speed handling and snap shot possibilities tip the scale.

1 v 1 is another story entirely.

danish

[Wilbus]

Thought I'd might drop in with some facts about the 190 Ground Attack version. The facts are from teh Very Exelent Book "Warplanes of the Luftwaffe". ISBN 1-874023-56-5 for those who'd like to take a look at it.

"The 190F and 190G series were essentially ground-attack version of the basic 190A series, the Fw190F ('Panzer Blitz')
armoured assault aircraft appearing in the spring of 1944. Externaly similar to the Fw190A series, but with a bulged hood, this version feutured gun armement reduced to two MG17s and two 20-mm cannon, but had the ability to carry 1000-Kg (2205-Lb) bomb plus two 50-Kg (110-Lb) fragmention bombs.
The most important subvariant was the
Fw190F-8, wich could carry 14 21-cm
(8.27-in) rocket bombs, six 28-cm (11.02-in) rocket-launchers or 24 R4M unguided rockets; Fw190F-8s first joined III(Pz)/KG 200 in the autumn of 1944.
The Fw190G series actually entered operational service long before the Fw190F, the first aircraft being sent
to North Africa, joining SG 2 at Zarsoun, Tunisa, following the 'Torch' landings in November 1942.
The mojority, however, went to the Eastern Front where they played an active part in the Great tank battle og Kursk
in early July 1943. The Fw 190G-1 version, with greatly strengthened undercarrige, could carry a 1800-Kg (3968-lb) bomb.
 
[img]http://saintaw.tripod.com/jg5wilbus.gif[\img]




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Rasmus "Wilbus" Mattsson
III/JG5 "EisMeer"

[RAM]

 

Originally posted by Sundog:
Or maybe the Dora will be perked in the 25 to 50 point range or you can wait for 100 perk points for a Ta-152C or Ta-152H  

again: sure. And the P51D and 109G10 would cost just the same.

[RAM]

   

Originally posted by Sorrow[S=A]:
I would surmise it would be a perk (relativly cheap perk) because the 109 G10 is allready a match for the P-51 in Aces High. The Dora would quite simply put the LW 1 step above the rest of the planeset in the MA.

HUH?? so now perkies are given because G10 is already a match for the P51?

Hint: as arena plnae: it isnt such a match. 1 vs 1, sure it is.  But not on the arena.

And RAM- cause I know you will get in here- don't whine about it either, we all know you would happily dump 2 or 3 good sorties in an A5 to fly the Dora for the night. And personally I think your volume is just so high because you don't WANT to accept that the 109 G10 is the P-51's match. That would be like admitting you can't have the best 190 to use at your will in the MA.

I WONT dump happily ANY minute of paying in A5 to fly a D9 IF YOU DONT HAVE TO DO THE SAME WITH THE La!, the US lovers do the same with the P51, and the 109 lovers dont do it with a G6!

Can you imagine the ENOURMOUS yell that this community would have to hear if the P51D is perked? then WHY should the Fw190D9 have to be?. Because YOU think that 109G10 is a "match" for the P51?. it isnt. Not in the Main arena. You want to let us LW lovers to get bored in a plane that only runs and climbs? because it can do NOTHING else. Can't dive, can't turn, can't follow power dives ,CANT DO ANYTHING that makes a plane a good arena plane!!.

Oh, and look sorrow, I love fw190s. I always have done. I like the A5. I like the A8. But the 190 I've -*always*- loved the most is the Fw190D9, wich is the HISTORICAL MATCH of the P51D. I have read a lot of good (and bad) things about the 109G10 and K4 but NONE (and I repeat NONE) of them regard it as the Mustang's equal.

So STFU, you have already a match for the P51, is called Yak9U. You want La7 perked aswell, isnt it? of course you do, so get your La5 or Yak9 and get the perkies to fly your PERK La7.

no? You dont agree?

then let me fly my dora and shut up.


[This message has been edited by RAM (edited 02-09-2001).]