WW1 well ok, i would have prefered..

[Westy]

"All dominated by the F-86 and MiG-15."

True. Every era has it's top predators.  Fortunately HTC and most of the other
companies didn't make two plane WWII sim/games. Would kind of suck flying
just Meteors and ME-262s or P-47Ms and TA-152's

[Gabriel]

"All dominated by the F-86 and MiG-15."

True. Every era has it's top predators.  Fortunately HTC and most of the other
companies didn't make two plane WWII sim/games. Would kind of suck flying
just Meteors and ME-262s or P-47Ms and TA-152's

Doesn't work as a comparison because the 15 and 86 were the primary combatants. .

It's like the 109K4 and Spit XIV fought most of WW2 and the rest of the plane set consisted of Gladiators and He 51s.

Yea, you could perk the 86 and 15 to hell, but then it's not a Korea sim.  But if you enjoy an arena where only two planes are competitive and everything else is target practice....go for it

[Brooke]

Air Warrior had a WWI arena and a Korean War arena.  Neither was used much.

For me, the problem with WWI is that your forward-up view (what you need most in turning combat) is blocked by the wing.  So you spend a lot of time maneuvering while unable to see your target.

The problem with Korea is the speed of the jets.  As mentioned above, a 360-degree turn at 500 mph takes a long time, and your target is typically about 1000+ yards away.  So, you spend your time (by WWII fighting standards) in glacial dogfights squinting at a 1000-yard-away dot on your screen.

I think that WWII aircraft are the optimum for dogfighting enjoyment.

[Agent360]

The problem with Korea is the speed of the jets.  As mentioned above, a 360-degree turn at 500 mph takes a long time, and your target is typically about 1000+ yards away.  So, you spend your time (by WWII fighting standards) in glacial dogfights squinting at a 1000-yard-away dot on your screen.

Sounds a lot like the MA now...chasing p51's, tempests, and 190's around.

So WW1 is tooooo slow whahhwhahha and korea is too fasssst whahhhhh whahhhhh. Get real people.

Those who put down botht he WW1 and Korea planes just don't know that much about HOW the planes fought each other.

Why did the take the guns out the fantom fighters then find they had to put them back in.....answer is the counter to missils is to get inside the range so a missle cant get you then manuever to guns range...simple.

[Oldman731]

While the thought of flying jets in gun combat sounded cool at first, after trying it out the speeds are just too fast. The separation between the jets increases very quickly and it's hard to pull sharp turns because of G limiting and the speed. Maybe I just didn't fly right, but that's my impression so far.

Good observation.  It took A LOT of practice in AW's Korean arena to be able to get on the six of an enema who was actually trying to avoid you.  As with the AW WWI arena, there was a cadre of people who were very good at it.  Quite a challenge, should be fun to have a Korean arena some day.

- oldman

[Brooke]

Sounds a lot like the MA now...chasing p51's, tempests, and 190's around.

So WW1 is tooooo slow whahhwhahha and korea is too fasssst whahhhhh whahhhhh. Get real people.

Those who put down botht he WW1 and Korea planes just don't know that much about HOW the planes fought each other.

My opinion is that it is not at all like fighting in P-51's, Tempests, or 190D-9's in our Main Arena.  It's like Me 262 vs. Me 262 combat, only with more speed retained.

Just telling you how it was in Air Warrior, which had both of those arenas.

[Westy]

Perhaps Gabriel.  Most of the air-to-air combat in Korea involved Mig15
and 86's. Perhaps with a Korea venue they could start with 1950?

http://www.acig.org/artman/publish/article_307.shtml

But the point was there was a lot more used in Korea than just those two.
In a melee fantasy arena like exists in AH now (except AvA) where
anything flies against anything else the majority of players would try
just the jets. But a LOT of players don't follow the herd and they will fly
F9Fs or Yak-17s as well as all of the other aircraft that could be modeled.

Same with WWI. The planes that came out in late '18 dominate those from
the years leading up to them. Regardless though there will be plenty of
players who would jump into an Eindecker for example simply for the
challenge and the thrill of it. Same as they always have.

 Brooke brought up a very good point - the view. It was horrible trying to
look around when your head is mounted on a stick and you had no extra
movement available.  IMO both the HTC view system and TrackIR type
of devices make "flying" WWI aircraft in an online world now very feasible
and about as realistic as you can get until the 3d glasses Vulcan refers
to (in another other topic) come down from the stratosphere in price!

 Still. HEre is an example of a WWI game/sim using trackir. It's "Knights
of the Sky" using trackIR. SKip ion about 30 seconds.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AXZ-N5HNJDE

 WWI (and Korea) would be fun for those who like more than just the
WWII era of air combat.  There are a lot of us out there.

[newz]

It took A LOT of practice to be able to get on the six of an enema

No amount of practice or money could convince me to get on the six of an enema.
 

[boomerlu]

Agent, it's not the chase that's the problem, it's trying to dogfight at 400 mph. Brooke's right on the money in that it would be like 262 vs 262. The gunnery problem is much harder to solve at higher speeds. The closure is much higher, the line of sight rates are much higher, the turn rates are on average slower because of such high speeds, and with KW era thrust-to-weight ratios, planes maintain maneuvering ability much better so it's harder to energy fight. When you do finally saddle up, you have a much shorter window of opportunity because of the aforementioned thrust-weight ratio. Either your opponent will outrun you or they will gain enough smash to maneuver and force some turns. That's probably a big reason why they introduced missiles in the first place which is what you alluded to. But missiles only came into their own with Vietnam, NOT Korea.

Of course with enough practice, I'm sure you'd get used to fighting with Korean War era planes. Still, it'd probably be a bigger learning curve than jumping from WWII to WWI.

[EskimoJoe]

I wouldn't say preferred, but I certainly would like to be able to fly the Sabre some day 

[Sonicblu]

Well maybe they will have a Jet jock arena next year.

I can hardley see cons at 800yrds. Can you imagine trying to merge at mach +2 you cant even see whats going on.
Id have to go to the office and set up my HI def projector and play on the wall at work just to see anything.

I just dont see it happening. Maybe i just dont understand how it would work.

[StokesAk]

Jets would be wierd.

p.s

 

[jay]

Jets would be wierd.

p.s

 

dont we already have 3 jets?

[boomerlu]

dont we already have 3 jets?

Nope, only 2 jets.

The other one you're thinking about is a rocket plane.

[RipChord929]

AFIK, guided missiles were first used in combat during the Indo/Pakistani war, late 50s...
Sidewinders used by the Packi's, were captured by India, given to the Soviets, who reverse engineered the ATOLL.
Unless somebody has heard of useage before that...

Just a little trivia...

RC