Stuka upgrade

[Leek]

How hard would it be to allow for the Ju 87 D3 model to have the single 20mm MG 151/20 mounted in each wing? Or for that matter to step up to the G1 model or the modified D models that had the 37mm wing pods as used on the Russian front. I love flying the Stuka, but once your one bomb is gone, there's really nothing left to fight with. Besides it would be a fun alternative to always using an IL.

[Ack-Ack]

How hard would it be to allow for the Ju 87 D3 model to have the single 20mm MG 151/20 mounted in each wing? Or for that matter to step up to the G1 model or the modified D models that had the 37mm wing pods as used on the Russian front. I love flying the Stuka, but once your one bomb is gone, there's really nothing left to fight with. Besides it would be a fun alternative to always using an IL.

D-3 didn't have 20 mm cannons mounted in the wings, nor was it ever a field modification option.  The D-5 was the one that had the wing mounted 20 mm cannons.

ack-ack

[gyrene81]

To be fair ack ack it would be much easier to modify the existing loadouts than adding a model...no one would care about the historical accuracy of something as simple as gunpods for the existing model since the biggest differences between the models was engine, wingspan and armor...personally the current loadouts are a bit extreme and could use some tweaking.

The "field modification" issue could be debated as well:

D-1 and D-3 variants operated in combat with the 37 mm (1.46 in) BK 37 cannon in 1943...

The G-1 was converted from older D-series airframes retaining the smaller wing but without the dive brakes. The G-2 was similar to the G-1 except using the extended wing of the D-5 with 208 G-2 new built and at least 22 more converted from D-3 airframes.
"During the Battle of Kursk, only a handful of production Gs were committed. On the opening day of the offensive, Hans-Ulrich Rudel flew the only "official" Ju 87 G, although a significant number of Ju 87 D variants were installed with the 37 mm (1.46 in) cannon, and operated as unofficial Ju 87 Gs before the battle. In June 1943 the RLM ordered 20 Ju 87Gs as production variants."

IMO this would be more appropriate

1 1800Kg
1 1000Kg
1 1800Kg + 2x 250Kg
1 1000Kg + 2x 500Kg
2x 500Kg
2x 250Kg

2x 37mm (6 rounds per gun)

[waystin2]

I love flying the Stuka, but once your one bomb is gone, there's really nothing left to fight with.

The Stuka will surprise you.  Once you have offloaded ord, she is fairly nimble!  I have gotten kills, although it takes time hammering away with those pea-shooters.

[jay]

To be fair ack ack it would be much easier to modify the existing loadouts than adding a model...no one would care about the historical accuracy of something as simple as gunpods for the existing model since the biggest differences between the models was engine, wingspan and armor...personally the current loadouts are a bit extreme and could use some tweaking.

The "field modification" issue could be debated as well:



IMO this would be more appropriate

1 1800Kg
1 1000Kg
1 1800Kg + 2x 250Kg
1 1000Kg + 2x 500Kg
2x 500Kg
2x 250Kg

2x 37mm (6 rounds per gun)

im sure they held way more than 12 rounds

[gyrene81]

im sure they held way more than 12 rounds

Nope...

The G-1 was armed with two 37 mm cannons mounted on under-wing gondolas, each loaded with a 6-round magazine of armour piercing tungsten ammunition.

Several sources found with the same info.

[Ack-Ack]

To be fair ack ack it would be much easier to modify the existing loadouts than adding a model...no one would care about the historical accuracy of something as simple as gunpods for the existing model since the biggest differences between the models was engine, wingspan and armor...personally the current loadouts are a bit extreme and could use some tweaking.

I would care about the historical accuracy.  Basically, you'd be introducing a plane type that was never produced or flown and that's what would happen if the D-3 was given an ordnance option of wing mounted 20 mm cannons.

Give the D-3 the 37 mm Flak 18 gun pod option?  Sure, why not?  It was a load out that was used on the D-3 until they were converted to the G-1 so historical accuracy in this case wouldn't be given the shaft.


ack-ack

[gyrene81]

I would care about the historical accuracy.  Basically, you'd be introducing a plane type that was never produced or flown and that's what would happen if the D-3 was given an ordnance option of wing mounted 20 mm cannons.

Give the D-3 the 37 mm Flak 18 gun pod option?  Sure, why not?  It was a load out that was used on the D-3 until they were converted to the G-1 so historical accuracy in this case wouldn't be given the shaft.


ack-ack

Well. ya know seriously here...we now have a P-47M that was produced in very low numbers (130)...even though we have vastly incomplete plane sets for other factions. Modifying the loadouts available to the existing Stuka models would be a very minor infraction on the "historical accuracy" issue.

[IrishOne]

Spit16's had 23 TOTAL hours of combat time.....they weren't seen flying around in droves like you see them here.  A spit16 never scored a single kill in WWII, so if we're going to split hairs on historical accuracy, let's get serious.

[gyrene81]

Spit16's had 23 TOTAL hours of combat time.....they weren't seen flying around in droves like you see them here.  A spit16 never scored a single kill in WWII, so if we're going to split hairs on historical accuracy, let's get serious.

