Author Topic: Whistle blowing on Global Warming  (Read 117954 times)

Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #30 on: November 23, 2009, 04:36:29 PM »
Can't say as I see how :headscratch:, but suit yourself.  You're pulling a bait and switch with the acidification remark.  How high CO2 can go before the oceans become untenable for marine life is another topic entirely.  The discussion is whether the planet is warming due to man-made influences.  If that's not the scientific problem, then quit talking about GW and let's talk instead about acidification.

It's not a bait and switch at all.  It was a direct response to your claim that we should weigh the alternative of reducing warming in ways other than CO2 reduction...
Quote
The percent certainty is important in determining if it is more cost effective to attempt to reduce CO2 (and hopefully but not certainly) slowing warming, take other proposed measures to counter-act warming, or instead to mitigate it's effects.
...Because that misses the point that increasing atmospheric CO2 has other negative impacts that go beyond average temperature.  If that were not the case, then you would be right that we could apply a more traditional cost/benefit calculus to the correct course of action.

I understand that the point goes beyond global warming, but that's also why the term "climate change" is preferable.  The ocean is just as important to our climate as the air we breathe.

It's a good one..... but it requires a little thinking.

The person I quoted said that GW was a possibility so we should do something about it now.

I asked this question of him.... not you..... to see if he did the same in his daily life. His vehicle could break down at any time. Was he prepared. It could be catastropic for him and his family if he was not.

No, your analogy is crap, but I will answer it anyway.  I have a jack and a spare (oh wait, also have some flares, water, flashlight, quart of oil).  If anything goes wrong beyond that, I have AAA...because hey, it's not like the sea level's rising or something. :neener:
« Last Edit: November 23, 2009, 04:42:59 PM by Anaxogoras »
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Offline Bronk

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #31 on: November 23, 2009, 04:42:26 PM »
Anax "Climate change" is now being used ONLY because they know the whole MMGW is bs.
Nothing said will dissuade my opinion on that.
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Offline Anaxogoras

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #32 on: November 23, 2009, 04:52:41 PM »
Anax "Climate change" is now being used ONLY because they know the whole MMGW is bs.
Nothing said will dissuade my opinion on that.

Bronk, you do realize that's the equivalent of "Lalalala, I can't hear you!"

Three points are clear to me:

1. Human activities contribute more CO2 to the atmosphere than any other source.  You can refute claims that other things, like e.g. volcanoes, contribute more CO2 with some basic stoichiometry and volcanology data.

2. CO2 levels are rising.

3. CO2 reflects thermal radiation.

Draw your own conclusions from these points.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2009, 04:57:04 PM by Anaxogoras »
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Offline Bronk

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #33 on: November 23, 2009, 05:02:03 PM »
Bronk, you do realize that's the equivalent of "Lalalala, I can't hear you!"

Three points are clear to me:

1. Human activities contribute more CO2 to the atmosphere than any other source.  You can refute claims that other things, like e.g. volcanoes, contribute more CO2 with some basic stoichiometry and volcanology data.

2. CO2 levels are rising.

3. CO2 reflects thermal radiation.

Draw your own conclusions from these points.

Late 70's we were going to freeze... 90's we were all going to cook.  Now you tell me we are going to freeze again? It's a BS scam to grab $.
Like I said I don't believe a word of it.


The earth was colder and the earth was hotter long before we got here. Probable do the same long after we are gone.
« Last Edit: November 23, 2009, 05:03:41 PM by Bronk »
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Offline potsNpans

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #34 on: November 23, 2009, 05:38:45 PM »
Any body ever find out what the best temperature for Earth is anyway? How about you Northern hemispheric countries, bet you'd like a little warm up before the ice storms. I got another question but this is for Anaxogoras, are you a vegan?

Offline wrag

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #35 on: November 23, 2009, 05:43:03 PM »
Carbon emissions or not, oil is a finite resource upon which modern society is dependent.   Demand increases daily, and while new fields are indeed capable of extraction with new technology, they too will not last forever.  Not to sound like an alarmist, but to do nothing as a society to wean ourselves off this dependency is at best negligent and at worst suicidal.

Now coal and natural gas are somewhat different situations.   Both are finite, but we won't run out of either for many hundreds of years.  That being said, coal in particular releases all sorts of fun toxins when combusted (yes, even with scrubbers) and therefore has it's own inherent risks.  

