Author Topic: Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)  (Read 704 times)

Offline brady

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« on: December 03, 2000, 05:32:00 PM »
 
   Some Lancasters carried a Rose-Rice rear power turret that had 2 .50 cal. MG's in it, some also had a single .50 cal MG in the ventral position instead of the H2S installation.(of course the MK I Lancaster had the ventral turret with 2 303 mg's in it), this is food for thought having flow a few gunner flights in a Lancaster caused me to "comb" my memory banks for a better defensive package for our daytime Lancaster.
  On a slightly different note How about the 8,000lb and 12,000lb bomb's? will we get them in the future?

     Brady



Offline RAM

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #1 on: December 03, 2000, 05:38:00 PM »
13mm MGs for Ju88A-4 were way more common than those changes for the Lancaster.

 

Offline juzz

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #2 on: December 03, 2000, 05:41:00 PM »
Uhm - it already has the 2x.50in tail turret...

Offline SOB

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #3 on: December 03, 2000, 05:45:00 PM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by RAM:
13mm MGs for Ju88A-4 were way more common than those changes for the Lancaster.

 

...And my truck could have been equipped with a passenger side power seat, but it only has it on the drivers side.  What in the hell does either have to do with what Brady's asking?

Keep the conspiracy in your pocket...it's getting real old.


SOB
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Offline RAM

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #4 on: December 03, 2000, 05:49:00 PM »
 
Quote
Originally posted by SOB:
What in the hell does either have to do with what Brady's asking?

That he is asking for a quite rare weapons configuration for the Lancaster, when the Ju88A-4 hasn't the standard one.

I think that to ask for those Lancaster options is unfair, at least if other planes have much worse problems.


Offline SOB

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #5 on: December 03, 2000, 06:03:00 PM »
Now that made sense...why didn't ya just say that in the first place  


SOB
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Hans

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #6 on: December 03, 2000, 09:06:00 PM »
As you guys haven't been paying attention in class, I am about to yell really loud so there is no confusion...excuse me (ahead of time)...


THE LANCASTER IN ACES HIGH ALREADY HAS THE TWIN .50 CALIBER MACHINEGUN REAR TURRET!

Thank you.

However, the weapons listed in the hangar selection menu don't mention them, just the four .303 guns of the top and front turret.

Hans.

Offline brady

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #7 on: December 03, 2000, 10:24:00 PM »
   
   Well Now that is Illumnating! TY gentailmen. learn somthing new every day ,Now my book's on the lancaster are a little vauge as to how often the Ventrail .50cal was used eny data out their???

     Brady

Offline Fishu

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #8 on: December 03, 2000, 11:31:00 PM »
Lancaster has twin .50 caliber in the rear turret, even though it does not seem to mention it.
Those 4x.303 turrets seems to be 2x.303 turrets according to 3d model..
Lancaster is messy isn't it?

1. it does not list brownings
2. 3d model shows twin machinegun turrets, no 4 in any


Ju-88A-4 also was possible to fit with 20mm cannon in the nose.
There were also 1000kg bombs for inner racks!
in AH we dont.. sniff
From picture I've seen that those bombs are ugly and big.

doh.. now I remember what I was supposed to do one day, go to library to search for the book about Ju-88 which had pictures of one with 20mm.

Offline Replicant

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2000, 02:16:00 AM »
Hi

Here you can see a picture of a Lancaster with the belly turret.  It has 2x.303 MGs.  These were used by most Lancaster's until about end of 1943 where half were removed because there were cumbersome and of little use.  Some Groups did use them until the end of the war though.  The Lancaster also used a top 4x.303 turret design for awhile and some were lucky to have the 2x.50 turret by the end of the war.

 

Regards

Nexx
NEXX

Hans

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2000, 04:29:00 AM »
 
Quote
Those 4x.303 turrets seems to be 2x.303 turrets according to 3d model.  Lancaster is messy isn't it?

No, there is nothing wrong with the Lancaster.

2+2=4

As I already said, the Hangar doesn't list the 2 .50 caliber machineguns in the tail.  It should say "4 .303 machineguns 2 .50 machineguns."

Offline juzz

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2000, 04:47:00 AM »
Anyway, I'd be more worried about the Lancasters FM than its defensive guns.

Offline Fishu

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2000, 08:49:00 AM »
btw. I have model of Lancaster which has 4x.303 turrets  
front, top and rear turrets.

Offline Replicant

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2000, 11:10:00 AM »
Something you may find interesting....

This is taken from the AFDU Tactical Trials Report 30 May 1942.
Corkscrew
"This evasion consists of a steep diving turn of about 30 degrees and 500ft, followed by a steep climbing turn of 30 degrees and 500ft in the opposite direction. The manoeuvre must be as violent as possible, particularly at the top and bottom of the corkscrew, to avoid giving an easy deflection shot. It should begin when the first fighter attacking is at 600yards and should be continued throughout the engagement unless all the fighters attacking can be clearly seen by the Controller to be out of position, when normal flight can be resumed. This evasion is tiring for the pilot and must be stopped immediately it is clear that immediate attacks are developing. The main advantage of corkscrewing are that the bomber can make good its course, while the fighter is given difficult deflection in two dimensions in that it has to aim in front and below during the diving turn, and in front and above during the climb. Assessment of fighters' cine camera guns film proved in the case of Lancaster, as with other 4-engined bombers, that even the most experienced of fighter pilots who knew that the evasion was to be were able to obtain moderate results. Height can be maintained without any extra throttle opening when the Lancaster is without bomb load, but when fully loaded slight opening is necessary to regain height in the climbing turn. This evasion does not affect the air gunner's shooting as much as a tight turn and did not prevent them from obtaining good cine camera gun results when they became used to the movement".

Tight Turn
"The Lancaster is sufficiently manoeuvrable to be able to do a very tight turn and if this is timed correctly, a fighter who is making an attack at a fast overtaking speed is given a difficult deflection and only a short burst of fire. Against a steep diving attack, a slightly climbing turn is advisable but against a normal stern attack, a diving turn is best as it enables the Lancaster to gain speed. The tight turn is the best evasion against a single fighter provided that it is correctly timed - at about 600 yards - and that there is no question of shortage of petrol or other fighters coming up to engage the bomber. Under the latter circumstances, or if more than one fighter is attacking, the corkscrew evasion is more effective, because it enables the bomber to maintain a course and height instead of flying circles".

Head-on attacks
"Were carried out against the Lancaster but were difficult to deliver owing to its high speed. It is often possible for the Lancaster to prevent the attack developing by edging towards the fighter when it is trying to get into position. If the attack is delivered, a diving turn at about 800yards is effective and gives the fighter an extremely difficult deflection allowance. The mid-upper gunner, who will be facing forwards for this type of attack, is given a reasonable shot".

The report continues for defending whilst in formation where they have to change the procedure slightly.

Quite a good report (lots more information in full report), obviously early with it being 1942 so it could have changed somewhat by the end of WWII.


Regards

Nexx
NEXX

Offline Pongo

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Lancasters & the Rose-Rice rear turet (.50 cal)
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2000, 08:45:00 PM »
Thanks for posting that picture of the Lanc with the belly gun. Would be cool to randomly put it on Lancs in the game. Cant tell till you climb up for the belly shot whether it is there or not.