reformatting or starting from scratch

[falcon23]

I have ben wondering about this for awhile..

 What is the difference between reformatting,or wiping hard drive and reinstalling???Pros/cons
                                                                      Thanks..I have windows7/64

[1701E]

Unless there's some new meaning to "reinstalling", when you reformat you have to reinstall so it's not really two different things.  Reformatting the hard-drive will wipe all data on the partition and thus requiring a reinstall of the OS and all data.  Reformatting really isn't needed all that often (~1 year) and unless you have a slow machine due to something you can't get rid of (malware or programs that are just as bad) there's no reason to do it more since all the backing up is so time consuming. Some around here do it more often but it's a personal choice, not required.

Pros of all this: Faster, cleaner machine with a chance to start anew.
Cons: Time consuming, loss of all data not backed up, possibility of having lost the Windows Activation key and only realizing after reformatting,

[Tigger29]

At the 'front' of the hard drive is F.A.T. (File Allocation Table) which is basically a 'table of contents' for the hard drive.  Basically it stores all of the information telling the computer WHERE TO LOOK for everything on the hard drive.

Reformatting is the act of completely wiping the hard drive and starting 'from scratch'... well at least in theory.  If you do a 'quick format' it doesn't really wipe anything, it just erases the information in the File Allocation Table so the computer treats it like a fresh hard drive.

Simply put... if you FORMAT a hard drive, everything on it gets wiped.  Yes, there are ways to recover information from a Formatted hard drive, but for all intents and purposes we'll consider all of its contents to be gone after a format.

So after formatting a hard drive, of course windows HAS to be reinstalled, as well as any programs or files you've had on there as well.

Now, it is possible to reinstall Windows without wiping the hard drive.  Doing so simply places the new replacement files over the old windows files, but since other files aren't touched if you have a virus/malware then it's likely going to keep causing problems.  Unless you accidentally delete a vital system file doing this type of reinstall usually isn't going to help much.  Also it's still very risky so I would backup up any files you want to keep to be on the safe side.

Since you're going through all of that same trouble anyway, might as well reformat and start clean!

[Ghosth]

I consider a format and reinstall a very necessary part of yearly computer maintenance. Right along with cleaning all the heatsinks and fans.  (Yes I know, brought my system to con this year "dirty" but it isn't dirty now .)

Yes you can often "repair" a windows OS install by reinstalling over the top of an existing install. But that does leave all the garbage and problems you had before intact.

A clean wipe really is recommended. And then after all is installed I'd recomend using a program like Glary Utilities to regain control of your start menu. Keep the processes lower, get it lean mean and clean and you'll be happy flying.

The hard part of all this is backing up passwords, email, bookmarks/favorites, and personal data.
Then making sure you have all the original drivers for motherboard, video, sound, etc.

One final tip, most virus's and malware look for the OS to be in C:/windows.
So partition your hard drive, so that you have 2 partitions. And install your OS to D:/windows.
It will run just fine, but you just made it harder for them to get you. Maybe not a lot harder, but harder.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Simply put... if you FORMAT a hard drive, everything on it gets wiped.  Yes, there are ways to recover information from a Formatted hard drive, but for all intents and purposes we'll consider all of its contents to be gone after a format.

Just to be exact even a full format will not wipe any data from the harddrive whatsoever. All data is 100% recoverable untill the drive is overwritten with new data (secure erase needs multiple overwrites).

This is why you should never ever run any recovery utility from the same harddrive you're trying to recover.

[hyster]

my 2 pennies worth.
it depends on how u use ur pc. if u install/uninstall alot of stuff (like i do) then i re-install windows every 6 months or so or when i notice 2 many problems.
if u rarely install any thing and dont use ur pc that much then 1-2 years is fine.

Just to be exact even a full format will not wipe any data from the harddrive whatsoever. All data is 100% recoverable untill the drive is overwritten with new data (secure erase needs multiple overwrites).

ripley is 100% correct. data can be recovered after more than 5 wipes. although thats very difficult it can be done. data can even be retrieved of a shattered platter as small as 3 mm.

unless u have sensitive data on ur hard drive u do not need to wipe ur drives.

i am an engineer at a global company and data wiping is one of the area's i support. my previous job was dealing worth desktops,laptops and servers from banks and the systems we used was, 7 wipes, degaussing and then shredding of the hard drive and even then there was a fear of data retrieval.

format = data is still on the drive but the drive does not no that its there, it sorta forgets so reuses the space again.
data wipe = over writting the data with random data to make the origanal data unreadable. IE: write a a word on a bit of paper. write random word over it 6-7 times and see if u can read the 1st word!!!

