Torque or Power ?

[Strip]

We run 4.30 gears with a two speed Powerglide, interestingly enough it would slow down with a three or four speed or manual. The converter stalls at 6,000, shifts at 7,000 rpm and goes through the 1/8 at 6,900. The amount of gear(s) that a particular car needs depends on the torque, weight, and engine combination. It also is greatly effected by the area in which the vehicle optimized for. Our car gains only 400 rpm through the back half yet picks up an additional 30 mph.

Figure that one out...   

Strip

[CAP1]

it's probably the rest of the car catching up to the engine. 

 our camaro has a turbo 400 in it. we got that from another local racer that switched to a powerglide. i forget the exact number, but he said it hurt his 60' times, but his overall et was the same.

 we have a 5,500 converter in the camaro, but it stalls at 5000rpm. se set the low rpm limiter at 4600rpm, as that seems to be where she likes to launch. hi rpm is set at 7,000. we shift at 6400rpm on the 1/2 and 2/3, go through the traps at 9.96(best time on that engine) at 131 mph, turning just a hair under 6400rpm. on a good pass, the shift light if flickering in the traps. we run a trans brake, but shift the car manually.

[MrRiplEy[H]]

ok heres a question - if low end torque is so great, why arent you all driving turbo-diesels? can you buy a turbo-diesel vette or viper?

Here in euroland most family cars are already turbodiesels. They're very comfortable to drive and get great mpg. Vettes and Vipers are mostly for teenagers who want to compensate. Even the police force largely uses diesel nowadays in many countries.

[B3YT]

BMW 516d  is a nice ride .  i have a customer with one.  probably tear a camero a new one 0-60 and will actually turn too not just plough on  when you turn the wheel . 

 I'd rather have a smaller car with better power to weight like the lotus exige . 1.8ltr engine 0-60 in 4.5 sec and has buckets loads of grip and cheaper than yank crapmobiles . Great fun to drive too .  It just points and shoots . No fuss no stupid 4ltr that produce almost no power just well engineered sports car that looks damn sexy too . It drives like a kart  , you can throw it into corners at silly speeds and it will stick .

[Strip]

Vettes and Vipers are mostly for teenagers who want to compensate.

You clearly need to look at the customer base of these two automobiles, you are way off base.

Strip

[Tyrannis]

You clearly need to look at the customer base of these two automobiles, you are way off base.

Strip

viper>vette any day.

doesnt the viper have the most torque of any other vehicle? top gear kept saying this a couple of times in there review of the viper.

plus hennesey has been running tests to prove the're viper is the fastest car in the world. i believe the highest unofficial speed its reached was 302. but something allways nocks it out of qualification (on-board computer fries,transmission goes, etc)

[Strip]

Most torque in stock trim....not a chance!

The Hennesey Viper is a wicked fast ride but there is not much Dodge left in that car. That is like saying a Pro 5.0 Mustang is the fastest 1/4 mile vehicle in the world. Sure its fast, but its not a Ford anymore, it certainly has very few OEM parts left other than the basic shell. By your own admission you have acknowledged the biggest downfall with the Hennesey Viper, durability. Nearly every article, magazine, TV show and gossip story involves some sort of breakage at some point.

As far as the Viper being better than a Corvette, you clearly have never driven both vehicles. The Corvette has much better street manners, sporting a better ride, better comfort and better fuel economy. The Viper rides like a tank, radiates heat from transmission tunnel and the AC is adequate at best. The maintenance on a Corvette is far cheaper, its easier to work on and more parts available. On track performance is nearly identical, the lap times at Nurburgring were within a couple of seconds.

The Viper might beat the Corvette in a couple of areas but it will punish you at the same time. The Corvette is much more forgiving and is actually a street car that performs like racecar. The Viper is a racecar that pretends to be a street car, a piss poor one at that.

So no, Viper>Vette does not compute....

Strip

[Shuffler]

The Camaro I bought for my Daughter... we like the horse power. The Tahoe for my Wife.... horse poser. My 3/4 ton chevy crew cab has a Duramax and Allison trans... you can figure that one out.


I've been to Hennessey's shop several times. We have several Hennessey Camaros in the Club.

