Dispersion comparison

[Jigster]

 

 


Removed most of the errors from the one in this thread (ie actual comparison):
 http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum1/HTML/006835.html

Basically, launched north, hit F5, max zoom, then panned until directly behind the plane. The images are different sizes because I cropped and they have different wing spans (and the Tiff shoots at a very high angle).
Then, expanded a circle from the center of the conversion point and expanded till it touched the tracer round(s) the furthest away from the center. This takes into account both the highest point of the arc (using the smoke trail for reference) and the lowest point. Using the rounds to the most outer point of the cone gives a circle, where anywhere inside there is a chance a bullet will strike a given point.

After making the circles I copied to another image for easier comparison. I'll prolly do these over again once 1.05 comes out to see what the change did.

Btw this isn't meant to be concrete by anymeans but it gives a fairly accurate account of how the guns disperse after 5 seconds of fire.

- Jig

[Citabria]

p38 and f4u dispersion patterns got mixed up along with the turn rates  

[funked]

Nice job Jig.  Not very scientific but it's the best we've got.  Thanks for doing it.

Cit, do you get different figures than Niklas for sustained turn rates?  His tests at sea level show the P-38L performing significantly better than the rest of the US planes. http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum9/HTML/000799.html

[Karnak]

Interesting.  I wonder why the F4U is so tight?  I wonder if that is an advantage or disadvantage for long range, spray and pray, shooting?

Jigster,
Could you add the N1K2-J into the fold?

Thanks

Sisu
-Karnak

[Jigster]

I'll put the N1K2, Yak and La5 in tomorrow.

- Jig

PS Given the density of shells in that circle, if you do get within it there's a very high chance you'll take a hit (or several) even at range.

It's kinda arbitrary right now because of the change coming in 1.05

[StSanta]

Heh, that would explain the f4u lethality a bit.

Notice that the 190 is worst. Anti LW conspiracy, I tell ya!

 .



------------------
StSanta
9./JG 54 "Grünherz"

[danish]

Interesting.
Jigster: care to do the G10 without gondolas, and
the Yak as well?

danish

[This message has been edited by danish (edited 12-16-2000).]

[This message has been edited by danish (edited 12-16-2000).]

[juzz]

What convergence settings were used on the a/c?

[Andy Bush]

I'm a little confused with all of this...or maybe I'm not seeing the point.

Dispersion, by itself, has little to do with convergence/harmonization. It is a measure of percentage of impacts as a function of angle (usually in mils)...not distance or size. For example, a gun might have a dispersion of 80% within a 5 mil circle, meaning 80% of rounds fired impact within a 5 mil diameter circle. This is for ANY range within reason.

I don't claim to have spent hours on the subject, but I've looked at the a/c using one of the custom sights...

 

...and it seems to me that all wing guns have pretty much the same dispersion...somewhere around plus/minus one tick mark from the center pipper.

My thought is that the size of this dispersion is of generous size...which is a nice way of saying it looks awfully big!

Please note that firing a long burst and then watching the resulting tracer paths is not dispersion!  

Andy

[Jigster]

I used 350yrds on each plane. All this basically shows is how far a round can stray from the convergence setting through the length of this shell's life in AH. Some stay very dense (F4U-1C, Spit, G10) and others have no density at all (P-38, FW).

All the guns move back in forth across the gunsight during fire (I assume this recoil and other gun effects) but on some planes the density at a given point in time is drastically different. The 1C keeps a very uniform pattern, where as the Typhoon is much like a scatter gun, covering a much larger area with smae approx. number of shells.

Note the smoke from the gun barrels, they are the only good indicator of the shell flight path once it leaves the barrel. The left, inner cannon on the Typhoon is a good example...the tracer smoke comes so far right it could be normal 200 or 150 yrds convergence setting, where as the rest of the shells follow the 350 yrds convergence line.

Again, this isn't very scientific but there's really no other way to measure it without a virtual gun range  

- Jig

[Yeager]

Dont get me started!

Yeager

[RAM]

I've seen quite many times planes crossing my sights with me firing and getting no hits.

Fw190's guns' dispersion is simply insane.

[GRUNHERZ]

Hi

HTC you guys cant ignore this stuff anymore what the hell is your deal with the chog anyway? Cmon havent you guys seen enough evidence yet? Sorry but you cant keep ignoring this for much longer? Plese post anything on the chog gun issue, even if its just telling im full of toejam and shoud shut up  , but please post something, as long as it shows that you guys care and arent just ignoring our ever growing concern over the chog gun issue.  Please

thanks GRUNHERZ

[SOB]

None of this makes a whole hell of a lot of difference since bullet dispersion is being changed across the board in 1.05.  How 'bout you wait until then, and squeak about that gunnery model    

   

Posted by Pyro in http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/Smileys/default/Forum9/HTML/001063.html
We also made a change to bullet dispersion to make them weighted towards the center of the cone of fire.

SOB


[This message has been edited by SOB (edited 12-16-2000).]

[Jigster]

Next time the disclaimers get bold tags, sigh.

Btw the FW actually has about the same density of the 1C up to 300 yards. Past that, however, they go everywhere.

This information will probably be useless once 1.05 comes so hold your comments till then.