True... 

[Motherland]

Spit16's had 23 TOTAL hours of combat time.....they weren't seen flying around in droves like you see them here.  A spit16 never scored a single kill in WWII, so if we're going to split hairs on historical accuracy, let's get serious.

Source?

[Ack-Ack]

Well. ya know seriously here...we now have a P-47M that was produced in very low numbers (130)...even though we have vastly incomplete plane sets for other factions. Modifying the loadouts available to the existing Stuka models would be a very minor infraction on the "historical accuracy" issue.

That we now have the P-47M or how many combat hours a plane has is irrelevant to this discussion.  

Spit16's had 23 TOTAL hours of combat time.....they weren't seen flying around in droves like you see them here.  A spit16 never scored a single kill in WWII, so if we're going to split hairs on historical accuracy, let's get serious.

The Spitfire Mk XVI had more combat time than that, not sure of the exact number of hours but it was far more than 23.  You are also incorrect about not having any kills.  TB 752 flown by Flying Officer ‘Bob’ Young shot down a Fw 190 and a couple of days later, TB 752 agaub scored another A2A victory when Flying Officer ‘Fred’ Town shot down a He 111 (TB 752's "Final Victory" is depicted in the painting by Michael Turner).  You can read more about TB 752 and the pilots that flew her in combat in the book, 'The Manston Spitfire - TB 752'.

So, now let's get serious...

You are wishing for something that never existed on the D-3.  Since you're so willing to chuck historical accuracy out the window, why not ask for lasers or an AMRAAM missile system?

The simple fact is that the D-3 never carried 20 mm cannons on the wings, the wing design of the D-3 couldn't fit 20 mm cannons.


ack-ack

[gyrene81]

So, now let's get serious...
You are wishing for something that never existed on the D-3.  Since you're so willing to chuck historical accuracy out the window, why not ask for lasers or an AMRAAM missile system?
The simple fact is that the D-3 never carried 20 mm cannons on the wings, the wing design of the D-3 couldn't fit 20 mm cannons.

ack-ack

No what I'm saying is that if the low production numbers can be overlooked to include a plane that was not needed then a simple modification to the armaments on another plane...which could have very easily been field enhancements...to include a set of weapons included as field mods on another plane (which for some reason does not exist in the set even with larger production numbers)...should be possible.


When the 37mm and 20mm were first deployed, they were retrofitted to operational D3 units that had the need...so don't just say it never existed.

[Ack-Ack]

No what I'm saying is that if the low production numbers can be overlooked to include a plane that was not needed then a simple modification to the armaments on another plane...which could have very easily been field enhancements...to include a set of weapons included as field mods on another plane (which for some reason does not exist in the set even with larger production numbers)...should be possible.


When the 37mm and 20mm were first deployed, they were retrofitted to operational D3 units that had the need...so don't just say it never existed.

The 37mm Flak 18 gun was used on the D-3s before they were converted to G-1s, the D-3 never had 20mm wing mounted cannons nor were any D-3s converted to be able to mounted the 20mm cannons in the wing.  The D-5 and the G-2 (based on the D-5) had options to carry either the 20mm wing mounted cannons or the 37mm Flak 18 gun pods.


ack-ack

[Dantoo]

Spit16's had 23 TOTAL hours of combat time..

Holy cow I reckon I have read a few outrageous statements in my time....

Here's a living example of single Spitfire XVI that flew more than that just by its little old self:
http://www.aviationmuseum.com.au/aircraft/spitfiremkxvi.cfm

This Supermarine Mk XVI Spitfire is an ex-wartime example, built at Vickers Armstrong's Castle Bromwich "shadow factory", near Birmingham, in late 1944.

The aircraft’s first action was on 24 March (wearing squadron code FU-P) when, laden with two 250lb bombs and a long range belly tank, the aircraft headed a flight of four Spitfires for an armed reconnaissance; briefed to bomb rail targets in the Utrecht/Hague/Leiden area. TB863's cannons were fired in anger for the first time during a strafing attack on a large railway coach by the four, claimed as probably destroyed, before returning to altitude. The aircraft continued with these sorties flying twelve missions during its six weeks on operations; 23 hours 55 minutes in total.

and as for the extrordinary " A spit16 never scored a single kill in WWII" statement, I present information from "American Spitfire Aces of World War 2" about another surviving aircraft:

Spitfire XVI TB752/KH-Z of SQN LDR H P M Zary RCAF, No 403 Sqn RCAF, B114 Diepholz, Germany, 21 April 1945
.........
During the late afternoon of 21 April, Zary was flying his Spitfire XVI when he shot down a Bf109 near Schnackenburg to become the final American Spitfire Ace of World War 2.  Four days later, while being flown by another pilot, TB752 shot down its second enemy aircraft and the fighter claimed its third kill when yet another pilot destroyed an FW190. The aircraft survived the war and is now on display in the Spitfire Memorial Museum at Manston, in Kent.