real gauges

[olds442]

can we get real gauges?

when your on the ground the manifold pressrue is not at 0 in because at sea level the "pressrue" is around 30 in of Mercury. and when you start your engine that number drops why? because of this think of a engine as a "air pump" and that air pump needs air (of course) when your throttle valve is closed, there is a vaccum when the piston goes down.
 
when you give the plane power the manifold goes back up because you open your throttle valve the vaccum force goes down and down and down these may change with alt

look at this video to help >>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C49vFMcdr5o&feature=related  skip to around 1:44 to see what i mean?


<S>

[colmbo]

That was pretty good info.

When you're starting the engine you watch MAP....if it starts to go back up you "tickle" the primer...if MAP drops and stays low it's running.

It's not uncommon to see different MAP or RPM if the throttle levers are matched up.  In the B-17 there is a LOT of cable and pulleys between the throttle lever and the engine...it is very time consuming to keep the throttle levers all perfectly matched up.

One check that is done to test engine performance is something called a "Field Baro Check".  You bring MAP up to whatever field barometric pressure (frankly, we just used 30 inches) and then check RPM.  It's been a while since I've done one, I think it's 2200 RPM your looking for.  If you're getting less RPM than called for you're not getting the power you expect from the engine.

With the Wright 1820s on the B-17 if you have a bad cylinder you'll know it.  It'll pop and fart and run rough.  Tooling along one day and felt a shake.  ??  We started looking around, figured out it was #1...you could see the cowling shudder.  We're all thinking we'll probably have to shut the engine down when it made the decision for us  -- big ball of fire out of the cowling followed by lots of smoke and vibration.  Shut it down, feathered the prop and found a place without a crosswind to land.  The #1 cylinder head had departed the cylinder.

With the PW 1830s on the B-24 it was harder to tell if you'd lost a cylinder.  Took off out of West Yellowstone and when we did the wing check (after gear up look out at the wing/engines and look for fire, smoke, oil or anything else bad) the copilot noticed a little smoke from #4.  We eased the power back a bit and the smoke lessened -- we thought we probably had a push tube O-ring leaking oil causing the smoke so we continued the flight.  Upon landing the ground crew told us "something didn't sound right". When I pulled the bottom cowling piece off I noticed a piece of piston ring about 1/2 inch long --- Hmmmm.  Grabbed a ladder and climbed up to take a peak and discovered I could look right through top cylinder -- the head had seperated.  It was running smooth and I didn't notice any power loss from the engine during our 30 minute flight. 

Round engines are fun.

[guncrasher]

why change/spend time coading something that doesn't really affect the airplane.  I would rather they spend the coading time to stop the bombs from falling on negative g's or while the airplanes are upside down.  same for the c-47's.  I dont think paratroopers were able to jump while the c47 was spinning around with only 1 wing and no tail.  on second thought, i would like to see the troops falling out when the tail is missing .

semp

[bc21]

-1  I dont have 4 throtels to compensate for the one "week engine" .... And there are SOOOOOOOOOOOO many things that NEED to be added like the PBY

[GNucks]

why change/spend time coading something that doesn't really affect the airplane.  I would rather they spend the coading time to stop the bombs from falling on negative g's or while the airplanes are upside down.  same for the c-47's.  I dont think paratroopers were able to jump while the c47 was spinning around with only 1 wing and no tail.  on second thought, i would like to see the troops falling out when the tail is missing .

semp

lol, the things I see guys doing in those C-47's. The Paratroopers inside the plane wouldn't even be able to get to the door much less exit the plane alive. Also, I'm no Jumpmaster but I think speeds in excess of 200mph are a little fast for airborne operations   I also think 800 AGL is a little higher than what is actually required in combat, and as I understand the higher the drop speed the lower the drop alt can be. My lazy Googling has failed to turn up any good data from WWII but I found this page below that supports what little has stuck in my head about how we do it today:

https://rdl.train.army.mil/soldierPortal/atia/adlsc/view/public/10629-1/FM/3-21.220/chap15.htm

I guess so long as no excess G's are pulled during the jump and the speed is more reasonable I'd be happy enough.

/hijack

[olds442]

-1  I dont have 4 throtels to compensate for the one "week engine" .... And there are SOOOOOOOOOOOO many things that NEED to be added like the PBY

when did i say there was week engine?


EDIT: if your talking about the video i just ment look at the MANIFOLD part of it not the week eng and etc.

oh and ment go to 1:00 in the video not 1:44 my bad...

