Mustang Mk I

[Ack-Ack]

They had 2 .50cals under the nose. as well. From the earlist version I thought they always had this. Later it was removed in the P-51B because of difficulties accessing them and reduced space due to the new engine setup.

It's also one of the reasons the Italians dropped them on the G.55 -- too hard to service and get to under there.

The P-51A only had 4x .50 calibers.


Model  -  P-51A
Production  -  310
Length  -  32.25
Height  -  12.2
Wingspan  -  37.04
Weight - empty  -  6433
Weight - normal T.O.  -  8600
Weight - max G.W.  -  10600
Powerplant  -  Allison V-1710-81
Horsepower  -  1200
Propeller  -  Curtiss 3-bladed electric 10'9"  
Max Speed  -  390 @ 20k
Service Ceiling  -  31,350
Fuel Capacity  -  180
Drop Tanks  -  2x 75 gal
Range  -  750 / 1375+
Guns  -  4x .50 cal - 1260 rounds
Bomb / Rockets  -  2x 500 lb bombs


I think the confusion lies with the designation that the USAAF used for the Mustang I (P-51), which leads a lot to think that this was the first fighter production model of the Mustang for the USAAF, when none of the P-51s saw operational service save for those that were converted to tactical recce planes (F-6A).  As I mentioned already, the first fighter production model for the USAAF was the P-51A, which in the RAF service was the Mustang II.  The P-51A had the .303 caliber machine guns removed as well as the two nose mounted .50 cals and added two more .50 cals to the wings to give the P-51A 4x .50 cals.

ack-ack

[AWwrgwy]

The P-51A only had 4x .50 calibers.


Model  -  P-51A
Production  -  310
Length  -  32.25
Height  -  12.2
Wingspan  -  37.04
Weight - empty  -  6433
Weight - normal T.O.  -  8600
Weight - max G.W.  -  10600
Powerplant  -  Allison V-1710-81
Horsepower  -  1200
Propeller  -  Curtiss 3-bladed electric 10'9"  
Max Speed  -  390 @ 20k
Service Ceiling  -  31,350
Fuel Capacity  -  180
Drop Tanks  -  2x 75 gal
Range  -  750 / 1375+
Guns  -  4x .50 cal - 1260 rounds
Bomb / Rockets  -  2x 500 lb bombs


I think the confusion lies with the designation that the USAAF used for the Mustang I (P-51), which leads a lot to think that this was the first fighter production model of the Mustang for the USAAF, when none of the P-51s saw operational service save for those that were converted to tactical recce planes (F-6A).  As I mentioned already, the first fighter production model for the USAAF was the P-51A, which in the RAF service was the Mustang II.  The P-51A had the .303 caliber machine guns removed as well as the two nose mounted .50 cals and added two more .50 cals to the wings to give the P-51A 4x .50 cals.

ack-ack

Ack! (double meaning  )

You sir are correct.  I just looked it up again. 

The P-51A deleted the two chin guns and the dive brakes of the A-36.  It retained the four .50-caliber machine guns in the wings as its only internal armament.  However, the P-51A also kept the under-wing pylons of the A-36.  External fuel tanks, or bombs up to the 500-pound class, could be loaded on these external hardpoints.  This variant was called the Mustang II by the British.

Off to eat crow.

 

wrongway

[5PointOh]

I don't think that is true.

Spitfire: 7 (counting Seafire)

Bf109: 6

Fw190: 5 (counting Ta152)
F4U: 5
P-47: 5

Hurricane: 3
P-38: 3

A6M: 2
A-20: 2
B-25: 2
Bf110: 2
C.2: 2
F4F: 2 (counting FM2)
La: 2
P-39: 2
P-40: 2
P-51: 2
Yak: 2

Ar234: 1
B6N: 1
B-17: 1
B-24: 1
B-26: 1
C-47: 1
D3A: 1
F6F: 1
Ju87: 1
Ju88: 1
Ki-61: 1
Ki-67: 1
Ki-84: 1
I-16: 1
Il-2: 1
Lancaster: 1
Me163: 1
Me262: 1
Mosquito: 1
N1K: 1
SBD: 1
TBM: 1
Tempest: 1
Typhoon: 1


As you can see, most types do not in fact have 3+ variants.  While the list includes aircraft like the Ar234 that had no other variants, it also includes the Ju88 and Mosquito at one each, and those two aircraft had more variants that saw combat than any other types.  The B-17, B-24, Ki-61 and N1K all have strong claims to other significant versions while only having one model of their types in the game.

