Third Reich: Rise and fall

[Stampf]

OMG multiple thoughts....... in one post..... on this forum???   

I'll be more careful in the future. 

[VonMessa]

snicker.

I didn't see this show yet.  Was it brought to you by the same people who advocate that the top leaders of the party are now flying around inside the hollow earth, in bell shaped time machines?  

Didn't you get the memo?
 

[ROX]

Better yet:  READ Albert Speer's book.

It's FIRST HAND information from someone that was REALLY there.

Books....amazing things.



ROX

[dev1ant]

Better yet:  READ Albert Speer's book.

It's FIRST HAND information from someone that was REALLY there.

Books....amazing things.



ROX

This show is based largely upon the personal writings of Germans who were also REALLY there.  Books are always better, but that doesn't mean that quality documentaries aren't being made as well.  I only managed to catch the second part but it was one of the best documentaries on the Third Reich I've ever seen, and would highly recommend watching it.

[Tupac]

OMG multiple thoughts....... in one post..... on this forum???   

That hurts my brain just thinking about two thoughts at once.

On a related note the <brain fart> ......ouch

[ROX]

This show is based largely upon the personal writings of Germans who were also REALLY there.  Books are always better, but that doesn't mean that quality documentaries aren't being made as well.  I only managed to catch the second part but it was one of the best documentaries on the Third Reich I've ever seen, and would highly recommend watching it.

Oh--don't get me wrong, I'm sure the show is great and I can't wait to see it.

The book was great because it showed the rise & fall from a government insider.  Speer was the only major player who was convicted, served his time, and then wrote a major work (mostly while in prison) and showed true remorse for the things tied to his office.  You really have to hand it to Speer.  He could have easily walked out of prison...said he was "just following orders"...denied everything...went into obscurity...but he didn't.  Writing the book (and it's a thick read, over 500 pages if I remember) and then showing remorse was what Germany really needed at the time. 


I was lucky enough to spend a month in West Germany (BRD) my senior year in high school.  I'm happy I studied my German hard because I really needed it.  I stayed with two different families.  Except for the awesome archetecture, language, and food differences it was just like America.  The people were AWESOME and I literally loved every minute of it...(except for stepping over the first white line at the Lauenburg border crossing and having a kid step out on the DDR side and point an AK47 at my head...but that's a different story).  The families I stayed with treated me just like family.  Awesome people. 


ROX

[SmokinLoon]

I pee on 3rd reich IMO. ban me i dont care, my opinion. I have the right to express my opinion. If not so be it.

Of course you can form your own "opinions", everyone has.  But when you research and learn history you *must* put aside your personal opinions and analyze the events independent of your feelings, otherwise the information will not register for what it was.  The most important thing to keep in mind when you research history is that you are NOW and history was THEN, meaning that there are 2 sets of standards in which mankind is existing.  Do not judge them based on today's standard, you will go mad trying to make sense of it all.     

For instance, can you accept that Adolf Hitler did in fact do some legitimate good for Germany?  Can you accept that Stalin and Mao were responsible for 4X the number of non-combat civilian deaths via executions (their own people!!!) than Adolf Hitler?  No, I'm no Hitler sympathizer, but I do not cringe when he is brought up because I know there are worse monsters out there.  There are all kinds of examples of historical facts that need to be taken out of context when compared to modern standards. Always remember that before you voice your opinion.            

[Motherland]

For instance, can you accept that Adolf Hitler did in fact do some legitimate good for Germany? 

Most of what good Hitler did for Germany was destroyed in the war. He also succeeded in signing away a significant portion of German territory and, on top of that, splitting the country in half for 45 years.
I suppose you could say he set the precedent for the Autobahn system.

Stalin and Mao brought third-world agrarian latrines to major industrialized world powers within 20 years of their taking of power. Despite all of the Cold War propaganda, you can't doubt that they also improved the quality of life for most of their citizens... I'd certainly rather live in the USSR than under the Czar.

Hitler, on the other hand, took a former superpower (in every sense of the word, scientifically, militarily, industrially) in financial crisis, and after a short rally destroyed it even more completely than it had been.

He certainly didn't compare well to his contemporaries.

[SmokinLoon]

Most of what good Hitler did for Germany was destroyed in the war. He also succeeded in signing away a significant portion of German territory and, on top of that, splitting the country in half for 45 years.
I suppose you could say he set the precedent for the Autobahn system.

