What makes good cover?

[Nemisis]

OK, I was GV'ing today, and this panzer was pulled up under and a little behind this tree, so as to make my AP rounds somehow "detonate" on the tree (we need that fixed BTW). Everytime I try anything like that, I get blasted from beyond any reasonable range of response.

It seems every tree, barn, house, and friendly tank  I use for cover, the enemy has ranged immediatly. Am I picking cover that is too conspicous, or am I just damn unlucky?

I would like to sit in on a good GV'er too see what I'm doing wrong, anyone good on the boards, or will I have to hunt them down in the MA?

[DEEC0NX]

No, I too have this problem  I hate when they pull under a low branch and every round you fire either hits dirt infront of them, or detonates on the branch  and whenever I try that, there rounds come through like I was sitting out in an open field  so dont worry, it's not just you

[JHerne]

Just my opinion (and I'm in the top 100 as a GV'er but I'm not a great GVer like Rondar or DR7, I consider myself average), is that the closer you get to the spawn point, the more likely you are to get ranged quickly and killed.

Practice spawn camping from longer ranges, or (if you can find it now with these new maps) higher ground. Shooting uphill is much more difficult in terms of ranging than shooting downhill.

There's a few tricks that I use for spawn camping (or taking up an ambush position) such as pre-ranging an area, using my mouse cursor to mark a target, pressing up-arrow and saving head position (F10) prior to zooming into the gunsight, etc. You probably already know this stuff, but its my approach.

Spawn camping from 3000 meters out, with pre-ranging, usually means they have to fire 3-4 shots before it becomes worry-some (unless you're dealing with a good GVer). If you're pre-ranged and can hit them in your second or third shot, you've gained the advantage.

Another piece of advice is to find multiple shooting positions, and always be able to get out of their line of sight if you need to. Hull-down positions on the tops of hills, or firing from a tree blind, can usually be found on a spawn. If you stay in one place for too long, they'll eventually figure out where you are and fixate on that spot each time they spawn in.

Just my two cents.

J

[Nemisis]

Well, I wasn't spawn camping, I was breaking a spwan camp. I eventually flanked him out, and got a side shot on him.

My max effective shooting range is around 2500 yds since after that, minute variations in aimpoint begin to have a noticable effect. When spawn camping,  I pick out a primary, secondary, and tertiary shooting position, all able to be reached in the time it would take to die, salute, and then respawn about 3 times.

It seems that on the Trinity and Compello maps that have been runing a lot (very annoying), a lot of the spawns are either level or just slightly above the bases. There are some that are below, but whenever I spawn camp, I have to spend another 5 minutes skirting the mass uppers, and by the time I'm back there, they've all left the spawn.

[SmokinLoon]

The only cover you can count on, time and time again, is the ground.  If you can find a mound to hide behind, or just barely get your gun up and over a ridge line, then you've got the best cover in the game.

However, I've seen some gamers cozy up to a hillside and get their gun barrel through the terrain and still be able to see and fire.     

[KG45]

as a dedicated GVer, i rarely camp. too boring rather set up an ambush near town or airfield. once i get a kill, i move somewhere else.

but, alot of my game is porking fields and killing towns, i'm not a great 1v1 tanker.

[BigKev03]

One time I got into position behind one of the barns that have the side blown out and was able to angle my tank to look out the side of the barn.  I had a pretty good field of vision and was able to fire on the other GV's and they had to be accurate to get a shot through the barn and hit me.  Of course in the game I have noticed that it requires you to have to watch your flanks alot and if we were in real armored combat that would be the job of another tank.  I have not been able to get back into that prime position again since that day I guess when I try it now I am either to far back or to far in the barn.  I will say that day I had 36 kills before I got bombed and for a panzer vs. the M4 and T34 i consider that good with the amount of vehicles at that spawn.  Like another poster said a good hill or knoll with you n hull down position is your best chance.  Another thing I do is that if I am spawn camping or in ambush is I dont shoot at every vehicle that I see.  Sometimes it is better to just sit there and observe before you shoot.  With the M4 if you are in good cover (trees) you are hard to pick up unless you fire or the enemy takes his time to scan and by that time you or someone else has killed them.