I actually was at the unvailing of the Hennessey Venom that was on Car & Driver's cover.

[Tyrannis]

Most torque in stock trim....not a chance!

The Hennesey Viper is a wicked fast ride but there is not much Dodge left in that car. That is like saying a Pro 5.0 Mustang is the fastest 1/4 mile vehicle in the world. Sure its fast, but its not a Ford anymore, it certainly has very few OEM parts left other than the basic shell. By your own admission you have acknowledged the biggest downfall with the Hennesey Viper, durability. Nearly every article, magazine, TV show and gossip story involves some sort of breakage at some point.

As far as the Viper being better than a Corvette, you clearly have never driven both vehicles. The Corvette has much better street manners, sporting a better ride, better comfort and better fuel economy. The Viper rides like a tank, radiates heat from transmission tunnel and the AC is adequate at best. The maintenance on a Corvette is far cheaper, its easier to work on and more parts available. On track performance is nearly identical, the lap times at Nurburgring were within a couple of seconds.

The Viper might beat the Corvette in a couple of areas but it will punish you at the same time. The Corvette is much more forgiving and is actually a street car that performs like racecar. The Viper is a racecar that pretends to be a street car, a piss poor one at that.

So no, Viper>Vette does not compute....

Strip

actually yes, i have driven in both. my friends dad owns an 09 corvette and a friend who own an 08 viper. and i got to say the viper is  just alot more fun to drive. it feels like a sportcar should. it has pure raw power to it. why would you buy a sportscar for comfort anyways? i would take a hennesey dodge viper venom twin turbo with spartan interior over some posh lambo sporting leather seats and etc. if i wanted that stuff i'd buy a sedan.

and many auto-magazines name the viper ACR as a better track car than the corvette. (car&driver, motortrend) sure the viper has some wear&tear issues, but ever good car has its faults. even top gear named the viper better than the vette.

most ppl ive seen who like a vette over a viper is because of 3 reason.

1.the styling (personally i love the vipers aggresive "GTFO of my face!" look)
2. they like the vette simply because it has a longer history than the viper.
3. there hardcore chevy fans.

only thing ive seen from a vette i like, is that headsup display it has. other than that i'd take a viper over it.

a vipers meaner,faster,better looking(opinion)better engine(opinion) and cmon, it has a HEMI, whats not to love about that?


-flame suit upgraded to resist angry chevy fans-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hsiUJ8aPMs

[MrRiplEy[H]]

You clearly need to look at the customer base of these two automobiles, you are way off base.

Strip

Pardon me, toys for mid-life-crisis dads that their teenagers can then use 

Well to be honest in warmer climate I could see someone actually using a Vette, here in the north you can drive it max 4 months a year so they're very rare.

[Reaper90]

Vettes and Vipers are mostly for teenagers who want to compensate.

That's funny right there.

I could say something about smug diesel sedan-driving "holier than thous" who look down their noses at sports car owners, in an effort to look superior, but I won't...

<----- Vette owner who doesn't give a "rat's arse" whether anyone else likes his car, but owns it because it is one hello'va blast to drive.

FWIW I like sedans, diesels, 2-strokes, 4-strokes, classics, imports, domestics, muscle cars, sports cars, kit cars, race cars, etc etc etc.... I'm not an arrogant enuff bellybutton to look down at anyone for owning and driving what they like.........

[Reaper90]

actually yes, i have driven in both. my friends dad owns an 09 corvette and a friend who own an 08 viper.

What flavor Corvette is your "friends dad's" ? My guess is it's probably a pretty basic Vette, an auto trans even.

