The M4 Firefly, a perfect tank...

[save]

i dont play GV in this game , to me its just not good enough compared with its competition.
Otoh the competitor sucks in flying department ...

I want more hardcore , but thats just me, and I dont want to deny them finding its fun to GV in here.


And yes, I have  long IRL experience from tanks.

[stodd]

Sherman costs to much in relation to the Tiger.

[Lusche]

Sherman costs to much in relation to the Tiger.

You must be kidding

[stodd]

You must be kidding

Crap!!! I reversed that and cant edit it.   My bad,  I meant the tiger costs too much in relation to the Sherman. M4 perk cost should increase.
 
 Ok im gonna shut up now.  

[stephen]

I hate to see this thread die..., but die it must, <S> and thank you for the help.

Hopefuly our voices will not only be heard, but acted upon 

[stodd]

I doubt it. (m4 is Way over modeled or under perked.)

[1carbine]

They need to fix the gunsight first, it's off, there's a thread on here somewhere.

[stephen]

Funny thing...., there is more than enough outcry concerning the M4's un-historical virtues to warrant a second look at its modeling within the confines of this game, though seemingly nothing is being done about it, and no thought has been given to bringing its historical failings to reality...

Perhaps starting another thread isnt the answer...?
When might we expect the Sherman to act as a Sherman should under the bombardment of the vaunted Tiger?
Or at the very least, blow up whenever an 88mm hits its sponson, where the ammunition is stored?

[Karnak]

Why is the T-34/85's turret so soft?  The armor levels listed for it don't stand out as being particularly weak as I recall.  Not any worse that the T-34/76, no?

[Ack-Ack]

M4 is still very bad against Il2's and B25h's where as the Tiger is not Invincible...but Very hard to kill/damage with just bullets.

A B-25H will kill a Tiger just as easily as it will kill a Firefly in one shot.  There isn't a tank in this game that can't be killed with one well placed shot from an IL2 or B-25H.

ack-ack

[OOZ662]

Tiger is just as vulnerable to the B-25H as the Firefly is.  It is quite easy to take out a Tiger in a single shot with the 75mm cannon, just need to know where to place the shot.


ack-ack

A B-25H will kill a Tiger just as easily as it will kill a Firefly in one shot.  There isn't a tank in this game that can't be killed with one well placed shot from an IL2 or B-25H.

ack-ack

Losing his mind... Agreed, though. The engine deck of the Tiger is squishy.

[jay]

IMO it all depends on the driver of the vehicle

[Lusche]

Why is the T-34/85's turret so soft?  The armor levels listed for it don't stand out as being particularly weak as I recall.  Not any worse that the T-34/76, no?

This is what I'm wondering too. I tried to look up the numbers and did not found any reduction in armor thickness.on any face. Yet the /85 turret is like paper. For me, this is most notably when upping my Hurricane IID against incoming tanks. Taking out a T-34/85 turret is no problem at all, while the /76 is the most difficult tank to kill in a Hurri D by a huge margin.

[321BAR]

Sponson?   

BTW, the front armor of a Sherman is thicker than the T-34s, and the front of the turret much thicker than the Panzer's.  Methinks your problem with the Sherman is that you are basing your expectations on reputation rather than stats.

BTW - I've also put Tiger rounds into the sides of Panzers and done squat only to have them kill me before I could get the second shot off.  There are also plenty of anectotes of M-3s and M-8s surviving more than one would think possible.  Shot placement and (at times a seemingly inordinate amount of) luck are involved killing vehicles in the game, and the Shermans are not the only ones to "benefit" from this at times.

yes this is true... there is actually a full 89mm of armor slapped into the front of the turret... This defends against panzers very well... many people think the Sherman was crappy for poor armor etc... The only reason the 75mm version was poor was due to gasoline burn rate/explosion and not diesel fuel slow burn (aka why tankers called it a death trap), ammo storage placement, and penetration power. this is why it was upgraded to the 76mm. In Africa, the M4 75mm Sherman was evenly matched vs. the early Pnzr IIIs and the Pnzr IVs that have no sheet armor on the sides... (bringing up the fact as to why the Pnzr IV dies so easily when shot on the sides... This armor sheet was to protect against AP rounds forcing them to explode before hitting the actual tank... can someone PLEASE ANSWER WHY!?!?!?)
tiger rounds into the sides of panzers... where exactly? shoot near the engine block or the front. and if you aim for the turret base you will usually kill them instantly... the M3 M8 survival thing i believe is due to the AP rounds shooting FULLY THROUGH an M3/M16 without an explosion... I've actually had more effect shooting HE at these soft targets, ive even killed them by shooting directly next to them and the HE round explodes killing the vehicle. you can even do it to M8s sometimes...
      BUT the AP rounds should still be able to shoot through an M8 without pinging off the side slant armor...
      The T34/85 turret is actually weak compared to the /76 turret armor in game... and i have not seen any outside info as to why the /85's turret is so easily shot... In fact the entire tank seems weaker than the T34/76 except the gun...

[W7LPNRICK]

Yes, some things need tweaking...See "One Shot Kills" in this section somewhere? Tiger and M4 both can be easily killed even with a panzer and light t-34. Also, there are very few small trees which would deflect the tiger or M-4 course at speed, much less stop them dead, but a 10-20lbs(?) shell traveling near the speed of sound is not going to stop at a bush or deflect enough, from a small limb, to save the tank from repeated hits....and I've been running into these trees painted on impenetrable glass lately. You cannot shoot through it, drive through it, or see objects beyond them accurately. Yes some things need to be tweaked.