Jug D-11 Uber Alles

[Saurdaukar]

I can't be the first to realize just how awesome the 11 is.  Screw the M.

My 109 fetish is in serious danger of being supplanted by a sexual innuendo-laced milk bottle. 

BUT... wish it had more twisty-type tricks.  Vet 47 drivers: in a near-stall speed rolling scissor on the deck (read: no alt to recover E), is the torque produced by the P&W simply not capable of twisting the aircraft around and over the top or an I doing something wrong?

[76646]

I pick the N over any of them. Whooped many a M driver in a N model! 

[Strip]

Your doing something wrong, a seasoned P-47 pilot can keep her flying and pulling the nose around.

Over the top you will see 50-70 mph, just enough to keep the bird from falling out of the sky.....

Film would help!

Strip

[Plazus]

I can't be the first to realize just how awesome the 11 is.  Screw the M.

My 109 fetish is in serious danger of being supplanted by a sexual innuendo-laced milk bottle. 

BUT... wish it had more twisty-type tricks.  Vet 47 drivers: in a near-stall speed rolling scissor on the deck (read: no alt to recover E), is the torque produced by the P&W simply not capable of twisting the aircraft around and over the top or an I doing something wrong?

I bet if you hit your WEP at the top, you will get a bit of engine torque. The nice thing about all the jugs is that they are so heavy that the engine's torque effect is minimal compared to the likes of the 109. Its heavy size also means the gun platform is more stable too. However, you you put your jug into a 50-75mph stall with your nose pointed straight up, the torque will pull your plane to the left. I have flown the jug for a long time, and one of the things you want to avoid is sustained vertical manuevers. Utilize more high and low yo-yos instead. The jug can hold E forever, but can bleed it in a fraction of a second if youre not careful. Smooth stick control and E management is critical for success in the jug.  

[Lepape2]

Sometimes, you are stuck in such situation that you don't have a choice and you must roll to the right at the top to win the scissor reversal. If a R/H snap roll doesn't do the trick, do it with chopped throttle(just for a fraction of a second), even with 100ft of play. Don't even think of just using the ailerons to roll you around. Otherwise, you are just too slow already and its best just to try to keep its nose up or knife it down quickly.

I don't fly the D11 much but it still does very well compared to other more powerful Jugs. Even though it turns slightly better, it can only do so for a very short time. But with those 8 cals, it just takes 1 or 2 turns with good aim and its over. Very vulnerable against E fighters though (K4, P38, La7, etc) .. as long as they don't turn with you 

Too bad I didn't film the D11 deck turn fight I had VS a zeke a long time ago... lasted for 5 mins and finally shot him down (had to extend 2-3 times)... couldn't believe it 

Great bird. 

[FLS]

Plazus I think you're confusing engine torque with the torque effect of the spiral slipstream.

[Saurdaukar]

The nice thing about all the jugs is that they are so heavy that the engine's torque effect is minimal compared to the likes of the 109. Its heavy size also means the gun platform is more stable too.

Answer I was looking for - thanks.   

(Others: "Over the top" was a poor choice of words.  Not sure what else to call the very top of a rolling scissor as one firewalls (or chops) the throttle to roll the AC at low speed in the absence of any real control surface authority.)

[bj229r]

I pick the N over any of them. Whooped many a M driver in a N model! 

Yup, haven't been kilt yet by an M--get them to drain off some of their light speed, and they are toast

[Wingnutt]

the D11 certainly "feels" the lightest of the jugs.  only its anemic climb and acceleration cause me to choose the M over it, but even still I take it sometimes just because.

get in a nice full flap wallow fest on the deck and if you fly the jug to its full potential the other guy will very often either just run out of fly and auger, or will give you the passing shot you need, which with 8 50s doesn't need to be much for very long.

its not a VERY agile aircraft, but it IS more agile than most people expect, which is where its lethality is, all to often the other guy assumes you cannot match his turn or manuever and by the time he realizes his error, hes in the tower still hearing the hit sounds for several seconds.

2 tips:

1: unless your going on a dedicated bomber hunt, take the light ammo load 8 gun pack, it gives you a little extra climb and overall maneuverability, which in a jug can mean the edge ya need, and you still have over 2000 rounds, more than enough to shoot down a couple sets of buffs should the opportunity arise.

2: if you take 3/4  or a full tank,  make sure you switch to the main and leave the AUX with a 1/4 in it.   the jug (in AH) is notorious for getting main fuel hit, and it drains QUICK..  and its pretty much a death sentence unless your at 20k or right next to your base.  Oil on the other hand.. you have the middle east in your plane, she will go several sectors with an oil leak.

[Slade]

if you take 3/4  or a full tank,  make sure you switch to the main and leave the AUX with a 1/4 in it.

Great suggestion! 

Does it affect maneuverability if running on the AUX tank with the MAIN fully drained?

Thanks,

Slade 

[Saurdaukar]

I have been leaving the aux tank half full.

Your comments about the main's propensity to attract fast-flying, cone-shaped pieces of metal have been observed.  

Why does the D-11 seem to carry less fuel than all other Jugs?  I know the N has those extra 18 inches for the wing tanks, but all the other D's and the M, so far as I can tell, simply seem to have a larger main tank.  Is this true?

[Stoney]

I have been leaving the aux tank half full.

Your comments about the main's propensity to attract fast-flying, cone-shaped pieces of metal have been observed.  

Why does the D-11 seem to carry less fuel than all other Jugs?  I know the N has those extra 18 inches for the wing tanks, but all the other D's and the M, so far as I can tell, simply seem to have a larger main tank.  Is this true?

The late model D Jugs had a larger main tank than the early Ds.  Its represented in the difference in fuel load (75 gallons I think) between the D-11 and the D-25, D-40, and M.  As far as fuel load affecting the stability of the Jug, both the main and aux tanks are located very close to the center of gravity and therefore, don't cause a large problem for manual fuel selection.  I feel the extra weight in turning or climbing, but not in stability.

The roll rate, on the other hand, IMO, is noticeably affected by the extra ammo in the wings (or by the extra fuel in the N Jug).  I almost always fly with the light 8X load.

[RTHolmes]

make sure you switch to the main and leave the AUX with a 1/4 in it.

I leave 1/4-1/3 in the aux, thats about a sector to get you home. I see I'm not the only one

[bj229r]

I have been leaving the aux tank half full.

Your comments about the main's propensity to attract fast-flying, cone-shaped pieces of metal have been observed.  

Why does the D-11 seem to carry less fuel than all other Jugs?  I know the N has those extra 18 inches for the wing tanks, but all the other D's and the M, so far as I can tell, simply seem to have a larger main tank.  Is this true?

I guess if ya are used to 109's, trying to see stuff out of D-11 isn't so big a deal. Aside from that, I'd probably only fly it (instead of N). Dunno, maybe if I just flew the thing nonstop for a month, I'd get used to it, like pedals. Anyhow, main in 'N' has same cone-shaped-thingie issue. Take off with 75%, run main dry, have about 17 min left in aux/wings. What's cool about latest fix, when I get the inevitable 'main fuel hit', it quits smoking when it's dry, so you aren't so much a bleeding animal in  a tank of sharks, looking for the wounded one

[Saurdaukar]

Im curious why some of you would choose the N over the M?

Range isnt an issue in the MA.  All Jugs are already strapped with hardpoints so taking a DT and dropping it provides no extra penalty... and the N's wing tanks, empty, must add more weight.

The rate of role must be slower as the wings are longer... but does that create more surface area, in spite of the clipped tips, improving loading?