Nakajima Ki-43 Hayabusa ("Oscar")

[Ack-Ack]

These are the IJAF sentais and chutais that received the Ki-43 III.  I've highlighted the ones that received the Ki-43 III after December 1944, notice how many got their Ki-43 IIIs prior to December 1944.

13th Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III Oct-44 Spring 45

20th Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III Feb-45 Aug-45

23rd Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III Nov-44 Aug-45

24th Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III spring 45 Aug-45

10th Dokuritsu Hiko Chutai - became 25th Hiko Sentai Oct-42
Ki-43 III Nov-44 Mar-45

26th Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III Jan-45 Aug-45

30th Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III sum 44 May-45

33rd Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III Nov-44 Aug-45

48th Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III Aug-44 Aug-45

54th Hiko Sentai (24th Independent Flying Chutai)
Ki-43 III Oct-44 Aug-45

64th Sentai (2nd Hiko Daitai; 9th Dokuritsu Hiko Chutai) 
Ki-43 III Sep-44 Aug-45

204th Hiko Sentai
Ki-43 III Dec-44 Aug-45

1st Field Reserved Group, Fighter Unit (71st Dokuritsu Hiko Chutai)
Ki-43 III Jan-45 Aug-45 71st I F Chutai

Out of 13 sentais and chutais, only 4 received the Ki-43 III after December 1944 and clearly shows that IJAF units did start to receive the Ki-43 III as early as the summer of 1944.

ack-ack

[HighTone]

                           

                                                                   

[PJ_Godzilla]

These are the IJAF sentais and chutais that received the Ki-43 III.  I've highlighted the ones that received the Ki-43 III after December 1944, notice how many got their Ki-43 IIIs prior to December 1944.
...
Out of 13 sentais and chutais, only 4 received the Ki-43 III after December 1944 and clearly shows that IJAF units did start to receive the Ki-43 III as early as the summer of 1944.

Out of curiosity and to stave off any attempt to impeach what appears to be compelling material that says Tachikawa produced the III in significant quantity well prior to Dec '44, what was your source on this data?

[Ack-Ack]

Out of curiosity and to stave off any attempt to impeach what appears to be compelling material that says Tachikawa produced the III in significant quantity well prior to Dec '44, what was your source on this data?

from a previous post in this thread.

Japanese Naval Air Force Fighter Units and Their Aces, 1932-1945

Fiance bought me that book a couple of years ago but finally got around to reading it while I've been convalescing at home over the summer, it's an updated version of the book of the same name that was printed in 1989. 

There is this site from someone that has posted the same information from the 1989 printing of the book.
Japanese Army Air Force Fighter Units
1931 - 1945

ack-ack

[PJ_Godzilla]

My bad for asking for the repost. Unfotunately, your source is a website. On the upside, the site cites source as: Japanese Army Air Force Fighter Units And Their Aces 1931-1945, Ikuhiko Hata, Yasuho Izawa and Christopher Shores.

This book is available here: http://www.amazon.com/Japanese-Naval-Force-Fighter-1932-1945/dp/1906502846 and appears to be something like Esquemelings seminal bit on Buccaneers - something akin to a sole source. Shores is a late add; a British historian.

I think this is as close to a putaway as we're going to get on this one. The III appears to be a legitimate late-war entity, at least as much so as the F4u-4, for example.

[Karnak]

There seems to be a bit of a double standard there.  People will argue that all sorts of variants are needed, but it seems the legitimacy of the need for variants depends on nationality.  If it is German, then by all means the Bf109E-7 is a crucial addition as it allows the Bf109E-4 performance with a drop tank or a bomb, but a Japanese fighter that adds 30mph over its predecessor, nah, that isn't needed at all as it isn't significant enough.  US, German and British stuff is treated differently than Russian, Italian and Japanese stuff.

Now, this is only in reference to the players, HTC is limited by the data availability and for them, I am sure, it is easier to get the data needed for American, German and British aircraft.

[Ack-Ack]

My bad for asking for the repost. Unfotunately, your source is a website. On the upside, the site cites source as: Japanese Army Air Force Fighter Units And Their Aces 1931-1945, Ikuhiko Hata, Yasuho Izawa and Christopher Shores.

No, my actual source is the book, which I have the recent updated reprinting.  The stuff I copied and pasted in this thread came from the website which is the same exact information from the book as its information is from the original 1989 printing.  Unfortunately, both versions don't have the numbers of Ki-43 IIIs that were sent to these squadrons prior to December 1944. 

ack-ack

[PJ_Godzilla]

There seems to be a bit of a double standard there.  People will argue that all sorts of variants are needed, but it seems the legitimacy of the need for variants depends on nationality.  If it is German, then by all means the Bf109E-7 is a crucial addition as it allows the Bf109E-4 performance with a drop tank or a bomb, but a Japanese fighter that adds 30mph over its predecessor, nah, that isn't needed at all as it isn't significant enough.  US, German and British stuff is treated differently than Russian, Italian and Japanese stuff.

Now, this is only in reference to the players, HTC is limited by the data availability and for them, I am sure, it is easier to get the data needed for American, German and British aircraft.

Of course it's harder to get the Japanese stuff because, even in cases in which data is available, translation is hard to come by. I'd argue collaterally, though that one good argument in favor of variant addition is workload. The example you cite of e-7 is an excellent one since it looks to be a consumable mass addition and thus a cheap date. I've never heard any f/b from the "coaders" on this one but I suspect mass and power changes are two of the easier ones, a wing change not so much since it can screw the entire lift distribution.

I note again that my wife could probably be called upon to do translation work though she's never really contracted to do it outside her role with Tokai Rika. I don't say this as a crass "revenue enhancement" attempt but rather as an offer of resource to HTC, should it help things along. All I'd need to convince her is something to make it worth her while -and her command of both languages is really excellent.

[HighTone]

                                 
                                                                                                                                 

[Karnak]

PJ_Godzilla,

When HTC added the Ki-84 they had contact(s) in Japan that assisted them in accessing and translating Japanese source material.

I was really referring to the attitude of "Why do we need the Ki-43-III when the Ki-43-I or -II can just be subbed for it?" while slight differences between the Bf109E-4 and Bf109E-7, as an example, are seen by sometimes the same people as a "must have, needed to fill a gap, addition."

[PJ_Godzilla]

PJ_Godzilla,

while slight differences between the Bf109E-4 and Bf109E-7, as an example, are seen by sometimes the same people as a "must have, needed to fill a gap, addition."

Well, perhaps, as you state, there is a double standard that leads to a different level of tolerance for deviation. I suspect it ties to familiarity. Most here have doubtless read quite a bit about BoB right down to the travails of the guys at Biggin Hill. Even to me, the extended battles in, e.g. the Phillippines are full of murk. The only Japanese account I've read was Sakae's - and even that was a good deal more sketchy in the late war timeframe. I'm trying to recall if I 've read even one account from a Japanese fighter pilot regarding his stick time in the Ki-44 or Ki-43.
In any case, I suspect this ignorance is part of the reason people have a relaxed accuracy tolerance regarding the PTO.

Actually, your post has kind of inspired me to  do a little searching this lunchtime and see if I can find any decent accounts,. Ack-Ack has already provided a survey source. 

[HighTone]

                             
                                                                                             

[HighTone]

             
                                                                                                                 

[Karnak]

You missed a thread, HighTone:

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,318480.0.html

[HighTone]

LOL...copy that. I saw it, some very cool pics. I was just trying to keep my request consolidated to one thread.


But right on, +1 for the Ki-43's