I don't object to the P-51 getting another model, but don't paint it as  a red heading step child as it certainly is not.

Didnt mean to paint as a European Step Child, I should have said many.  Still, the Allison powered 51 (non cannon) would be nice to have.

[Karnak]

Didnt mean to paint as a European Step Child, I should have said many.  Still, the Allison powered 51 (non cannon) would be nice to have.

Agreed.

[Ack-Ack]

Didnt mean to paint as a European Step Child, I should have said many.  Still, the Allison powered 51 (non cannon) would be nice to have.

Yes it would be a nice mid-war edition to the plane set.

ack-ack

[321BAR]

I don't think that is true.

Spitfire: 7 (counting Seafire)

Bf109: 6

Fw190: 5 (counting Ta152)
F4U: 5
P-47: 5

Hurricane: 3
P-38: 3

A6M: 2
A-20: 2
B-25: 2
Bf110: 2
C.2: 2
F4F: 2 (counting FM2)
La: 2
P-39: 2
P-40: 2
P-51: 2
Yak: 2

Ar234: 1
B6N: 1
B-17: 1
B-24: 1
B-26: 1
C-47: 1
D3A: 1
F6F: 1
Ju87: 1
Ju88: 1
Ki-61: 1
Ki-67: 1
Ki-84: 1
I-16: 1
Il-2: 1
Lancaster: 1
Me163: 1
Me262: 1
Mosquito: 1
N1K: 1
SBD: 1
TBM: 1
Tempest: 1
Typhoon: 1


As you can see, most types do not in fact have 3+ variants.  While the list includes aircraft like the Ar234 that had no other variants, it also includes the Ju88 and Mosquito at one each, and those two aircraft had more variants that saw combat than any other types.  The B-17, B-24, Ki-61 and N1K all have strong claims to other significant versions while only having one model of their types in the game.

I don't object to the P-51 getting another model, but don't paint it as  a red heading step child as it certainly is not.

although he already corrected himself in the above statement in this thread, i need to say that out of the planes with only one model, only the bombers, the F6F, and the N1K, (and maybe the SBD and TBM?), can have more models. am i correct? btw i think a new Allied CV flown bomber could be a nice TBD Devastator? yeah ik it isnt as good as the TBM or used like the SBD but itd be cool to have it. Out of the 2 version planes in game- The yak , a6m , P51, and P40 could have new game models. We're all set for spits, 109s, and the 5 counts and 3 counts i think.

[Karnak]

although he already corrected himself in the above statement in this thread, i need to say that out of the planes with only one model, only the bombers, the F6F, and the N1K, (and maybe the SBD and TBM?), can have more models. am i correct? btw i think a new Allied CV flown bomber could be a nice TBD Devastator? yeah ik it isnt as good as the TBM or used like the SBD but itd be cool to have it. Out of the 2 version planes in game- The yak , a6m , P51, and P40 could have new game models. We're all set for spits, 109s, and the 5 counts and 3 counts i think.

You are not correct.

The aircraft that have only one model and have others available that would bring significant differences:

B-17
B-24
D3A
F6F
Ju87
Ju88 (many, many models, some of them fighters, some of them bombers)
Ki-61 (many models)
Ki-84
Lancaster
Me262
Mosquito (many, many models, some of them fighters, some of them bombers)
N1K
SBD

[THRASH99]

This is a neat little plane that I think would be a great addition to the game, the Mustang Mk I. There were a little over 600 of them made I believe. Only question I have is how much action did they see, and did they perform well? if it is anything like the B or D model PLUS the 4 20mm then it should've done quite well 

(Image removed from quote.)

