Author Topic: Me410  (Read 1630 times)

Offline Fatboy26

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Me410
« on: July 20, 2010, 10:23:56 PM »
Lately I've been obnoxiously adding a request for the 410 to every post where it remotely fit into the subject matter.  Decided instead of trying to squeak my way around wishing for it, I've recently been trying to research variants and service history.  Does anyone have or know of a reliable source for information.  Here is what I have so far:

There were approximately 1160 aircraft built before production was canceled to build more 109s.  I don't know if this includes the 267 210Cs built in Hungary, (Upgraded to 410 structural and control surface standards but with lesser engines).  No source I have found lists any production numbers for the various A and B variants.  Top speed for the A variant was approximately 388mph using 1726hp DB603A engines, the B was 392 with 1900 hp DB603G engines.  About half of the sources say the B model was "supposed" to have the DB603Gs, but actually had the 603As, Making the B identical to the A. 

I have not found 2 sources that list the same armaments for the 410B-2/U4.  (I love bomber destroyers)  All sources agree that a Bk5 50mm cannon was equipped.  One source said the factory 20mm and 12.7mm were removed and replaced with two 30mm's, while another says the standard 20mm and 12.7mm were still in the nose and two 30mm's were in the ventral tray with the Bk5.  I found one sight that listed the field modifications (410B-2/U4 R#)  with as many as four extra 20mm in the tray with the Bk5.   One listing had the original armament (Bk5, 2x20mm, 2x12.7mm) and two Mk 108's and two Mk 103's

As far as other additional ordnances, I've heard multiple reports of different WGr-21 configurations.  None of the sources I've found list the rockets as used ordinance in the aircraft stats.  One source says as many as six WGr's were on the wings, others say four, but this is all in the narratives not listed with official stats.  I know the rotary launcher was a failure and never fielded.  I can't find the source now but IRC 410's and 110's even used R4M's somewhat successfully in a last ditch defense of Ploesti oil facilities.

I'd also like to find at least some combat statistics.  The closest I've gotten was "the Me410 achieved substantial successes against unescorted Allied bombers, but were easily defeated by the more nimble Allied single engine fighters once long range escorts were available."  I'd like to know approximately how many bombers were downed by 410's (I know # of kills claimed and actual kills made rarely match but a number is better than "substantial".)  Was the 410 ever successful against Allied fighters?

The ridiculously large military aircraft encyclopedia I have lists the generic info.  Wiki is not reliable, and no other net sites I have found seem to be since they all differ on some specifics.  The library at the university I work for just has two books on Messerschmitt aircraft and the information in those books is not really detailed.  Regardless of if the 410 in modeled in game or not, I still would like to find reasonably accurate and specific info. 

Thanks for any help, and I'm horrible at grammar and spelling so, enjoy grammar police, enjoy.

A8Fatboy
Proudly campaigning (screaming, whining, begging, pleading) for the addition of the Me410 to AH2

Fatboy

Offline Stoney

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Re: Me410
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2010, 10:26:34 PM »
There's usually a thread like this one every 6 months, just like the Beaufighter, the A-26, the Comet, the Helldiver, and all of the German gadget planes that are in IL-2 1946.  Try doing a search and I'm sure you'll find one.
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

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Offline Fatboy26

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Re: Me410
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2010, 10:58:28 PM »
Stoney,

With all due respect, I've searched until I was blue in the face.  I may have been searching wrong.  100's of requests for the 410 but not much additional information.  Don't get me wrong, this is not a request for the plane to be added, already did that in wishlist.  I'm generally interested in the history of the a/c and am just asking help in research.  I've found some neat tidbits, such as an article explaining why the Russians wanted to capture one so bad just to get a look at the remote gun turrets.  Found some nice cockpit photos from a post way back in 2000 that I didn't see earlier on the warbirdsresearch site.  Just need a point in the direction of some more detailed information.
Proudly campaigning (screaming, whining, begging, pleading) for the addition of the Me410 to AH2

Fatboy

Offline Guppy35

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Re: Me410
« Reply #3 on: July 20, 2010, 11:35:31 PM »
This is the last thread on the 410.  It got started about the same time as our best Beaufighter thread.  About  year ago.  There are others going back a long ways :)

I wouldn't disagree that the 410 might be a decent addition to AH at some point.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,257559.0.html

The Luftwaffe guys might point you in the right direction.  My LW stuff doesn't have much on the 410

« Last Edit: July 20, 2010, 11:59:17 PM by Guppy35 »
Dan/CorkyJr
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Offline Scherf

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Re: Me410
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2010, 01:13:13 AM »
Was the 410 ever successful against Allied fighters?