Do me a favor, and compare apples to apples. Take that Viper, look at what it cost to purchase new, around $90K, compared to around $45K for a new "basic" Vette. Why would you compare the two and expect the Viper to not be better? A more reasonable comparison for you to make would be to go and compare a Corvette that is in the same price range as the $90K Viper, say maybe a Z06. The Z06 stomps the Viper. Well, then one would say "But what about the Viper ACR?" Well, for $120K you could get a Viper ACR, but what you get is a car that is pretty much undriveable on the street. It does put down some pretty impressive numbers, but remember it comes from the factory on race tires that will be worn completely out after just a couple thousand miles of street driving (if even that), and a suspension that will compress your vertibrae on anything but the smoothest of roads, where the ZR1 Corvette, for the same money, is smooth as silk, MUCH more civilized, and offers nearly identical performance as the track-only Viper ACR, and does it on street tires, not special race rubber. Dollar for dollar, the Vette is a "better buy" than the Viper.

and many auto-magazines name the viper ACR as a better track car than the corvette. (car&driver, motortrend) sure the viper has some wear&tear issues, but ever good car has its faults. even top gear named the viper better than the vette.

As long as you're only ever driving it on a race track, the Viper ACR is a better choice.

[Tyrannis]

What flavor Corvette is your "friends dad's" ? My guess is it's probably a pretty basic Vette, an auto trans even.

Do me a favor, and compare apples to apples. Take that Viper, look at what it cost to purchase new, around $90K, compared to around $45K for a new "basic" Vette. Why would you compare the two and expect the Viper to not be better? A more reasonable comparison for you to make would be to go and compare a Corvette that is in the same price range as the $90K Viper, say maybe a Z06. The Z06 stomps the Viper. Well, then one would say "But what about the Viper ACR?" Well, for $120K you could get a Viper ACR, but what you get is a car that is pretty much undriveable on the street. It does put down some pretty impressive numbers, but remember it comes from the factory on race tires that will be worn completely out after just a couple thousand miles of street driving (if even that), and a suspension that will compress your vertibrae on anything but the smoothest of roads, where the ZR1 Corvette, for the same money, is smooth as silk, MUCH more civilized, and offers nearly identical performance as the track-only Viper ACR, and does it on street tires, not special race rubber. Dollar for dollar, the Vette is a "better buy" than the Viper.

As long as you're only ever driving it on a race track, the Viper ACR is a better choice.

if i was going to buy a sports car, i wouldnt want it to be "civilized" the viper just gives a ride no other car can match, its so unique.
sure, it beats you up after awhile, but at the end of the day its worth it.its a beast on and off the track, and the raw power you get from it is like nothing a vette could ever reproduce.

the vette is a car your mother could drive to the grocery store and back. the vipers a weekend warrior that has the best attitude a sportscar could ever have.

and how does a zo6 "stomp" a viper? you have a 8.3 ltr 600hp engine going up against a 406hp engine. at stock the viper would smoke it in a race and on the drag strip.
stats for z06

Event   Performance
0-60 mph   3.9 sec[5]
0-100 mph   9.2 sec[6]
0-100-0 mph   13.56 sec[6]
1/4 Mile   11.9 sec [3]
Skid Pad   1.03 G[6]
Top Speed   171 mph (275 km/h)
Nürburgring Nordschleife Lap Time *   7:56[7]

now the viper's.
0–60 mph (0–97 km/h): 3.4 sec [15]
0–100 mph (0–160 km/h): 7.6 sec [15]
quickest quarter mile: 10.92 sec @ 127.79 mph (205.66 km/h) [16]
average quarter mile: 11.6 to 11.9 sec.
top speed: 202 mph (325 km/h)
slalom: 74.2 mph (119 km/h)+
skidpad average acceleration: 1.06 g (10.4 m/s²)
100–0 mph (160–0 km/h): 270 ft (82 m)


viper has faster acceleration, bigger engine. more horsepower. a higher topspeed. faster on the quarter mile (its average beats the zo6's quickest, and the vipers quickest blows the zo6 away)

only thing (i think) the vetter has over a viper is mantenance and price. a vette is just too tame for me to take seriously as a sportscar. especially when lined up next to a viper.

[CHAPPY]

put a super charger on the vette, and it would smoke the viper and still save 40k.

[Tyrannis]

put a super charger on the vette, and it would smoke the viper and still save 40k.

put a super charger on the viper, and it'll smoke the vette and anything else in its way 

i hate when people say one car can "smoke" the other when the first car is all tuned up and the other is just stock.

its like saying a man all shot-up with steriods is gonna beat up a normal reguler man. of course he will! duh!