(Image removed from quote.)

would give Hurri2Cs and typhoons a run for their money I think 

I would like it, throw in the C model and it's a done deal +1

[Ack-Ack]

I would like it, throw in the C model and it's a done deal +1

I'm going to be kind this time because I'm home sick and the medicines are making me loopy.  There is no need for the C model.  Why do you ask?  Well, the C model is the same exact plane as the B model.  But why is the C called the C and not the B if they are the same plane with no differences?  That's because the B was built in Inglewood, California and the C was built in Dallas, Texas.  If you want to fly the C, just pretend the plane was made in Dallas.


ack-ack

[321BAR]

You are not correct.

The aircraft that have only one model and have others available that would bring significant differences:

B-17
B-24
D3A
F6F
Ju87
Ju88 (many, many models, some of them fighters, some of them bombers)
Ki-61 (many models)
Ki-84
Lancaster
Me262
Mosquito (many, many models, some of them fighters, some of them bombers)
N1K
SBD

so.... a Me262 bomber? dont think many would like that. ok i agree with the Ki-61 and Ki-84, but everything else is as i listed. The (B17, B24, D3A, Ju-87, Ju-88, Lanc)<-bombers as i said, N1K, F6F and SBD<bomber-as said, and i even said put the TBD to add a predecessor to the TBM. Would another Mossi really affect the game? The bomber mossi has the same role as the attack mossi in game.

[Karnak]

You don't think a Mosquito with a 57mm cannon would bring anything different?  How about one that can do 430mph?  How about one that can carry a 4,000lb bomb at 415mph and drop it using a bomb sight from 27,000ft?

How about a Ju87 armed with two high velocity 37mm cannons?

What about a Ju88 with a solid nose and armed with four MG/FF 20mm cannons?  How about a Ju88 with a solid nose that can do more than 400mph and is armed with multiple MG151/20 20mm cannon?

How about a D3A that is almost as fast as the F4F?

[Guppy35]

Might be time to unleash a Mossie development thread for the uninformed Karnak

Did you catch the thread on the Flypast Forum where the guy posted photos of the three Mossies at the Dehaviland Heritage Center?  They have their FBVI on it's wheels now.  Throw in the prototype and their B35 and that's a nice Mossie collection

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?t=99287

[321BAR]

You don't think a Mosquito with a 57mm cannon would bring anything different?  How about one that can do 430mph?  How about one that can carry a 4,000lb bomb at 415mph and drop it using a bomb sight from 27,000ft?

How about a Ju87 armed with two high velocity 37mm cannons?

What about a Ju88 with a solid nose and armed with four MG/FF 20mm cannons?  How about a Ju88 with a solid nose that can do more than 400mph and is armed with multiple MG151/20 20mm cannon?

How about a D3A that is almost as fast as the F4F?

i already said ok to the Ju87 and 88 in my original post man... and the Val's fine the way it is...

[THRASH99]

I'm going to be kind this time because I'm home sick and the medicines are making me loopy.  There is no need for the C model.  Why do you ask?  Well, the C model is the same exact plane as the B model.  But why is the C called the C and not the B if they are the same plane with no differences?  That's because the B was built in Inglewood, California and the C was built in Dallas, Texas.  If you want to fly the C, just pretend the plane was made in Dallas.


ack-ack

The C model was improved with the guns and didn't have the jamming in the guns most of the time like the B model did. If we have all spit models, why not add all the P-51 models. Plus all of them saw action, unlike spit 16 had only seen 23 hours of combat service but didn't have 1 kill recorded.

[THRASH99]

The C model was improved with the guns and didn't have the jamming in the guns most of the time like the B model did. If we have all spit models, why not add all the P-51 models. Plus all of them saw action, unlike spit 16 had only seen 23 hours of combat service but didn't have 1 kill recorded.

Plus, ANYWHERE you look for spit 16 records, nothing but a plain picture and/or from the 1938 version spit comes up. I don't see any where at all where spit 16 records of killing one single fighter is.