[Tigger29]

Just to be exact even a full format will not wipe any data from the harddrive whatsoever. All data is 100% recoverable untill the drive is overwritten with new data (secure erase needs multiple overwrites).

This is why you should never ever run any recovery utility from the same harddrive you're trying to recover.

Ripley yes you are technically correct, but in order to keep things 'simpler' for falcon I was trying to avoid the whole "deleted stuff isn't really deleted" debate to keep confusion to a minimum... which is exactly why I added the line "Yes, there are ways to recover information from a Formatted hard drive, but for all intents and purposes we'll consider all of its contents to be gone after a format."

Gotta love all of the nerds/geeks that have to make things so much more complicated than it needs to be.

As far as I'm concerned, FORMAT = Information is wiped.  YES THERE ARE WAYS TO RECOVER IT but the information you get may or may not be incomplete.. it may or may not be usable.. it may or may not take a lot of time, special hardware and equipment, and it may or may not be expensive.  If you have data that is SO CRITICAL that you don't want anybody to find it no matter what, then you would have already taken the proper research to learn what you need to protect yourself, and you wouldn't be on an Aces High message board asking the difference between wiping and reinstalling.

So while directing this post to the original poster, falcon23.. yes if you format your hard drive, your information is gone.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

Ripley yes you are technically correct, but in order to keep things 'simpler' for falcon I was trying to avoid the whole "deleted stuff isn't really deleted" debate to keep confusion to a minimum... which is exactly why I added the line "Yes, there are ways to recover information from a Formatted hard drive, but for all intents and purposes we'll consider all of its contents to be gone after a format."

Gotta love all of the nerds/geeks that have to make things so much more complicated than it needs to be.

As far as I'm concerned, FORMAT = Information is wiped.  YES THERE ARE WAYS TO RECOVER IT but the information you get may or may not be incomplete.. it may or may not be usable.. it may or may not take a lot of time, special hardware and equipment, and it may or may not be expensive.  If you have data that is SO CRITICAL that you don't want anybody to find it no matter what, then you would have already taken the proper research to learn what you need to protect yourself, and you wouldn't be on an Aces High message board asking the difference between wiping and reinstalling.

So while directing this post to the original poster, falcon23.. yes if you format your hard drive, your information is gone.

Umm.. 50 bucks and about 15 minutes is all it takes. And unless something writes physically over the drive the data will be complete and usable with this tool: http://www.data-recovery-software.net/ for example.

It is VERY essential to know a format will not wipe anything. Knowing that and knowing overwrite is the killer, you can potentially save your day in a very big way after an accidental format of the wrong drive.

[Ghosth]

Sorry I have to agree with tigger. The conversation is not about recovering from unwanted or mistaken format.

The topic is about cleaning your machine and reinstalling the OS.

As such who cares about recovering data?
While you are correct about what you said, it had nothing to do with the conversation.
You come across like someone spouting random factoids trying to impress people with what you know.

Sorry, not impressed.

[Tigger29]

Umm.. 50 bucks and about 15 minutes is all it takes. And unless something writes physically over the drive the data will be complete and usable with this tool: http://www.data-recovery-software.net/ for example.

It is VERY essential to know a format will not wipe anything. Knowing that and knowing overwrite is the killer, you can potentially save your day in a very big way after an accidental format of the wrong drive.

Umm.. 50 bucks and about 15 minutes is all it takes. And unless something writes physically over the drive the data will be complete and usable with this tool: http://www.data-recovery-software.net/ for example.

It is VERY essential to know a format will not wipe anything. Knowing that and knowing overwrite is the killer, you can potentially save your day in a very big way after an accidental format of the wrong drive.

I don't understand why this is so hard for you to understand.  It's like you're on some kind of "Ripley is right, Tigger is wrong" kick.

You don't work with the general public, do you?  If you had any customer relations experience at all, you would understand that you NEVER want to confuse a customer.  Yes, it may make you sound all smart and stuff by throwing in a bunch of big terms and arguing specific details and all that, but in the end of the day if a customer is confused then they aren't comfortable with making a purchase.

Wait.. you work at Best Buy, don't you?

Seriously though, you learn to explain things in a way they can understand.  I work in the Automotive industry.  I have customer track me down specifically because I can explain things to them in a way that they can understand.  I can usually assess the extent of their knowledge after about when the third word comes out of their mouth.  If they don't know much, I keep it plain and simple.  If they know a lot, I can get more technical.. using fewer metaphors and more technical jargon.  And if they are just 'pretending' to know a lot, they'll just nod and agree with me because they don't want to look stupid (and those are the best kinds of customers to deal with because you can say any BS to them and they won't doubt you ever).

