Thanks again Agent360

[Guppy35]

I was 'flying' at the time the exchange took place.  Agent was giving him a hard time about not engaging the 109F.  It was in good fun trying to get Zoney to fly a different fight.  When Zoney came on 200 he was respectful of Agent and <S> him.  The conversation afterwards seemed respectful as well as Agent and Zoney talked about the fight and Zoney acknowledged where he was on the learning curve.

As far as the post, Zoney seems to be following up on that.  No whine, neither guy was a bad guy in the end.

[mtnman]

I was 'flying' at the time the exchange took place.  Agent was giving him a hard time about not engaging the 109F.  It was in good fun trying to get Zoney to fly a different fight.  When Zoney came on 200 he was respectful of Agent and <S> him.  The conversation afterwards seemed respectful as well as Agent and Zoney talked about the fight and Zoney acknowledged where he was on the learning curve.

As far as the post, Zoney seems to be following up on that.  No whine, neither guy was a bad guy in the end.

I saw it too.  While I agree it looked like they eventually gotten to a "respectful" point in the end, I wouldn't agree that Agent's exchanges looked like they were made "in good fun".  Maybe they were...  But that's not how they appeared to me.

Disrespectful, arrogant, spoiled, childish, belittling, and a few other similar descriptions come to mind relating how his exchanges looked (to me, just another pilot in the arena, not involved in the fight at all).  Were I Zoney (or any one of countless other pilots) I'd have dismissed Agent as being unworthy of my time, or worth a response at all, regardless of how he can make a "turnier" plane turn.  Judging from the comments that then came across the country channel, I'm not alone in that interpretation.

Sadly, those type of comments are fairly normal though, so I guess we should just act like they're acceptable.

At the same time Agent "earned" the "big, bad, meanie pants" title, so why not let him have it.  Maybe that was his goal.  Maybe he came across on 200 exactly the way he wanted to, and is proud of it.

[Buck]

Also, I find those type of fights to be some of the most useful when it comes to learning skills which pay large dividends. 

There is no better way to learn then from the best of the best pilots in a head on level alt merge.

[Slash27]

  No whine, neither guy was a bad guy in the end.

Where's the drama in that?

[CrAcKeR]

Mtnman is a class act

[Zoney]

Excellent responses gentelmen.  I learned from this posting.  In the interest of clarity:

1. I have been flying since December 2009, flew WB and before that AW alot.

2. My motive for posting this was to let Agent360 know it's cool that he was a bit upset at first, especially because he calmed down after I responded on 200 with civility and deference to his opinion.

3. I wanted to point out an example of a situation that could have easily mushroomed into a 200 namecalling but with just a bit of civility salutes were exchanged.

4. I value the diverse opinions and wish to be a part of this community. 

5. I enjoyed the fight and truly wished to thank Agent for it.


Thank you <S>

[papjohns]

Germany 4-0!!! 

[Agent360]

WOW!  very intersting thread

S! Zoney...it's all good.

I did give Zoney a 200 lashing. This is true.

Mtman said "Disrespectful, arrogant, spoiled, childish, belittling, and a few other similar descriptions "....not sure about that one but I did say "lame" a bunch. If I call you a "twit", "pond scum", "ho bag", "looser", "coward" or any combonation of those involving "twit" that would be much more serious. I would say on the Muppet banter scale he got a....."3" lashing (1 being nice and 10 being banned)

I will say that Zoney reacted in quite a gentlemanly mannor to my 200 lashing. I did see that and we exchanged salutes.

My irritation at anyone lasts about as long as it takes me to drink a beer, which isn't very long.

I know now that Zoney is a rookie player. I am sure he didn't quite know what to make of my defense. He tried a few times to get guns but it resulted in a close call for him. So, naturally he did the only thing he could do and that was extend out.

The fight did go 10 min..at least. I was on 5 min of fuel when I flew strait and got shot on purpose to find out who it was. I could have just augured but at least I gave him a gun kill. Did I concede defeat..perhaps.

My point was to give Zoney an empirical victory (or Pyrrhic victory for you history buffs). If you guys don't know what that is look it up.

My reason for being irritated was the extensions of 3k or more, a few out of icon range.

I tried to keep him in the phone booth, bet he kept running off the other side of the street. I tried the street and then he ran to the next block.

I engaged a few more times then it became obvious this was a stale mate. He couldn't shoot me and I couldn't catch him.

At the start we did get into a good fight. We climbed, turned, maneuvered, but I did get good reverses and when I did Zoney ran for the hills.

Either engage and fight or leave the guy alone and go find another easier kill...that my opinion.

At least Zoney learned something from the fight and this thread. There is some good info in here regarding BZ attacks

[Dawger]

A Pyrrhic victory would be one that was devastingly costly to the victor.

This doesn't come close.

Empirical is knowledge gained by observation, experience, or experiment. Zoney experienced a victory so we have to give you that one.

[SunBat]

4. I value the diverse opinions and wish to be a part of this community. 

You're a good man, Zoney.  Do us all a favor and stick around and never let jerks like me discourage ya.

[TheDudeDVant]

Heya Zoney,
to help you out with how your encounter went with Agent in your opening post,I would suggest the following.....

Start with what Filth posted in Reply #24 regarding the 3rd type of BnZer..... you posted you was extending nearly 3K away before reversing..by doing this you was gaining no ground and actually giving up ground to Agent to come back and recover or even increase his energy state for your next pass on him..... once you begin your BnZ attack most times anything beyond 2K extending is very wasteful on your part...,

next take what Filth posted regarding the 3rd type BnZ'er and mix it in with what MtnMan followed up with in Reply #50 about "always be in it to win it......and finish it with what TonyJoey mentions in Reply #55 of this thread.....

work on these and as others have said, do not let others "get inside your thoughts" from 200 rants... psychological manipulation is just as much a part of on-line air combat simulation against another human as having very good BFM/ACM ability's/knowledge.... learn to block those rants out of your mental picture when in a dogfight in-game.......

and you will find yourself improving each day you move forward in your learning process.....

hope this is of some help....

great post.. I have a different opinion though..

have the fight (in a sorta way).. go to the da and learn in 30mins what will take you 3months or better in the MA... Especially if its a muppet.. stay respectful and I bet the muppet will teach you.. Prolly the same for other good sticks mixed around.. I can only speak for the muppets though.. They call you out.. Go to the DA and see if you can learn.. You can learn even when the badguy is a love muffin.. The DA doesn't have to be about anger and whatnot.. If you've been flying for 7months against a vet stick.. You should lose.. that time... but next?

[Agent360]

A Pyrrhic victory would be one that was devastingly costly to the victor.

This doesn't come close.

Empirical is knowledge gained by observation, experience, or experiment. Zoney experienced a victory so we have to give you that one.

You are sort of correct but literally.

Empirical victory is an actual legal term used to define a legal victory at great cost, or to describe a victory that doesn't result in serious punishment.

A "Pyrrhic victory" is a military term normally used to describe battles.

The terms have become used in many types of analogies involving all mannor of discussions....business..phil osophy..debate...etc.

The term as I used it describes the second definition: A hollow or meaningless victory. You win but get nothing for it.

The point is not about the victory but what it cost or more accurately here what you didn't gain

[IrishOne]

sounds like a cop-out from yet another dweeblet avoiding a fight

[Bear76]

Who's Agent? Sounds like a newb 

[Slash27]

 He takes dictation for Grizz during the special meetings in the basement/ dungeon place.