Author Topic: Pick discussion  (Read 15853 times)

Offline Guppy35

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #315 on: October 04, 2010, 12:51:53 PM »

he is saying it is all in one's own attitude.

For example: Player A cherry picks Player B.

Player B could say: 'You suck, you picked me, you cheated, you cant fight by yourself, loser.'

or

Player B could say: 'Doh, I should have seen that coming. Good kill S!.'

The same result happens, Player B got picked. But with the friendly answer both players had fun, with the insults, niether had fun.

So all Dan is saying is if everyone made an effort to be more friendly (and even more so, tolerant) no matter why or where they died, the game would be more fun for everyone.
Correct me if I am wrong Corky!



That about covers it.  I can't control any other player's choices, only my own.  What I'd hope for is that folks would think for a second, before diving in on a fight and see if the guys already in the fight are doing OK without the unwanted or unneeded help.  Think as sec before you start firing head on every chance you get.  Think a sec before you decide to drop the CV or FHs at the only decent furball on the map.  Think a sec before you drop bombs on the only decent GV fight on the map.  If you choose to go ahead and do those things, regardless of how it might impact on other players having fun in the game, don't expect a 'WTG".

As I've said too many times in this thread already.  Basic courtesy and respect of other players isn't asking to much in my opinion.
Dan/CorkyJr
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Offline grizz441

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #316 on: October 04, 2010, 12:53:46 PM »
That about covers it.  I can't control any other player's choices, only my own.  What I'd hope for is that folks would think for a second, before diving in on a fight and see if the guys already in the fight are doing OK without the unwanted or unneeded help.  Think as sec before you start firing head on every chance you get.  Think a sec before you decide to drop the CV or FHs at the only decent furball on the map.  Think a sec before you drop bombs on the only decent GV fight on the map.  If you choose to go ahead and do those things, regardless of how it might impact on other players having fun in the game, don't expect a 'WTG".

As I've said too many times in this thread already.  Basic courtesy and respect of other players isn't asking to much in my opinion.

That explanation covers the black and white situations nicely.  What about the shades of gray that basically encompass 99% of the fights in the MA?

Offline Guppy35

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #317 on: October 04, 2010, 01:14:11 PM »
Never gonna be a perfect answer.  Still comes down to how you treat people.

Only example I can think of for me was one night I came in below a fight.  Sads was fighting a 109K and a Spit 16.  I came into the fight from below and ended up shooting down Kappa and Agent.  My first thought was that I'd blown it and had interrupted a fight.  I took a second and PM'd Kappa saying I was sorry if I'd interrupted a set up fight between three Muppets.  Turns out I hadn't, but it didn't kill me to at least check.

Often I'll be above a fight staying out and a mugging will end up happening anyway.  It might be as simple as going on 200 and acknowledging he got mugged and telling him nice flying.

I think just talking to folks on 200 about where you are fighting etc can help.  One thing about being in the same old 38G is once folks in the area I'm dying know it's my 38G and that I'm not going to face shoot, the HO shots decrease as they know they don't have to worry about it.

Never going to please everyone, and we've all been called names and accused of this that or the other thing in game, but I do believe how I approach the game impacts on how folks interact with me in the game.
Dan/CorkyJr
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Offline Vinkman

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #318 on: October 04, 2010, 01:57:15 PM »
That explanation covers the black and white situations nicely.  What about the shades of gray that basically encompass 99% of the fights in the MA?

I'll try....

Picking
It's the friendly's call. If he wants help, he gets it. If he doesn't, stay out. No need to write up guidelines, just use the radio and ask before you jump in.

Ganging

If there's one bandit, Don't be the second friendly in unless first friendly calls for help.

Furballing
Multiple bandits, multiple friendlies. 20v20 is a furball. is 2v2? or 3v2?  I think there is a simple guideline to follow here:
If there is time to use the radio, you should.
If there isn't time to use the radio, you don't have to.

Vulching
can be done if a base capture is underway.
If no base capture, this should be avoided.

That's where I'd start.  :salute

Who is John Galt?

Offline CAP1

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #319 on: October 04, 2010, 02:07:00 PM »
I VULCHED  all of the anti aircraft on a small base once. then i landed there, and waited for someone to come out, so we could have a ground fight. no one upped. a guy in a zeek shot me on the badguys runway. is that a vulch?
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Offline Vinkman

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #320 on: October 04, 2010, 02:16:08 PM »
I VULCHED  all of the anti aircraft on a small base once. then i landed there, and waited for someone to come out, so we could have a ground fight. no one upped. a guy in a zeek shot me on the badguys runway. is that a vulch?

 :lol

Uh...I have no idea.  :D

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Offline dedalos

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #321 on: October 04, 2010, 02:47:11 PM »
I VULCHED  all of the anti aircraft on a small base once. then i landed there, and waited for someone to come out, so we could have a ground fight. no one upped. a guy in a zeek shot me on the badguys runway. is that a vulch?

 :rofl bahahaha, you stole my move.  It is best to wait on the rearm pad with your engine off lol
Quote from: 2bighorn on December 15, 2010 at 03:46:18 PM
Dedalos pretty much ruined DA.