Now while I am not an employee of HiTech Creations (nor do I claim to be because that would require me moving back to Texas), I am here to help and as such customer relations experience comes in to play.  Falcon23 asked one simply question: "What is the difference between reformatting,or wiping hard drive and reinstalling???"  That's it.

Now while this may be a very simple concept for people experienced in computers, I can completely see how people that are less knowledgeable about it could become quite confused.  The simple fact that he is here asking this question proves to me that he isn't all that experienced with the inner workings of a computer because it is a pretty simple question to answer.  (No offense falcon23.  This isn't meant to put you down by any means, I'm just trying to get a point across).

I could tell from the get go that this thread was going to turn into a "post-formatting data recovery" thread and considering the fact that that would not help answer the question any, I added the statement of "Yes, there are ways to recover information from a Formatted hard drive, but for all intents and purposes we'll consider all of its contents to be gone after a format."  But of course, a smart-alec just HAD to jump in and make things way too confusing.

OK If I had wanted to get technical and sound all smart and genius, I could have gotten technical and explained that neither a Format or a Quick Format actual remove any data.  A quick format simply clears the file data from the FAT and a full format goes through sector by sector marking each as clear.  I could obviously go into further details still about what exactly I mean by "marking as clear" but there really is no point in doing so.

Yes, I've recovered 'deleted' data before.  I've recovered 'post-formatting' data before.  If you happen to catch it RIGHT AFTER it happens there's a reasonable chance of getting that data back 100%, but if.. lets say.. you format and then reinstall windows and then defrag and then install updates and then install aces high and then defrag again and then do a virus scan and Dog only knows what else... and THEN you remember "oh poop I need that file I had before!" then it's going to be hit or miss if you can recover that file at all, let alone at 100% integrity.

So you to claim how "easy" it is to do so with $50 software and 15 minutes is flat out wrong.  Under some circumstance.. yes it may work.  Under others... oh I dunno.. after RUNNING A HARD DRIVE THROUGH A SHREDDER... extracting any data off of what's left of that drive is going to cost just a little bit more than $50... and take just a little bit longer than 15 minutes.

AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED once a hard drive is formatted (whether quick or otherwise) the data is gone.  Because of that, I would NEVER recommend that anyone do even a quick format of their hard drive without being 100% certain that they have backed up anything they aren't willing to lose.  Assuming it has been properly backed up then there would be no reason at all to need to recover any information off of a formatted hard drive.

Now, if you want to look at this from a "critical files" point of view then I'll say this.  If you have things on your hard drive that you don't want anybody to recover... such as financial records, pictures of your mistress, pirated copies of movies, whatever and you are paranoid about someone recovering this information off your drive then you wouldn't be on the Aces High Bulletin Board asking the OP's question in the first place... therefore it is a moot subject anyhow.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

I don't understand why this is so hard for you to understand.  It's like you're on some kind of "Ripley is right, Tigger is wrong" kick.

You don't work with the general public, do you?  If you had any customer relations experience at all, you would understand that you NEVER want to confuse a customer. 

Oh GEE was I getting paid for this stuff? Where can I send my bank account number?  I thought this was a discussion board!

Seriously though, you learn to explain things in a way they can understand.  I work in the Automotive industry.

Hmm I work in the computer industry, perhaps that's why I had to correct your false statement?

Falcon23 asked one simply question: "What is the difference between reformatting,or wiping hard drive and reinstalling???"  That's it.

And this question does include a difference between formatting, wiping or simply reinstalling. Therefore it's completely valid to point out your erroneous statement about a format wiping something.

Yes, I've recovered 'deleted' data before.  I've recovered 'post-formatting' data before.  If you happen to catch it RIGHT AFTER it happens there's a reasonable chance of getting that data back 100%, but if.. lets say.. you format and then reinstall windows and then defrag and then install updates and then install aces high and then defrag again and then do a virus scan and Dog only knows what else... and THEN you remember "oh poop I need that file I had before!" then it's going to be hit or miss if you can recover that file at all, let alone at 100% integrity.

This is exactly the scenario why I said it's ESSENTIAL to know that the last thing you should do to is write new data a harddrive you want to recover data from. Knowing that you may dodge the bullet your scenario takes in the hiney.

So you to claim how "easy" it is to do so with $50 software and 15 minutes is flat out wrong.  Under some circumstance.. yes it may work.  Under others... oh I dunno.. after RUNNING A HARD DRIVE THROUGH A SHREDDER... extracting any data off of what's left of that drive is going to cost just a little bit more than $50... and take just a little bit longer than 15 minutes.

It's flat out correct and can be done by an amateur anytime as long as nobody made the mistake of overwriting any data on the drive after the format. Your shredding your strawman argument there if anything

AS FAR AS I AM CONCERNED once a hard drive is formatted (whether quick or otherwise) the data is gone.

