Author Topic: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake  (Read 1448 times)

Offline Krusty

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 26745
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2011, 12:19:58 AM »
I would not say that.

8 guns is quite nice. Makes a glancing blow a killer shot.

Offline oakranger

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8380
      • http://www.slybirds.com/
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2011, 12:33:15 AM »
I would not say that.

8 guns is quite nice. Makes a glancing blow a killer shot.

It can make a quick kill, but performance of the P-47 can be affected negative by 8 gun package.  to bad they never looked into putting 4 X 20 mm on instead of .50 cal. 
Oaktree

56th Fighter group

Offline Seadog36

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 666
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2011, 03:20:40 AM »
It can make a quick kill, but performance of the P-47 can be affected negative by 8 gun package.  to bad they never looked into putting 4 X 20 mm on instead of .50 cal. 


:rofl noob thread~ try 8 .50's if you long for 4 20mms. How about a Typhoon or 190 if you must have cannon!?

Offline Seadog36

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 666
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2011, 03:45:16 AM »
The fact of the matter is many Jugs had 6 guns. This wasn't always up to the pilot. You flew what you had, you had to stay in formation, you probably all flew the same configuration. Even the early jugs often only had 6 guns adn 267 rpg. The standard loadout for 8 guns was often only 200 rpg. Some 6-gun setups went as high as 300 or in 1-2 cases I've seen 310 rpg on a 6-gun setup, but for the most part 267 was it.

The large ammo load was never used. I wish they're take it from the game. 425 rpg? Poppycock. 300 seems about the most (even that's the exception to the rule) and that only on the 6-gun setup.

Hitorically speaking 6 guns/267 rpg is the only accurate loadout currently on the jug.


P.S. In the PTO there was more than ever a desire to lessen weight. Early on they had no range, and every pound was that much less they could fly. Later when they had the range, they were over-burdened with late model Ds and then N models as well. They would load up 3 bombs, rockets, or rockets and DTs, or any combination. To counteract this heavily overloaded plane on rough unfinished landing strips as well as short runway and trees at the end, it was not uncommon to remove all but 2 guns and have a reduced ammo loadout for them. Even still, some of these ground pounders became aces.

You didn't need much to shoot down the Japanese craft. A hard fart and they'd keel over justabout. 8 guns was overkill and if the option was to remove 2 guns and half the ammo, and be able to fly 100 mi further and still down 10 enemies, it was worth it (vs having to turn back from lack of fuel)


Krusty~ I own 24 well refranced books just on P-47s. There are only 3 instances where less than 8 guns were used.

1) In stateside training and gunnery practice, when 4 guns were used
2) For P-47's based in Hawaii that intercepted Japaneese ballon bombs, when 2 guns were used
3) For P-47M's which had a 6 gun package for speed.

In the Pacific they extended range by adding fuel capacity, the early 47's in the theater had 200 gallon wing tanks produced by Ford motor Co. of Australia, and the obvious internal wing tanks in the N later. They never removed guns for that purpose. But please prove me wrong and find one credible source or account to the contrary. I will be stunned if you can.

In the case of the 425rpg, I never disputed that, that is pure fiction. Just over 300rpg is the most I can find cited.




Offline oakranger

  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 8380
      • http://www.slybirds.com/
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2011, 09:39:30 AM »


:rofl noob thread~ try 8 .50's if you long for 4 20mms. How about a Typhoon or 190 if you must have cannon!?

Should have been more clear on this.  Used 20 mm for scarfing ground objects.  There was a experimental 20mm wing mounted set for the P-47, the results where poor as it only care some 30 rounds each and to much drag. 






Oaktree

56th Fighter group

Offline Krusty

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 26745
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #20 on: January 30, 2011, 12:01:56 PM »

Krusty~ I own 24 well refranced books just on P-47s. There are only 3 instances where less than 8 guns were used.

1) In stateside training and gunnery practice, when 4 guns were used
2) For P-47's based in Hawaii that intercepted Japaneese ballon bombs, when 2 guns were used
3) For P-47M's which had a 6 gun package for speed.

I believe you are correct on the P-47M, however I don't think the 6-gun option was as scarce as you say. Even early production models (not prototypes, not 1-offs) were tested to determine combat effectiveness with only 6 guns on board.


