Author Topic: While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)  (Read 261 times)

Offline Tac

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While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)
« on: January 05, 2002, 08:24:00 PM »
Did the P-38 (any model) have auto-retracting flaps? I know they had locks (later models I think) to prevent deployment when faster than 250mph, but did their flaps automatically retract?

Offline Widewing

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While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2002, 01:35:00 AM »
Quote
Originally posted by Tac:
Did the P-38 (any model) have auto-retracting flaps? I know they had locks (later models I think) to prevent deployment when faster than 250mph, but did their flaps automatically retract?

All P-38s flaps had three "automatic" positions, up, down and maneuver. In other words, the pilot could select either of these three and they would automatically stop at the desired position. In addition, the pilot could select any intermediate position between 'up' and 'maneuver'. Early Lightnings had a little glitch that was not fixed well until into J model production. If a pilot selected 'maneuver', then moved the lever slightly forward, then back to 'maneuver', the flaps would fully extend.
To avoid this, the pilot had to cycle the lever to 'up' before returning to 'maneuver'. This related to sequencing of the selector valve. A redesigned valve cured this.

That is the extent of the flaps being "automatic". However, If you want to know if the would "blow up" under aero loading, I can find nothing in the manuals to indicate that they would (or could as the case may be). Since the P-38 incorporated Fowler type flaps, not split flaps, I don't see how they would blow up. The flaps have rollers, which sit in rails. Operated by push-pull rods and cables, the flaps roll down and to the rear in their tracks. To get them to blow up, they would need to roll forward and up in the tracks. I don't see that as being likely.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Tac

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While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2002, 11:05:00 AM »
So in short, if a p38 at 200 mph with 1 notch of flaps goes past 250 mph the flaps will not retract on their own (either by having the wind blow them up or some automatic electrical system retracting it automatically).

"If a pilot selected 'maneuver', then moved the lever slightly forward, then back to 'maneuver', the flaps would fully extend"

Oy, I bet that was annoying  :)

Thnx for the info.

Offline Widewing

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While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2002, 02:42:00 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Tac:
So in short, if a p38 at 200 mph with 1 notch of flaps goes past 250 mph the flaps will not retract on their own (either by having the wind blow them up or some automatic electrical system retracting it automatically).

"If a pilot selected 'maneuver', then moved the lever slightly forward, then back to 'maneuver', the flaps would fully extend"

Oy, I bet that was annoying     :)

Thnx for the info.

My experience with flap system in older aircraft tells me that an automatic retraction feature is unlikely. Not to mention the potential dangers caused by a malfunction. Back in the mid 70s, I was a Flight Engineer on Navy C-131 transports. This is a military version of the old Convair 240. Due to restrictions on landing gear retraction (the mains retracted forward) and flap speed limits, we would have to execute a rather steep climbout to limit airspeed until the gear and flaps were retracted. Otherwise, the gear and/or flaps could sustain damage. Although this was a large twin-engine type, those two R-2800 engines could still provide enough thrust to quickly exceed VnE limits on gear and flaps if the crew was not paying attention. In any twin, single engine control speed is critical. Therefore, you pulled up the gear as soon as possible (especially if you were very heavy), not only to reduce the risk of damaging the gear, but to get to minimum single-engine speed as quickly as possible. I no longer have a copy of the NATOPS, so I cannot be any more specific. It's been a long time since I last flew in one of those (nearly 24 years).

Here's one of the aircraft that I crewed. I'm not sure where the photo was taken.

   

My regards,

Widewing

[ 01-06-2002: Message edited by: Widewing ]
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Tac

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While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2002, 08:34:11 PM »
Hey Widewing, Do you off hand know, which external fuel tanks are carried by the P-38  (MK #'s is what I am looking for) ? J model?

Friend of mine needs to know (and I wouldnt mind the info either :) )

Offline Widewing

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While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)
« Reply #5 on: January 17, 2002, 10:28:34 PM »
Quote
Originally posted by Tac
Hey Widewing, Do you off hand know, which external fuel tanks are carried by the P-38  (MK #'s is what I am looking for) ? J model?

Friend of mine needs to know (and I wouldnt mind the info either :) )


I can't find any reference to a part number or type, other than general descriptions. I have looked thru Bodie's and Deans books.

My regards,

Widewing
My regards,

Widewing

YGBSM. Retired Member of Aces High Trainer Corps, Past President of the DFC, retired from flying as Tredlite.

Offline Tac

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While yer around here Widewing, a quick question =)
« Reply #6 on: January 18, 2002, 12:31:26 AM »
Thanks for the effort. A fellow AH pilot is actually restoring a 38J here in florida, he needed to know the reference to purchase them.



and fly knits will ya? I need to wing you not shoot you *G*