Author Topic: Start brainstorming here to get time to tank engagement shorter!  (Read 1287 times)

JFalk

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Guys we need to think of a semi realistic way to get the travel time to engagement around 10-15 mins for tanks.  Bases 1 square away are 25 miles apart, the tanks go 24 mph, thats over an hour travel time, right now tanks are used for defense and limited offense.  Here are some ideas, some good some bad, feel free to add your own

1.) increase speed by about 10% but still display the correct max speeds ( kinda cheating), every little bit helps

2.) Put a improved road network in, giving an increase to speed

3.) Someone mentioned a rail system, how about each vehicle yard is linked to a train station that has a train that travels maybe 75-80 mph?

4.) What about an AI controlled High Command for each side that starts an offensive every 15-20 mins, if you want to take part in it your vehicle is placed 10-15k from the objective/front.

outta ideas now, maybe more will come to me

sr2053

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Start brainstorming here to get time to tank engagement shorter!
« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2000, 05:53:00 PM »
 
Quote
.) Someone mentioned a rail system, how about each vehicle yard is linked to a train station that has a train that travels maybe 75-80 mph?
sounds like a great idea!  

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[This message has been edited by sr2053 (edited 04-08-2000).]

Hans

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« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2000, 06:33:00 PM »
I love these tanks.      They are why I started my account last week.  This is what I want.  Its still early, but you can see how everyone loves this, since the arena hit an all time high player count.

The tanks are still a bit rough around the edges though.  It does take a long time needed to reach the enemy in one.

It is not a problem though.  Add some faster tanks latter on.  The Sherman, T-34, and Panther tanks go 35mph.

I too think fudging the actual speeds of tanks isn't all that bad of an idea, especially since the terrain is efectivly a desert terrain.

No slowdown climing hills or smaller hills.  What killed me was how long it took to cross a hill at 10mph in 3rd gear.  The other factor would also be removing the 90mph coasting down the other side of the hill.

Or my personal favorite.  A more army friendly map.  The vehicle bases scattered about are nice, but too far away.  I don't want more, I just thought they should be closer to the airfields.  Make a paratrooper air assault to capture the army camp (one ack and one building are easy to take), then the army guys can spawn a force to roll over to the airfields.

Hanz.

[This message has been edited by Hans (edited 04-08-2000).]

Offline Brazos

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« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2000, 06:50:00 PM »
We want to keep things as accurate as possible, so I don't know about adding more speed. Trains and giant cargo planes will be neat, but are a ways off. I like Haha's ideas in his thread. But the short term solution would be closer fields. Much easier with the terrain editor. Cya up...Braz

HaHa

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« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2000, 11:30:00 PM »
Trains, Roads (tunnels and bridges), Cargo planes or/and tank carriers (e.g. semi), ships also can factor in later.

Offline 10Bears

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« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2000, 01:07:00 AM »
Hi there

Been thinking about ground strat for several months and was going to post but Pyro and Hitech said they weren't going to use vehicles and didn't like AI. Now since vehicles are included, I thought I'd throw up my 2 cents

TRAINS  ROADS, RIVERS, BRIDGES, TOWNS

When you log on, you have to decide whether to command a battalion of 50 tanks, an army corps of engineers or a tanker squad (5 tanks).  You can log on and start immediately at the front under someone else command.  
   The war starts with 10 battalions for each country. As commander of a battalion,  you start at the train station in the rear. As long as no bridges are taken out, you can move your force as far into enemy country as posable. Once engaged, even if the player (command) gets dumped or logs off, the battalion stays where it is someone else can take over either as commander, or squad leader. If your tank gets blown up, you can transfer to next tank in line. When all 5 of your tanks are destroyed, your truly dead. You'll have to transfer to the next squad in the battalion.

As bridges are taken out the engineers move up to repair or build pontoon bridges. (train bridges are made of tougher stuff and would require a heavy bomber attack to take 'em out). Also train tunnels could be used to hid trains and prevent nme attack. Theres also gun carriages so these aren't easy targets at all. If the train  is destroyed, the remaining tanks on board would have to debark at that point.

The parts of the map we have now with farmland could be highly detailed with a small village, church, business center small farms,  barns  and hay stacks to hid tanks.  
If a battle should take place here, the buildings tanks etc that are destroyed, remain destroyed for the duration of the war.

Paratroopers become key players in securing crossroads, brides, small villages until the main force arrives.

Once villages, bridgeheads, airfields are secured, the battle line moves up to that point. resupply becomes an issue. This is where AI comes in as nobody is going to want to drive a truck or lead a column of trucks to the front. A commander can request a resupply at any time. Speaking of AI, once on a road you can hit the X key for auto the tanks trucks etc in your command stay on the road unless attacked they automatically go into defensive position.

Someone mentioned a few months ago about having a limited number of planes available at front line airfields. I like that idea. 20 planes assigned to each field near the front. Unlimited number at rear fields. The player gets extra points for flying replacement planes to front line fields. This would allow tank battles to take place without so much harassment from the air. Also, if you are part of the air war, there is a bulletin board in the tower with requests for air support from ground commanders and their locations.
 
   The war is decided when the nme main city is surrounded by at least 2 battalions Articles are signed and we all go home to make babies. All the ground forces are reverted back to their starting points. The new game starts out as the phony war (spring and early summer of 1940) and doesn't get heavy until someone decides to move his battalion up and crosses the country border.  