Stalin and Mao brought third-world agrarian latrines to major industrialized world powers within 20 years of their taking of power. Despite all of the Cold War propaganda, you can't doubt that they also improved the quality of life for most of their citizens... I'd certainly rather live in the USSR than under the Czar.

Hitler, on the other hand, took a former superpower (in every sense of the word, scientifically, militarily, industrially) in financial crisis, and after a short rally destroyed it even more completely than it had been.

He certainly didn't compare well to his contemporaries.

    Well said.  I hope more follow your lead when speaking of historical events regardless of how politically incorrect it is.  BTW, there are a whole host of things Hitler did that if you take away his name and the term "Nazi", most of the world would love to have had what German was in the mid to late 1930's.

[USRanger]

    Well said.  I hope more follow your lead when speaking of historical events regardless of how politically incorrect it is.  BTW, there are a whole host of things Hitler did that if you take away his name and the term "Nazi", most of the world would love to have had what German was in the mid to late 1930's.

[Bodhi]

Oh--don't get me wrong, I'm sure the show is great and I can't wait to see it.

The book was great because it showed the rise & fall from a government insider.  Speer was the only major player who was convicted, served his time, and then wrote a major work (mostly while in prison) and showed true remorse for the things tied to his office.  You really have to hand it to Speer.  He could have easily walked out of prison...said he was "just following orders"...denied everything...went into obscurity...but he didn't.  Writing the book (and it's a thick read, over 500 pages if I remember) and then showing remorse was what Germany really needed at the time. 


I was lucky enough to spend a month in West Germany (BRD) my senior year in high school.  I'm happy I studied my German hard because I really needed it.  I stayed with two different families.  Except for the awesome archetecture, language, and food differences it was just like America.  The people were AWESOME and I literally loved every minute of it...(except for stepping over the first white line at the Lauenburg border crossing and having a kid step out on the DDR side and point an AK47 at my head...but that's a different story).  The families I stayed with treated me just like family.  Awesome people. 


ROX

I have read both, and both are excellent reads.  I like Rise and Fall better as it has many different view points.

[zack1234]

i had a Volkwagen 1300S beetle it was poo like the Merc
My NSU Prima D was very nice though, sold it last year, kept my Dayton Albatross 250

[greens]

Of course you can form your own "opinions", everyone has.  But when you research and learn history you *must* put aside your personal opinions and analyze the events independent of your feelings, otherwise the information will not register for what it was.  The most important thing to keep in mind when you research history is that you are NOW and history was THEN, meaning that there are 2 sets of standards in which mankind is existing.  Do not judge them based on today's standard, you will go mad trying to make sense of it all.     

For instance, can you accept that Adolf Hitler did in fact do some legitimate good for Germany?  Can you accept that Stalin and Mao were responsible for 4X the number of non-combat civilian deaths via executions (their own people!!!) than Adolf Hitler?  No, I'm no Hitler sympathizer, but I do not cringe when he is brought up because I know there are worse monsters out there.  There are all kinds of examples of historical facts that need to be taken out of context when compared to modern standards. Always remember that before you voice your opinion.            

You are exacltly right on the "good" what adolf hitler did for Germany, HITLER DYING AND BEING ADRUGGY WAS THE BEST THING THAT HAPPENED FOR Germany, sorry for caps my sons bday n i aint ther quite yet in the village <in anchorage>. and also for the world, if hitler was a die hard dictator  Geramny wpould span the whole Earth. IMO. thank GOD.  greens

[Shuffler]

   
For instance, can you accept that Adolf Hitler did in fact do some legitimate good for Germany?  Can you accept that Stalin and Mao were responsible for 4X the number of non-combat civilian deaths via executions (their own people!!!) than Adolf Hitler?  No, I'm no Hitler sympathizer, but I do not cringe when he is brought up because I know there are worse monsters out there.  There are all kinds of examples of historical facts that need to be taken out of context when compared to modern standards. Always remember that before you voice your opinion.            

Good comparison.... all were detrimental to their own people. I wonder if you considered actual percentages of their own folks they killed. Germany is a really small country after all. While percentages would be interesting, it really means nothing when a countries own leader is killing his own brethren.


Rox
I'll have to get that book and read it. Sounds interesting.

[zack1234]

Would Germany's standard of living have improved without Adolf Hitler coming to power?
As today Germany is at the center of Europe with a large educated population and a industrilised ecomomy, it does not require a dictatorship to play a major role in world affairs.