Offline CAP1

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #322 on: October 04, 2010, 02:51:14 PM »
:rofl bahahaha, you stole my move.  It is best to wait on the rearm pad with your engine off lol

i'll try that next time. i was right out in the open on the runway.  :noid
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Offline grizz441

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #323 on: October 04, 2010, 03:00:13 PM »
I'll try....

Picking
It's the friendly's call. If he wants help, he gets it. If he doesn't, stay out. No need to write up guidelines, just use the radio and ask before you jump in.

Ganging

If there's one bandit, Don't be the second friendly in unless first friendly calls for help.

Furballing
Multiple bandits, multiple friendlies. 20v20 is a furball. is 2v2? or 3v2?  I think there is a simple guideline to follow here:
If there is time to use the radio, you should.
If there isn't time to use the radio, you don't have to.

Vulching
can be done if a base capture is underway.
If no base capture, this should be avoided.

That's where I'd start.  :salute



Good start.  Using the radio constantly trying to ask if people need help every 2 minutes seems like a burden though.  If my friendly is saddled I assume he needs help.  Is that not the correct assumption for 95% of the player base?

Offline TheRapier

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #324 on: October 04, 2010, 05:53:09 PM »
Wow! this is a LONG thread. Since the fire is burning so nicely, more fuel certainly won't hurt. The debate goes back to the very early AW days and hasn't changed in its basic character since day one. There are adherents to one way or another but the question has no definitive answer.

This "game" has no rules. If you doubt me, you can quote from the official AH rule book. Oh, there isn't one. :)

There is actually no way to create a set of rules that will spell out in black and white what would be allowable behavior in a way that cannot be interpreted differently at different times. The closest analogy I can think of is trying to play traffic cop at the Indy 500. Everyone there is trying to go as fast as they can, and how they go fast is immaterial as long as they don't physically endanger anyone.

Here there is no physical endangerment to consider and the object is to kill enemies. Trying to split philosophical hairs into smaller and smaller fragments may be amusing but ultimately futile.

The picker is the equivalent to an infantry sniper. At long distance and relatively low risk to himself, he kills. Dead is dead and there is no other way to term it. The kill is just as dead whether it was picked or it happened in an intense furball.

So for myself, and this is for myself only, this is how it breaks down.

1. All red planes are targets and should be shot.
2. There is no such thing as an even fight between two people, EVER. Trying to make is so is a waste of time and effort. The only even fight is against yourself and we call this schizophrenia :).
3. The object is to get kills and not be killed. (If you like getting killed, check into a clinic :). If you are setting up your fights to have an equal chance of being killed, hmm, do you see a problem in this? :))
4. A kill is a kill is a kill. There are no bad kills.
5. There is no inherently "nobler" way to get a kill. Thinking so creates frustration.
6. If you want a duel, go to the dueling arena, that's why it exists.
7. If you lose, suck it up and learn from it.

The only sins are:
1. Acting like a jerk.
2. Whining on 200 or PMing about how you would have won if only the killer didn't do X. It is NOT a matter whether the amount and intensity of the whine will undo history and make you not dead.
3. Talking in one way and acting in another so that the poor SOBs who listen to you become better kill fodder. This is disingenuous and makes you look like a jerk.

To that end, I don't listen to 200. In my opinion it is mostly a terrible waste of bandwidth.

On the other hand, I think Corky is absolutely right. The class with which you treat people in this competition is the measure of you as a person. Those without class won't get this (hence their problem). People will remember the class long after the kill is forgotten.
--)-Rapier--
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They thought it would be a disgrace to go forth in a group.  Each entered the forest at a point that he had chosen where there was no path and where it was darkest. La Queste de St G

Offline Babalonian

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #325 on: October 04, 2010, 06:38:41 PM »
/popcorn

Waiting for that act of congress to once and forall settle this pressing issue.
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Wow, you guys need help.

Offline icejaff

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #326 on: October 04, 2010, 06:51:14 PM »
Thank you for your honesty sir  :salute


True that.  :cheers:











 :D

Offline grizz441

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #327 on: October 04, 2010, 06:58:13 PM »
Nice post rapier.  It seems the two extreme groups are:

Group A: It's all about the fight
Group B: A kill is a kill

I'm probably somewhere in between the two extremes, but I love playing devil's advocate.  I could just as easily tear apart Rapier's argument as I did shuffler's and corky's (please bite), but it would be just for show.  It really all comes down to how you enjoy the game, and how you treat other players.

Offline FLOTSOM

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #328 on: October 04, 2010, 07:03:01 PM »
I'm probably somewhere in between the two extremes,.

you heard it class...........

GRIZZ FINALY ADMITS THAT HE HANGS IN THE MIDDLE BUT GOES BOTH WAYS!!!!!!!

 :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:

 :bolt:
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Offline Slash27

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Re: Pick discussion
« Reply #329 on: October 04, 2010, 08:01:57 PM »
you heard it class...........

GRIZZ FINALY ADMITS THAT HE HANGS IN THE MIDDLE BUT GOES BOTH WAYS!!!!!!!

 :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:

 :bolt:

What do you mean "finally"?