BigKev

[Nemisis]

Back when I was part of ~The Guardians~, I would have a "wingman" in another tank (same one as me), a few support guys in an M3, 2 (1 wirb, 1 osti), and a spotter flying in a B-17. The spotter plane was actually a 2 man team, a pilot and a gunner. He would circle around a vehicle, and his gunner would fire at it with the gun possitions. We racked up quite a lot of time doing those types of missions.

Point is that we were doing it realisticly, if a compressed version, we had some tanks, some support forces, and we had aircover.

And kev, they will be killed only if there is no high ground over looking your possition. I usually try to look a valley over before entering it: I get hull down behind the crest of the hill, I look the clumps of trees near where I will be working over one at a time, and THEN I go down from my hill.

[JHerne]

The new flattened maps have changed the dynamic for sure. When we had those small knolls and such, it was easy to park 3 tanks - one in the middle, one on each side, and use that small hill to minimize your profile.

Big Kev made a very good point - don't shoot at everything you see. If I'm set up with a good shooting position from long to medium range, I'll shoot at anything I see. If I'm closer up and the target is moving to my left or right, I'll leave it for a tank that's on one of my flanks.

J

[OOZ662]

I'll admit I skipped much of this thread, so bear with me if I'm repeating.

Trees are a confusing piece of cover due to the angles that come up in this game and how kills work. (Note that trees do not need to be "fixed" as to blocking AP shells; that is their purpose along with prematurely detonating bombs.) I scored many kills myself by firing downward into the "tip" of the frontal armor on a tank. The shell passes through the "legs" of the driver. When the driver is killed, the tank explodes. Taking cover in trees can protect you from one angle, but generally a small movement by your opponent can give them a clean shot while you're stuck looking at leaves.

[Nemisis]

Thats a good point OOZ, a move of about 15 feet got me a clean shot on him.

[Lusche]

Something related:

In many instances, the best "cover" is not to remain stationary, particularly when there is the same guy upping repeatedly, or your enemies come into range one by one. Your position will get known, you will get ranged, you will eventually get flanked (the enemy may even use your cover against you). Also prominent landmarks, even when being good cover, will help enemy communications (he is by that barn/windmill/whatever). Once ranged & spotted, you will eventually get killed by determined foes, no matter how little of you can be seen.
Shoot & scoot. Confuse them. Even the best ambush location has to be left at some point... to catch the flanking enemy unaware.

[Nemisis]

I have a perfect example of what lusche is talking about.

Yesterday, I upped a panzer from S spawn to the N side of a surrounded V base, when the fighting was by the N spawn of a S base. I caught killed 3 of them from behind, before an M4 nailed me at (just gessing here) 3500 yds. After that, I left them alone for a bit, and then reupped with an M4, got one of the spawn campers going RTB. I moved away from where I had shot him, and into a thicket of trees to nail him when he reupped. I shot him at point blank range, and stayed where I was (it was an instant kill, so he can't have seen where I was), only to get him another time. I moved closer to the base, and started picking off the defenders at long range, only to be outflanked and killed by a panzer at under 1000yds.

[DEEC0NX]

I have a perfect example of what lusche is talking about.

Yesterday, I upped a panzer from S spawn to the N side of a surrounded V base, when the fighting was by the N spawn of a S base. I caught killed 3 of them from behind, before an M4 nailed me at (just gessing here) 3500 yds. After that, I left them alone for a bit, and then reupped with an M4, got one of the spawn campers going RTB. I moved away from where I had shot him, and into a thicket of trees to nail him when he reupped. I shot him at point blank range, and stayed where I was (it was an instant kill, so he can't have seen where I was), only to get him another time. I moved closer to the base, and started picking off the defenders at long range, only to be outflanked and killed by a panzer at under 1000yds.

Yeah, you were doing pretty good! I was completely failing that night. Stupid trees did nothing for cover for me, and I was getting shot through my smoke screen 

[Nemisis]

Your smoke screen doesn't help after I have you ranged. Thats the problem: if your good, you can guess how far you were off by on your last hit, and correct. If you score a kill, you did it right. If not, then you have no way of knowing how far you were off, and probably screwed up your chanced of killing him without moving, or waiting for the smoke screen to wear off.