i shouldn't do this

[Reaper90]

GM even moved some of the better known vette techs over to the camaro line.

GM has always done this with their people. Case in point: John Cafaro, lead designer for Corvette in the '90's. After the C5 hit the market in 1997, GM moved him to...............:drum roll:...............trucks.

GM moves their people from one product to another every few years. You may have been on the Cobalt/Sunfire 10 years ago, Corvette 5 years ago, and trucks today... and in 5 years from now you could be who knows where.

Corvette and Camaro are two different products for two different markets. Yes, some Corvette owners have bought Camaros. I'm sure there are many different factors at play in those purchase decisions that have absolutely nothing to do with Corvette's relative health in the market. GM doesn't care if they lose a few Corvette buyers to the Camaro SS. Does that mean Corvette is "on the down swing" and Chevy is gonna all of a sudden dump the Vette and make the Camaro their halo car? Nah. They still wind up with a Chevy in the garage. What GM wants is to win buyers away from Porsche and other European marques. That's why there's a Chevy Corvette factory race team at Le Mans each June, not a Camaro one.

At the last Corvette and Chevy Expo at George R Brown convention center, one of our member camaros was the most powerful vehicle in the building.

stock power? or a modified Camaro? Do you think he'd be willing to line his 'Maro up next to a new ZR1 at the 1/4 mile for pink slips?

I know a guy with an 1,100 hp streetable Corvette. If he had shown up at a meeting such as that, would people not be singing the song of Corvette's demise? 

[Shuffler]

GM has always done this with their people. Case in point: John Cafaro, lead designer for Corvette in the '90's. After the C5 hit the market in 1997, GM moved him to...............:drum roll:...............trucks.

GM moves their people from one product to another every few years. You may have been on the Cobalt/Sunfire 10 years ago, Corvette 5 years ago, and trucks today... and in 5 years from now you could be who knows where.

Corvette and Camaro are two different products for two different markets. Yes, some Corvette owners have bought Camaros. I'm sure there are many different factors at play in those purchase decisions that have absolutely nothing to do with Corvette's relative health in the market. GM doesn't care if they lose a few Corvette buyers to the Camaro SS. Does that mean Corvette is "on the down swing" and Chevy is gonna all of a sudden dump the Vette and make the Camaro their halo car? Nah. They still wind up with a Chevy in the garage. What GM wants is to win buyers away from Porsche and other European marques. That's why there's a Chevy Corvette factory race team at Le Mans each June, not a Camaro one.

stock power? or a modified Camaro? Do you think he'd be willing to line his 'Maro up next to a new ZR1 at the 1/4 mile for pink slips?

I know a guy with an 1,100 hp streetable Corvette. If he had shown up at a meeting such as that, would people not be singing the song of Corvette's demise?  

At the George R Brown there were very few stock anything. The most powerful vehicle there was one of our Hennesseys.

You can track the vettes by how many pure vette shows there are nationally now. The vette clubs will be the first to tell you. Not to mention GMs own folks saying the same.

Camaros just came back in 2010...... wait a bit and see what happens. The ball is rolling and the ZL1 is coming. Should only be a matter of time for road course action then.

My information is based on facts your not going to see in public. Just wait and see.




BTW the camaro I am talking about is 1040 RWHP streetable. We also have a 1015 RWHP streetable. HP is not the only thing these cars possess.

[Reaper90]

At the George R Brown there were very few stock anything. The most powerful vehicle there was one of our Hennesseys.

 

You can track the vettes by how many pure vette shows there are nationally now. The vette clubs will be the first to tell you. Not to mention GMs own folks saying the same.

Camaros just came back in 2010...... wait a bit and see what happens. The ball is rolling and the ZL1 is coming. Should only be a matter of time for road course action then.

As far as shows go, coming from a motorsports background and not a "show" background I give little concern about the number of "pure vette shows" there are. Heck, the Corvette Clubs I was a member of had dozens to hundreds of members, and not a "show car" in the crowd... we were all racers that were involved in track and autocross events. To my knowledge, NCCC (National Council of Corvette Clubs) is among the largest organizations of Corvette Clubs nationwide... and hosts almost no shows what-so-ever, being almost entirely motorsports competition oriented.

Sure, GM is throwing a lot of resources towards the Camaro, it's new and trying to establish itself against some good competition. And GM is already putting factory effort into the road racing program, in Grand Am. They're doing the same in World Challenge with the Caddy CTS-V again. And it's still the Vette in the ILMC (formerly ALMS) for the international crowd.

Look, I like the Camaro, and will probably end up with an SS in the garage in a few years, because that's what the wife is salivating for (she wants the rear seats to haul the young'ins). But facts are facts, and reality is what it is...... Corvette will always be the king of performance at GM. The only place the Camaro will be Corvette's daddy is on the shop floor of some aftermarket tuner. If they undo that fact at Chevy... they're more of a group of damm fools than even I could believe.

BTW the camaro I am talking about is 1040 RWHP streetable. We also have a 1015 RWHP streetable. HP is not the only thing these cars possess.

OK, answer me this: If you were gonna retake the record at the Nurburgring for the Bowtie Brand... would you rather do it in a Vette or a Camaro?

[Shuffler]

As far as shows go, coming from a motorsports background and not a "show" background I give little concern about the number of "pure vette shows" there are. Heck, the Corvette Clubs I was a member of had dozens to hundreds of members, and not a "show car" in the crowd... we were all racers that were involved in track and autocross events. To my knowledge, NCCC (National Council of Corvette Clubs) is among the largest organizations of Corvette Clubs nationwide... and hosts almost no shows what-so-ever, being almost entirely motorsports competition oriented.