I know a number of claims were made for P-38s. IIRC one Mossie fighter was lost to a 410.

Edit - An Me 410 intruder from KG 51 also claimed a Spitfire in 1944.
« Last Edit: July 21, 2010, 02:02:51 AM by Scherf »
... missions were to be met by the commitment of alerted swarms of fighters, composed of Me 109's and Fw 190's, that were strategically based to protect industrial installations. The inferior capabilities of these fighters against the Mosquitoes made this a hopeless and uneconomical effort. 1.JD KTB

Offline milesobrian

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Re: Me410
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2010, 02:47:38 AM »
This is the last thread on the 410.  It got started about the same time as our best Beaufighter thread.  About  year ago.  There are others going back a long ways :)

I wouldn't disagree that the 410 might be a decent addition to AH at some point.

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,257559.0.html

The Luftwaffe guys might point you in the right direction.  My LW stuff doesn't have much on the 410



too bad that topic is mostly about the mossie and when and how many of them were killed

Offline Stoney

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Re: Me410
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2010, 05:17:14 AM »
Moot had some posts in one of those past Me410 threads where he showed pictures and diagrams of all the 410 ordnance configurations.  Include Moot in your search parameters, as he had the majority of the really detailed information.
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline Fatboy26

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Re: Me410
« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2010, 10:35:07 AM »
Thanks Stoney,

You were right. Found this one http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,261828.0.html which has a ton of stats from moot.  I also found some of the combat service and Zerstorer unit info I was looking for.  Found a neat debate on how Eduard Tratt actually got shot down.  Need to do more reading. 
Proudly campaigning (screaming, whining, begging, pleading) for the addition of the Me410 to AH2

Fatboy

Offline MiloMorai

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Re: Me410
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2010, 12:28:07 PM »
I'm generally interested in the history of the a/c and am just asking help in research.  I've found some neat tidbits, such as an article explaining why the Russians wanted to capture one so bad just to get a look at the remote gun turrets.  Found some nice cockpit photos from a post way back in 2000 that I didn't see earlier on the warbirdsresearch site.  Just need a point in the direction of some more detailed information.

http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/5386852-messerschmitt-me-410

http://search.barnesandnoble.com/Messerschmitt-Me-210-Me-410-Hornisse-Hornet/Peter-Petrick/e/9781857802719


Offline beau32

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Re: Me410
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2010, 03:03:14 PM »
Fatboy, pm me your e-mail and I will send you the manual on the Me-410/U4.
"There is always a small microcosm of people who need to explain away their suckage."

Offline Scherf

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Re: Me410
« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2010, 09:12:13 PM »
I'd love to see the 410, A and B. Should only be a question of skins and differences in available weapons loadouts, and the A would be available Mid-War.

Won't turn for much wit dem itty-bitty little wings, but would be fun nonetheless.
... missions were to be met by the commitment of alerted swarms of fighters, composed of Me 109's and Fw 190's, that were strategically based to protect industrial installations. The inferior capabilities of these fighters against the Mosquitoes made this a hopeless and uneconomical effort. 1.JD KTB

Offline Die Hard

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Re: Me410
« Reply #11 on: July 25, 2010, 07:17:52 PM »
Should turn a little better than the P-38, based on wing loading.
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Offline Stoney

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Re: Me410
« Reply #12 on: July 25, 2010, 08:14:14 PM »
Should turn a little better than the P-38, based on wing loading.

Oh boy...
"Can we be incorrect at times, absolutely, but I do believe 15 years of experience does deserve a little more credence and respect than you have given from your very first post."

HiTech

Offline froger

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Re: Me410
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2010, 01:27:10 AM »
Should turn a little better than the P-38, based on wing loading.

ummm.......
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Offline Tec

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Re: Me410
« Reply #14 on: July 26, 2010, 02:54:24 AM »
Fatboy, pm me your e-mail and I will send you the manual on the Me-410/U4.

Oh pick me pick me!  Or maybe just host it on a file sharing sight for us? Please.
To each their pwn.
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