This concept could take 2hours to win the war if the commanders would cooperate with each other or could take 2 months depending.  
=Bears=


Offline Citabria

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« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2000, 02:07:00 AM »
simple solution.... A lot more army bases!!!

they dont even have to be bases they can be factories or whatever you like! would make tank battles much more common  

make each vehicle (fortification 15 miles apart or less and give vehicles the ability to capture ONLY I repeat ONLY vehicle only bases.

it makes sense and we dont have to make panzers that go 60mph that way  


real life fronts were close like that if I remember right  


make these new vehicle bases somthing different... like towns or somthing for variety this way vehicle capture towns with m16 personell carriers or trucks  


i think its logical and makes sense  
Fester was my in game name until September 2013

Offline Beaz

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« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2000, 04:11:00 AM »
Pretty obvious... create more army bases set apart by a travelling distance akin to 20 minutes.

Bet you $100 that after one week nobody is going to be driving the ground vehicles because it is not worth peoples time to spend an hour driving between depots and fields. But they would do it for 20 minutes travelling time.

Regards

Daren

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Hans

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« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2000, 04:45:00 AM »
Eh, I was thinking we don't need more bases.  Like I said, just make the ones we have closer to the airfields.

For each airbase, it has an army base 'twin' only a few miles away.  The airbase is heavily defended by AAA, but the army base isn't.  Either take the airbase outright with the conventional attack we've had up till now, or take the easier army base and use the ground vehicles to aid in the attack.

Between the pairs of bases should be some permanent ground clutter for tanks to play in.  This way you don't need to cover the entire gameworld in the stuff.  That ought ot help keep the framerates up.

Oh, and that rumored self-propelled artillery gun and M-2 grunt carrier halftracks couldn't hurt.

Its going to be fun.  

Hanz.

Offline snafu

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« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2000, 05:21:00 AM »
Hi All,
 I like 10Bears ideas a lot. But I would have thought a rail system would be a nightmare to operate with trains colliding all over the place (But worth pursuing) Anything to help the artillery get to the action quicker is worth looking at but let's not forget It's a flight sim. Moving the bases closer together would (I think) spoil the aviation side. What about being able to program a start & end route into a tank etc and leave it to to make it's own way while you go off and fly a plane or something. The tank would have no AI and be a sitting target but it would help get rid of the wait. (The tank could be "Re joined" at any time).

Just my 2 cents worth.

TTFN
snafu

Offline Fury

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« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2000, 07:31:00 AM »
I am a flight simmer at heart so I will probably go back to my bombers soon, but I do like trying the ground vehicles.  I think true ground simmers might be a different breed than what we are used to seeing around here, and hopefully some of those will start showing up soon....the ones who understand that tanks don't do more than 25 mph or so....

When I fly bombers it can take me up to 45 minutes to get to where I want to be....that's 45 boring minutes of climbing...I look at tanks the same way.  Long drive to get to the action, except I seem to have more action driving my tank/m16 than I do climbing my bomber.

I do like the ideas posted here and I'm not trying to disagree with the fact of the long drive, just shedding some light on my views of it that I use to try to keep me in the ground vehicles.

Fury

Offline Ghosth

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« Reply #11 on: April 09, 2000, 07:35:00 PM »
First off let me get a great big WTG to HTC.
I don't think I've ever had so much fun online or off EVER!  

Next I see a lot of talk about shorting distances, or speeding up tanks.a NO NO in my book. Trains I'd love but they'll get strafed also & be down. Roads which I'd love to see modeled with a major speed increase IF it's possible.

How about an alternative.  Put more vehicle depots closer to a "Front line" say 5 miles back. Put the Airfields Behind these scattered in depth. This should put the air & land battles into a "no mans land" situation.

Make captureing or closeing a vehicle depot a bit tougher than it seems to be now. Or better yet, make it very difficult to bomb a vehicle depot, yet easier to take with tanks & M16's.

Not that I'm complaining cause I love it as is. It is however difficult to spend a hour (or more) to get to someplace then get picked off by a plane flying overhead.

Fact remains however that HiTech & Pyro have an excellent vision of what they want AH to be. I trust them to make it enjoyable for all just as fast as they can. Thats good enough for me.



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HaHa

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« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2000, 12:38:00 AM »
10Bears good ideas but I think AH won't be going into this much detail. There is a game called WWII Online that is being developed in this much detail... I think HT and crew would prefer not competing with them.

Of course if HT does want to compete with them he can always hire a bunch of us on and we'll turn this game into the most fun ground, air, sea game there ever was  

Offline MANDOBLE

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« Reply #13 on: April 10, 2000, 02:26:00 AM »
The first and only time i used a tank, after 45 mins travel I was destroyed by the enemy base Ack hitting my frontal arc. How is that possible? Do we have 88mm Ack modeled? And about the frustrating 45 mins travel, the solution is simple, just put some roads. Anyway the work done here with vehicles is simply GREAT.

Greg 'wmutt' Cook

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Start brainstorming here to get time to tank engagement shorter!
« Reply #14 on: April 10, 2000, 02:48:00 AM »
Outstanding Ideas Ghosth. (and I'm not just saying that cause you're my boss ) I think that by making a map with defined front lines at the start of a TOD would be good.  I would also like to see a good network of roads in each country but not too many between countries.  This would make for some stratigic points of interests for each country to protect.  In the future, you could also use the roads as supply lines for future strat. modifications (HiTech, Don't you love to have your dream of the perfect flight sim, be publicly disected and reassembled every fifteen minutes or so?   )
The only problem I see with "speeding up" tanks is that they will become harder to hit, and that would not be very fair.  I think one of the main reasons they pop well now is we have been flying planes for a while now and are getting used to them, the tanks are new. I'm sure we will find ways to juke and weave to live longer as time goes on.  Also, it might be better to have at least the M-16 be availible on at the airfields as well as the tank sheds if the sheds get moved away from the fields.

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Greg 'wmutt' Cook
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