Little fact i just read!

[oakranger]

Here is a little fact that i just read.  On these 109E, can you tell me what the red band on the nose represent? 

[fudgums]

The commander of JG53 was married to a jewish wife(something like that). To be punished, goering(I'm pretty sure) made stab/JG53 where the red stripe to make them stand out in battle.


I'm on my phone so I can't see the picture, but I believe this is what your talking about.

[Saxman]

That's what I just read about it on Wikipedia. Goering ordered them to remove their Ace of Spades insignia and paint the red cowl band instead as a mark of shame.

IF you believe Wiki, after the commander (Hans-Jurgen von Cramon-Taubadel) was replaced Goering permitted them to remove the bands and reinstate their original insignia. However in protest of Goering's actions, the ENTIRE group removed the swastikas from the tails of their aircraft.

I'm not finding much information on Cramon-Taubadel's wife, other than her name (Viola von Kaufmann-Asse) and that she survive the war (d.1997). Whether she was protected by her marriage to a high-ranking officer, or if she left Germany and occupied Europe I don't know. Taubadel remarried in 1948 so they divorced or separated at some point during or just after WWII.

It's a very interesting story, though.

[oakranger]

That's what I just read about it on Wikipedia. Goering ordered them to remove their Ace of Spades insignia and paint the red cowl band instead as a mark of shame.

IF you believe Wiki, after the commander (Hans-Jurgen von Cramon-Taubadel) was replaced Goering permitted them to remove the bands and reinstate their original insignia. However in protest of Goering's actions, the ENTIRE group removed the swastikas from the tails of their aircraft.

I'm not finding much information on Cramon-Taubadel's wife, other than her name (Viola von Kaufmann-Asse) and that she survive the war (d.1997). Whether she was protected by her marriage to a high-ranking officer, or if she left Germany and occupied Europe I don't know. Taubadel remarried in 1948 so they divorced or separated at some point during or just after WWII.

It's a very interesting story, though.

Yea, it is interesting.  The nerves for any German to dishonor laws of Nazi by removing the national symbol swastikas from any equipment like the 109 is crazy.  Sure like to read into it some more. 

[JTs]

this end forward

[Serenity]

I have a JG53 Bf-109E skin ingame with that nose band

(Not my best work, but I have never had time to go back into it)

[Masherbrum]

Yea, it is interesting.  The nerves for any German to dishonor laws of Nazi by removing the national symbol swastikas from any equipment like the 109 is crazy.  Sure like to read into it some more. 

The nerve for Hitler to be part-Jewish and commit Atrocities against them is crazy. 

[Serenity]

The nerve for Hitler to be part-Jewish and commit Atrocities against them is crazy. 

I think you misinterpret. By "The nerve" I don't think he meant it as a "How DARE they!" but more of a respectful "They must have been very brave!".

[Masherbrum]

I think you misinterpret. By "The nerve" I don't think he meant it as a "How DARE they!" but more of a respectful "They must have been very brave!".

I see what you're saying and questioned it myself.   Maybe he used the word differently.    No biggie.   You make a decision yet?

[oakranger]

I see what you're saying and questioned it myself.   Maybe he used the word differently.    No biggie.   You make a decision yet?

Serenity was right what i meant. 

[Masherbrum]

Serenity was right what i meant. 

Rogah.   Didn't know if that's what you meant.

[oakranger]

Rogah.   Didn't know if that's what you meant.

That is ok, should have word it differently to prevent misunderstanding. 

[Lusche]

I very much doubt the story of having the red band on their planes because of the ancestry of the commander's wife.

[Saxman]

I very much doubt the story of having the red band on their planes because of the ancestry of the commander's wife.

Bu-bu-bu... But it's on WIKIPEDIA so MUST be true!

Actually, I did a Google search and the same story does come up in a number of sources. Whether they're getting their OWN facts from Wikipedia is another matter. However a Google image search appears to circumstantially support one part of the story:



JG53 bird with no swastika on the tail. If you check the date of the photo this was taken after Cramon was reassigned so seems to fit the time line of the group removing their swastikas in protest.

[Motherland]

I very much doubt the story of having the red band on their planes because of the ancestry of the commander's wife.

This is the only reason for the application of the band that I've read.