I started a thread on it here:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,297996.msg3810863.html#msg3810863

But the knee-jerk "don't touch my plane!"-style comments were getting too much. If you ignore those, the info is pretty interesting.

Offline ImADot

  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 6215
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #21 on: January 30, 2011, 12:52:49 PM »
Default Skins as in the Default Skin? Not any of the player created ones?

I can select any available player created skin in FSO, even when I create and join missions.

Yeah, but when the mission lifts, everyone in the mission gets the default skin regardless of what anyone chose in the hangar.
My Current Rig:
GigaByte GA-X99-UD4 Mobo w/ 16Gb RAM
Intel i7 5820k, Win7 64-bit
NVidia GTX 970 4Gb ACX 2.0
Track IR, CH Fighterstick, CH Pro Throttle, CH Pro Pedals

Offline Nefarious

  • Aces High CM Staff
  • Plutonium Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 15858
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #22 on: January 30, 2011, 02:45:28 PM »
Yeah, but when the mission lifts, everyone in the mission gets the default skin regardless of what anyone chose in the hangar.

There is a work around.

Create a mission and have your pilots join. Tell your pilots to then go to the hangar to arm and skin their aircraft with the same load out as the mission

Now, instead of launching with the mission when prompted. Tell your pilots to just launch from the correct spawn point. They can hit fighter, attack or ok once on the runway.

They will then retain the skin and load outs they chose and still be part of the mission.
There must also be a flyable computer available for Nefarious to do FSO. So he doesn't keep talking about it for eight and a half hours on Friday night!

Offline Seadog36

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 666
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #23 on: January 30, 2011, 03:05:59 PM »
I believe you are correct on the P-47M, however I don't think the 6-gun option was as scarce as you say. Even early production models (not prototypes, not 1-offs) were tested to determine combat effectiveness with only 6 guns on board.


I started a thread on it here:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,297996.msg3810863.html#msg3810863

But the knee-jerk "don't touch my plane!"-style comments were getting too much. If you ignore those, the info is pretty interesting.

I have only ever seen one reference for a 325th P-40 in Tunisia with 2 .50s removed for a lighter more maneuverable 4 gun package~ the picture shows rags stuffed in the opening of the vacant gun bays.

I've read many accounts of P-47/51 pilots experiencing jammed guns in combat, so on the other hand I would imagine you would want to have as many chances as you could get when you made it onto your opponent's 6.

Quite a bit of good info in that thread too btw. Herschel Green of the 325th Checkertails, took down 2 109s and 4 Ju-52s on one mission but broke off on the 5th Ju-52 because he saw tracers indicating his last rounds when he in fact had a whole additional belt in each gun. He had borrowed someone else's plane who had the heavier loadout and he was not aware he had mor ammunition.

There is a work around.

Create a mission and have your pilots join. Tell your pilots to then go to the hangar to arm and skin their aircraft with the same load out as the mission

Now, instead of launching with the mission when prompted. Tell your pilots to just launch from the correct spawn point. They can hit fighter, attack or ok once on the runway.

They will then retain the skin and load outs they chose and still be part of the mission.

Offline Seadog36

  • Nickel Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 666
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #24 on: January 30, 2011, 03:07:14 PM »
There is a work around.

Create a mission and have your pilots join. Tell your pilots to then go to the hangar to arm and skin their aircraft with the same load out as the mission

Now, instead of launching with the mission when prompted. Tell your pilots to just launch from the correct spawn point. They can hit fighter, attack or ok once on the runway.

They will then retain the skin and load outs they chose and still be part of the mission.

I'll have to try that with my squad:aok Nice tip

Offline Krusty

  • Radioactive Member
  • *******
  • Posts: 26745
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #25 on: January 30, 2011, 08:46:16 PM »
Basically you launch manually but are on misson vox, and I believe mission waypoints still show up on map. Works if you can coordinate everyone. Otherwise they pick whatever skin they want.

Offline perdue3

  • Aces High CM Staff
  • Platinum Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 4672
Re: Side Assignments and CiCs for Dillingers Wake
« Reply #26 on: February 01, 2011, 10:36:02 PM »
Need JG 53's confirmation for CiC duty.
C.O. Kommando Nowotny 

FlyKommando.com