P-61 Black Widow petition

[Guppy35]

I'm not quite sure I agree with you're opinion that these 30+ aircrafts had a larger role than the P-61A/B.I have to say that there are many of these aircraft in your list that I'd like to see added, but on the other hand there are just as many that would never make it out of the hanger, or IMO be a waste of HTCs resources.  Do I think the Beau or the He-111 belong in AH before the P-61A/B.  Yes.  Do I think some of the aircraft that you suggested impact on the WWII were less significant than the P-61; Yes.

I'd like to have the 61 for a multitude of reasons.  Namely the engineering side; the spoilerons, radar (which doesn't matter in AH), remote turrets and the overall size of the P-61 make it a favorite for me.  On a more personal note, it was the first aircraft I seen growing up at WPAFB, and I will always hold a fondness for the 61.

On a side note, I went back to the plane list BBS members compiled for HTC of planes that they'd like to see added.  P-61(17 votes) B-29(10 votes).  And the 61 never made it into the poll   Maybe HTC has something in mind for it.

<Puts check in the mail to Copr for the Beau comment>
 

[mthrockmor]

Always willing to learn and accept that I am wrong, or a better way I have looked up many of these planes. It seems to me that many of them are more out of nostalgia then a potent fighting weapon. I can see the Pe-2, though it would be like the latest Mosquito with no guns. It is a fast, nimble dive bomber not a heavy jabo. The Italian three engine bomber also seems a smart idea. Many of the other planes strike as the most recent Betty. It was all the rage for about a week and now we almost never see them.

I know I should take into consideration that fly exclusively 'late war' and many fly early or mid-war and these many other planes fit there. Take the D.520, I'd love to fly it but it gets no where with Spit16s, P-51s, Doras and LAs.

For those who are far more knowledgable about this discussion than I, don't list 30. Post the top-10 planes, with my beloved P-61 being number 11. Don't count the B-29 since it is already in the works. And I would be happy to see the Me-410. Actually, I want to see the F8F Bearcat and the German Arrow (forget number but it hand an engine in front and back, faster prop plane of the war.) I'm assured those two will never make it since they didn't have combat but...

I look forward to a narrowed list.

Warmest,
Boo

[Anaxogoras]

There were heavy-fighter versions of the Pe-2, but the main arena already has an aircraft to fill every conceivable niche, so who the hell cares if it can blow up towns and vulch well?

[Guppy35]

Beaufighter
Ki-43
He-111
Pe-2
Me-410
Halifax
Yak-1 or Yak-3
Dinah
SM-79
Fiat CR-42

[Karnak]

Pe-2
Ju188/Do217/He177 (pick one, any one)
Ki-43
Beaufighter
Wellington
He111
Tu-2
Me410
S.M.79
D.520

[Pigslilspaz]

Short Stirling

[skorpion]

Short Stirling

B29...oh wait....

[Guppy35]

Short Stirling

Go read up on the Short Stirling and it's operational career.  You'll figure out quickly with they came off Ops and ended up Glider tugs.  You'll also find out why the Lanc and Halifax crews appreciated knowing Stirlings were around, and it wasn't because they were more effective.

[Plawranc]

Machfly,

I was specifically avoiding mention of variants of aircraft we already have.  Keep in mind I am not mentioning things I think were less significant then the P-61, so no Ki-102, He162, B7A, Pe-8 or Farman F222.  I'll toss out some more airframes we don't have:

B6N "Jill"
Boomerang
D4Y "Judy"
D.520
Foker D.XXI
G3M "Nell"
Halifax
Hampden
Ki-21 "Sally"
Ki-45 "Nick"
Ki-48 "Lily"
Ki-49 "Helen"
MB-152
M.S.406
PB2Y Coranado
Potez 630/631
PV1 Ventura
PZL P.11
PZL P.37
Whitworth


I will also specify that I am not advocating adding all of these airframes to AH as there would be a lot of essential duplication.  There is very little difference in terms of effect on a scenario to choose between a G4M "Betty" and a Ki-21 "Sally" or a Ki-49 "Helen", likewise there is little effective difference between a Lancaster and a Halifax.

[Tyrannis]

Go read up on the Short Stirling and it's operational career.  You'll figure out quickly with they came off Ops and ended up Glider tugs.  You'll also find out why the Lanc and Halifax crews appreciated knowing Stirlings were around, and it wasn't because they were more effective.

wikipedia states that the "short" stirling could outturn ju88's and bf110's because of its HUGE wings, any truth to this?

[Mirage]

no one will ever know, usually when a stirling saw a 110 or 88 it was already screaming towards the ground on fire with no wings

[Guppy35]

wikipedia states that the "short" stirling could outturn ju88's and bf110's because of its HUGE wings, any truth to this?

That would be no.  Might want to double check those "huge" wings.  They were the main problem based on some silly RAF requirements based on hanger size.

[Tyrannis]

That would be no.  Might want to double check those "huge" wings.  They were the main problem based on some silly RAF requirements based on hanger size.

idk, the exact quote from wikipedia was.

"But the pilots were delighted that the big wings gave the stirling the ability to outturn the ju88 and me110 nightfighters that came up after it". or something like that.

[Guppy35]

The wingspan was limited on the Stirling due to the need for it to be moved into RAF hangers that had 100 foot doors.  this meant that the Stirling had 99 foot wingspan.  It could never get the altitude of the Lanc or Halifax.  When they knew Stirlings were with them, they were happy as the Stirlings would be the targets down lower for flak and fighters making it safer for the Lanc and Hali.

[5PointOh]

Beaufighter
Ki-43
He-111
Pe-2
Me-410
P-61A/B
Yak-1 or Yak-3
Dinah
SM-79
Fiat CR-42

Fixed