Sure, GM is throwing a lot of resources towards the Camaro, it's new and trying to establish itself against some good competition. And GM is already putting factory effort into the road racing program, in Grand Am. They're doing the same in World Challenge with the Caddy CTS-V again. And it's still the Vette in the ILMC (formerly ALMS) for the international crowd.

Look, I like the Camaro, and will probably end up with an SS in the garage in a few years, because that's what the wife is salivating for (she wants the rear seats to haul the young'ins). But facts are facts, and reality is what it is...... Corvette will always be the king of performance at GM. The only place the Camaro will be Corvette's daddy is on the shop floor of some aftermarket tuner. If they undo that fact at Chevy... they're more of a group of damm fools than even I could believe.



OK, answer me this: If you were gonna retake the record at the Nurburgring for the Bowtie Brand... would you rather do it in a Vette or a Camaro?

Well the Hennessey I mentioned won best of show and our club took 28 of the 31 awards.

Many of our club members have lots of horsepower and lots of handling goodies. They run quarter mile and tracks.

[CAP1]

As far as shows go, coming from a motorsports background and not a "show" background I give little concern about the number of "pure vette shows" there are. Heck, the Corvette Clubs I was a member of had dozens to hundreds of members, and not a "show car" in the crowd... we were all racers that were involved in track and autocross events. To my knowledge, NCCC (National Council of Corvette Clubs) is among the largest organizations of Corvette Clubs nationwide... and hosts almost no shows what-so-ever, being almost entirely motorsports competition oriented.

Sure, GM is throwing a lot of resources towards the Camaro, it's new and trying to establish itself against some good competition. And GM is already putting factory effort into the road racing program, in Grand Am. They're doing the same in World Challenge with the Caddy CTS-V again. And it's still the Vette in the ILMC (formerly ALMS) for the international crowd.

Look, I like the Camaro, and will probably end up with an SS in the garage in a few years, because that's what the wife is salivating for (she wants the rear seats to haul the young'ins). But facts are facts, and reality is what it is...... Corvette will always be the king of performance at GM. The only place the Camaro will be Corvette's daddy is on the shop floor of some aftermarket tuner. If they undo that fact at Chevy... they're more of a group of damm fools than even I could believe.



OK, answer me this: If you were gonna retake the record at the Nurburgring for the Bowtie Brand... would you rather do it in a Vette or a Camaro?

 you've missed the fact(i think) that there is a huge difference between racers,and showers.

 i rarely hit car shows, only due to the fact that so many of the show cars are "trailer queens", regardless of what their owners will tell you......and i can't stand trailer queens.
 cars are built to be driven.

 you alos didn't catch the play on words. "streetable horsepower". biiiiiiig difference between 1050 streetable horsepower, and a car with 1050 horsepower that's driven every day.  

  i've been around this stuff long enough to know what is and isn't.

 for gm.....their american made hot rod will remain king of the hill, unless they do something stupid(again).

 for the camaro/mustang wars? they will continue as long as ford and chevy can sell cars off of them. i gotta admit though.....i like how chevy has to go to a supercharged 6.2 liter to mess with a naturally aspirated 5.0 liter. (i'm a jack arse, ain't i? )

almosdt forgot....as for the nurburg ring? if they're not gonna use the vette, then they'll use the cadillac. it's faster than the camaro too. 

[Shuffler]

The top mustang has a supercharger.

[CAP1]

The top mustang has a supercharger.

but it doesn't take the top mustang to take any of the camaros right now. 

[Masherbrum]

The top mustang has a supercharger.

From the factory.  You cannot go to a chevy dealer and get a hennessey.    There is a huge difference between a supercharged mustang from the showroom and one that I would send to Livernois Speed Shop and have the engine hopped up.

 The traction control whine was a 3 out of 10.

[phatzo]

Can't split the two in this country
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVSzv1DmPFY&feature=fvst

[Shuffler]

but it doesn't take the top mustang to take any of the camaros right now.  

lol just last year the mustang GT only put out a couple more hp than the V6 camaro. So the HP wars are fun to see back.

[Shuffler]

From the factory.  You cannot go to a chevy dealer and get a hennessey.    There is a huge difference between a supercharged mustang from the showroom and one that I would send to Livernois Speed Shop and have the engine hopped up.

 The traction control whine was a 3 out of 10.

The ZL-1 is coming then after that the Z-28. Supercharged camaros are otw.

[icepac]

We're currently taking in cars worked on by Hennessey, Heffner, ligenfelter, and underground racing and actually making them produce the horsepower they were promised to deliver by the previous shops.

[Shuffler]

We're currently taking in cars worked on by Hennessey, Heffner, ligenfelter, and underground racing and actually making them produce the horsepower they were promised to deliver by the previous shops.

Nice... what is the name of your shop. Are you internationally known like Hennessey? They seem to get magazine covers when there are any HP shootouts.

[Curval]

Mustangs are a dime a dozen...as are 6 cylinder Camaros.

But, when people see and hear the SS Camaro, they stop and look.

That is the bottom line my friends....Stay thirsty.

[CAP1]

lol just last year the mustang GT only put out a couple more hp than the V6 camaro. So the HP wars are fun to see back.

it still doesn't take the top mustang to handle the camaros.

 chevy's putting out(it appears) special camaros to take care of a plain old gt....and chances are good that those special editions won't handle the gt500's.