Pyro : 109 G-10

[Nath-BDP]

Hmm... only a prototype? I suggest you visit the Champlin Fighter Museum they have a D-13 there that was piloted by Franz Gotz of JG 26.

The first is Gotz' D13:
 
   

and a D9:
 
   

I'm sure you can spot the differences in them.

[This message has been edited by Nath-BDP (edited 08-01-2000).]

[funked]

Yes I've been to Champlin.  However I doubt JG 26 flew the plane, regardless of the paint scheme applied by the museum.

This aircraft has been at times identified by the museum as a D-12 or a D-13.

They also have a Spanish 109 that they identify as a Bf 109E, and a Spitfire two-place trainer that they cobbled up so they could call it a Mk. IX.

I'm not at all certain the museum has any idea what the Fw aircraft is.  And even though they know what their Spit and 109 are, they choose to misrepresent their identities.  So to put it mildly, I don't put any confidence in their identification of their Fw 190D.

In any case the specifications of the D-12 and D-13 prototypes overlapped, so it's probably not worth arguing about.    


[This message has been edited by funked (edited 08-01-2000).]

[Nath-BDP]

2 pictures of the D-13 at Champlin,

   

   

You can tell thats a D-13 by the deletion of the MG131 from the nose and replaced by a MG151/20 firing through the propellor and the enlarged oil cooler intake.

Hmm... that D-13 did see service, perhaps only 1 or 2 sorties in May of 45.

BTW, you can tell the difference between the D-12 and the D-13 quite easily, look at the propellor muzzle, D-12s used 30mm Mk 108s and the D-13 used MG 151/20.

------------------
Geschwaderkommodore JG 54
"Grünherz"

 

[This message has been edited by Nath-BDP (edited 08-01-2000).]

[funked]

Actually if you get a good look at the plane in person... it's just a blast tube sticking out of the nose, not a gun barrel.  I'm willing to bet that if you pulled the cowling off, there's an empty space where the gun would be.

And as you can see in the photos the blast tube is of much larger diameter than the wing MG 151/20 barrel.  A 30mm or 20mm shell could pass through the tube with equal ease.

Finally, about half of the D-12 had MK 108, half had MG 151/20.

The hole in the spinner is not sufficient to differentiate D-12 from D-13.

The only other spec differences I have found are in avionics and the engine, Jumo 213F vs. 213E.  But even this was mixed - D-12s used both the E and F, and of the two D-13 prototypes, one was to use the E and the other the F.

I definitely think it is possible that JG 26 got one of the handful of D-12s or even a D-13 prototype.  D-12 seems more likely because there is evidence that prototypes were completed and flown.  D-13 prototypes appear to have never been completed, and series production certainly did not occur.


[This message has been edited by funked (edited 08-02-2000).]

[Vermillion]

Hmm...

There were 6 Super Corsairs F2G-1 Prototypes, maybe we can have one of them instead  

------------------
Vermillion
**MOL**, Men of Leisure
"Real Men fly Radials, Nancy Boys fly Spitfires"

[StSanta]

Wow, that 190 is BEAUTIFUL.

No allied opportunist designers can ever design something that good looking.

Well, maybe if they copied the G10.

 



------------------
StSanta
JG54 "Grünherz"

[Toad]

 

Originally posted by StSanta:
No allied opportunist designers can ever design something that good looking.

Maybe they just knew it wasn't an art contest!

 

"Just win, baby!"  Al Davis, Oakland

[StSanta]

LOL!

------------------
StSanta
JG54 "Grünherz"

[funked]

You're right, no Allied designer would be under so much pressure that he would commit so many design detail blunders, bumps, wrinkles, and other protuberances that made Luftwaffe planes slower than Allied planes with the same amount of horsepower.    

[This message has been edited by funked (edited 08-02-2000).]