What it comes down to for me is (regardless of whether or not man-made climate change is a reality) it makes absolutely zero sense for the most advanced nations in the world to cling to outdated technology sourced in finite resources.  

But I digress...


A old Discovery Channel?  Film showed something that might make your statement not entirely true.

Was about a deep sea rov going way down and finding a chimney blowing out some really dark material.

They took a sample and low and behold it was OIL and it was being created by tiny bacteria that was dieing as it was exposed to the ocean water...................

haven't seen that particular episode since.
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Offline DaCoon

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #36 on: November 23, 2009, 06:08:30 PM »
Just my $.02 but I believe this GW is just ol' Mother Earth going through her natural phases. Some geologists say ice ages happen approx. every 30,000 years or so and that they are preceeded by climate warming. Don't know if the gurus are right or not (wasn't here 30k yrs ago), but it seems probable.
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Offline saggs

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #37 on: November 23, 2009, 07:24:35 PM »
Seriously, I just hope and pray that the US will not sign the coming global climate treaty next month in Copenhagen.  It will make our sovereignty  subservient to a new global climate government (unelected of course), which would have the power to come in and over ride anything we do in the name of "the greater good", regardless of our own laws and constitution.  As well as redistributing our wealth to China and India.  You can call me crazy but I have read those parts of the treaty,  it specifically says "government" but never mentions "elections" or "democracy" it is basically the first step to an unelected one world government.  Scary stuff :uhoh


Offline Bodhi

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #38 on: November 23, 2009, 07:40:31 PM »
Man made global warming is a farce that was cooked up to bilk money out of the public to subsidize the lavish lifestyles of those that do not care. 
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Offline Bronk

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #39 on: November 23, 2009, 07:49:42 PM »
Just my $.02 but I believe this GW is just ol' Mother Earth going through her natural phases. Some geologists say ice ages happen approx. every 30,000 years or so and that they are preceeded by climate warming. Don't know if the gurus are right or not (wasn't here 30k yrs ago), but it seems probable.

Didn't you get the memo? It's no longer GW,NOW it is "Global climate change"... sisnce it appears it's getting cooler now. :rolleyes:
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Offline CAP1

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #40 on: November 23, 2009, 09:38:35 PM »
i seriously believe that anyone that didn't already suspect something like this was hiding under a rock.

but then everyone calls me paranoid when i talk like this.
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Offline SIK1

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #41 on: November 23, 2009, 09:46:06 PM »
A lot of people say Al Gore is a hypocrite, but I don't think so.

As you can see he kisses cows instead of eating them. 

(Image removed from quote.)


Just remember that cow almost got away with forcing censorship onto us.
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Offline Chalenge

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #42 on: November 23, 2009, 10:13:31 PM »
We will have to stop producing so much CO2 so that we can continue eating red meat. Now I know there are some people (that shall go unnamed but we all know who I am talking about) that will try to keep all the beef to themselves. So we need to make sure that there is plenty to go around and that no one hoards it all. Even one here is well aware what happens when hordes hoard and we certainly dont want to go there. So... whats the solution? We stop buying chinese goods that are really american goods made in china? Stop driving cars that run on gas? Stop flying planes? Building computers? No more soda drinks? No more breathing? What then?

Just leave me some beef man!  :bolt:
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Offline CAP1

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #43 on: November 23, 2009, 11:02:59 PM »
We will have to stop producing so much CO2 so that we can continue eating red meat. Now I know there are some people (that shall go unnamed but we all know who I am talking about) that will try to keep all the beef to themselves. So we need to make sure that there is plenty to go around and that no one hoards it all. Even one here is well aware what happens when hordes hoard and we certainly dont want to go there. So... whats the solution? We stop buying chinese goods that are really american goods made in china? Stop driving cars that run on gas? Stop flying planes? Building computers? No more soda drinks? No more breathing? What then?

Just leave me some beef man!  :bolt:

the fact is that the earth cycles. it will cycle with humans living on it, and it will cycle long after humans are gone.
 for anyone to think that the human race(a speck of dust in the grand scheme of things) can actually affect mother earth in normal day to day living is pretty much asinine.
 when the earth has had enough, we'll disappear.........
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Offline Chalenge

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Re: Whistle blowing on Global Warming
« Reply #44 on: November 23, 2009, 11:17:15 PM »
Is Al Gore (the father of the internet) going to go to jail?  :confused:
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