See? That's where your thinking gets limited. If the 'customer' asks is there a different wiping or formatting this is where your answer became wrong.

Now, if you want to look at this from a "critical files" point of view then I'll say this.  If you have things on your hard drive that you don't want anybody to recover... such as financial records, pictures of your mistress, pirated copies of movies, whatever and you are paranoid about someone recovering this information off your drive then you wouldn't be on the Aces High Bulletin Board asking the OP's question in the first place... therefore it is a moot subject anyhow.

You're making light assumptions there. The question can be simply recovering saved games, family photo albums etc. after an accidental format. If you say the data is wiped after format, you're doing nobody any favors since it isn't.

Now, since I want to end this fruitless argument I will agree with you in that as far as reinstalling OS comes to play, a format is practically the same as wiping the harddrive clean. But those two things are pretty flying far from being the same thing.

[BaldEagl]

Since we don't know the intent of the OP's original query then Ripley is correct in pointing out that data is not eliminated from a reformmated hard drive.

If the OP simply wants to clean up his system then tigger and other's responses are appropriate but we don't know that that's he case.  He may well be thinking about selling the drive on ebay and buying a newer, bigger drive.  In that case then some education on data wiping is absolutely appropriate to this thread and everyone jumping on Riply has made too many assumptions while reading the OP.

tigger, don't think of it as confusing the client but rather educating them appropriately.  People are smarter than you're giving them credit for.

The good news is that so far everyone is right.

So, if you just want to clean up your machine do a quick format and reinstall the OS, drivers, applications and data that you've previously backed up but, if you're thinking about selling that drive on ebay run a drive wiping utility like Active@KillDisc to eliminate sensitive data.

Also, I disagree with having to do a complete install yearly or on any given schedule for that matter.  For myself I go much longer (several years) but I do meticulous system maintenance on a regular and ongoing basis and don't install/DL a lot of stuff.  I also have all of my data on a seperate drive than my OS and applications so the read/write cycles to my main drive a minimized.

[hyster]

simply put then as this has got more complecated than what it is.

format = data will not be seen by windows when you re-install.
datawipe = data is scrubbed from the drive and cannot be retrieved.

if you want to do a straight re-install then format is 100% fine.
datawiping is only needed to remove sensitive data and is not needed to re-install windows.

[Tigger29]

You're making light assumptions there. The question can be simply recovering saved games, family photo albums etc. after an accidental format. If you say the data is wiped after format, you're doing nobody any favors since it isn't.

Yes, and at the same time you are making dangerous assumptions as well, claiming that formatting can be taken lightly.  "Oh geez... who cares if I back up anything or not because I can just recover it after a format."

Listen, I'm not arguing that data can't be recovered after a Format.  I know good and well that it can.  I'm arguing the mindset that formatting isn't a potentially dangerous thing do to (to your data).  In my opinion backing up your files is a much more important thing to know and understand than recovering files from a formatted drive.  If you properly keep what you aren't willing to lose backed up, then there would never be a need to recover a file after a format.  It's that simple.

Using your line of reasoning, there would be no reason to back up anything because it can just be recovered.  Well that's flat out wrong.  Yes, there's a good chance that a lot of it can be recovered, but any data that got overwritten by say.. a new installation of windows... or a new installation of Aces High after a format is not so easy to recover.  Your $50 software and 15 minutes will not recover any information in its entirety under those conditions.  Yes, under your example of 'accidentally formatting my data drive instead of my system drive' and if nothing was done to that drive post-formatting then yes 99.99% of the data can easily be recovered, but it's dangerous to make that kind of assumption because not everyone is going to understand the difference.

I firmly believe the old saying, "An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure."  You should simple not put yourself in a position to need to recover files.  Before formatting, make SURE you are accessing the proper drive (unplug the others if need be) and you won't make this mistake.  I've done hundreds of formats under just as many hardware configurations and I have never once made this mistake.

Now with a crashed or failing hard drive is a different matter altogether.  What I'm talking about here is user created messes.

[falcon23]

Thanks for the replys all..
 I see people say"I am going to do a reinstall"...and then I see people say"I am going to reformat"..

 I was hoping that I could do something so that I wouldnt have to redownload all My windows updates...And for the record,I am not sure how to save all those if I needed too,or if it is even possible..

  Also,I have the family upgrade windows764,and was trying to get around having to use the key again if I had too,as one needs to have an already operating OS on the machine for the upgrade.Now I DID do the upgrade without having an OS installed by adjusting the # in the registry and all is fine.(I wanted a CLEAN install)..