[Reaper90]

I'm no Jumpmaster but I think speeds in excess of 200mph are a little fast for airborne operations

I'll ask my brother, or maybe some of our resident Rangers can enlighten us... I know my bro did quite a few jumps from C-141's when he was with 3rd Rangers (almost 20 years ago, where does the time go), and said the 141 didn't have the ability to "get slow" like the C-130's or C-17's...... jumping from the door of a C-141 involved approaching the door opening and almost literally being sucked out. It may not have been 200mph but I remember him recounting that it was pretty damm fast, a lot faster than they were used to.

[olds442]

I'll ask my brother, or maybe some of our resident Rangers can enlighten us... I know my bro did quite a few jumps from C-141's when he was with 3rd Rangers (almost 20 years ago, where does the time go), and said the 141 didn't have the ability to "get slow" like the C-130's or C-17's...... jumping from the door of a C-141 involved approaching the door opening and almost literally being sucked out. It may not have been 200mph but I remember him recounting that it was pretty damm fast, a lot faster than they were used to.

ok stop with the hijacking

[Reaper90]

ok stop with the hijacking

Oh dear lord..... whatever. 

By all means, continue with the completely pointless thread about something that means absolutely zero to the playability of the game, on a subject that has been discussed many times.....

How about next give us a thread complaining about how the compass in AH works backwards from a real one in an aircraft.

I apologize. I forgot that you owned this thread. 

[olds442]

Oh dear lord..... whatever.  

By all means, continue with the completely pointless thread about something that means absolutely zero to the playability of the game, on a subject that has been discussed many times.....

How about next give us a thread complaining about how the compass in AH works backwards from a real one in an aircraft.

I apologize. I forgot that you owned this thread.  

you know there is  rule # 2 thats why. it happens with all threads now hjacked by the 4th or 5th post sad very sad

EDIT: your right guys we don't need updated planes i mean what dose it do to help game play right! and why advace graphics doesn't help me shoot people, and who gives about skins!

and you say this will do nothing to game play well it will
i have a book that has B17 power ratings and for the best fuel range but it useless because full power should be around 29in of mercury but in game its around 50

[Reaper90]

you know there is  rule # 2 thats why. it happens with all threads now hjacked by the 4th or 5th post sad very sad

There are also rules #3 and #5 that you are violating, Mr. BBS Thread Nanny. I was only responding to someone else's comments concerning aircraft performance in-game and the relative value of this wish.

EDIT: your right guys we don't need updated planes i mean what dose it do to help game play right!

...snip...

and you say this will do nothing to game play well it will

What the guage on the instrument panel displays has ZERO effect on how they have modelled the engine and aircraft performance. If they were to make the change you have requested today, the aircraft will still fly EXACTLY as they did before, the only thing that will have changed is the guage on the IP will react differently to throttle inputs.

[olds442]

There are also rules #3 and #5 that you are violating, Mr. BBS Thread Nanny. I was only responding to someone else's comments concerning aircraft performance in-game and the relative value of this wish.

What the guage on the instrument panel displays has ZERO effect on how they have modelled the engine and aircraft performance. If they were to make the change you have requested today, the aircraft will still fly EXACTLY as they did before, the only thing that will have changed is the guage on the IP will react differently to throttle inputs.

i know this but 20in of mercury is diffrent in game than in RL so my fuel range and power book is useless

[Reaper90]

i know this but 20in of mercury is diffrent in game than in RL so my fuel range and power book is useless

OK, I got it... you don't necessarily want the aircraft power modelling changed because you feel there is a discrepancy in the performance based on manifoild pressures not being in-game as they are in real life, as much as you just want the guage to just read in a more realistic/accurate manner so that you can use a chart from your book to find optimal power settings for fuel economy....

 

Still, pretty minimal importance. Of all of the thingsthat need doing in this game, I'd say this should be a few hundred down the list, but that's just my opinion.

Try going offline with your chart, a B-17, and the E6B and modify your chart's numbers to reflect the in-game B-17. Then you can sell it to other bomber dweebs! 

[hitech]

i know this but 20in of mercury is diffrent in game than in RL so my fuel range and power book is useless

You are incorrect fuel burn rates & speeds will match real world settings per the gauges.

All you are asking for is simply for the gauge to read ambient when prop is not turning.  Next you would be asking for it to change as the engine is starting and sputtering. Then  to change with feathered props and changes in altitudes so it measures atmospheric.

All of which have zero impact on plane performance or game play.

HiTech

[Motherland]

it useless because full power should be around 29in of mercury

A turbo-supercharged engine that can only get to ambient air pressure?
Sounds legit