F3 view and the il2

[gyrene81]

The Ju 88 had dive brakes for a reason.

weren't the dive brakes on models that are not included in ah at this time?

[SmokinLoon]

the Ju88 is the only heavy bomber that should be able to actually DIVE bomb.  It was built with dual purpose in mind.

The Lancaster was used in the early part of the war, although Im not sure if it was designed to do so, in shallow dive runs to saturate an area with ord.  All other heavy bombers were deamed too valuable (the Ju88 and Lanc were retired from the low level dive/shallow dive bombing role when more appropriate aircraft arrived on scene (Boston's, Beau's, Mossi's, 110's, ju87's, etc etc).

oh.. and a BIG  to HTC again for removing F3 from the Il-2!!!   

 

[JUGgler]

you've lost it jug...if the 88 was a single engine attack plane or dive bomber ok...but only in ah is it used like a stuka. speaking of which, isn't f3 mode still enabled for the stuka? shouldn't be.

Look at it this way, If HTC goes to optional load out in the future (which would be good) and 1 of those options is a decent gun pointing out the front of the FU88 and the FU88 still has F3 view at that time, the cackles and whines would be unbearable. It is a good plane and it turns quite well F3 view just would make it all the easier!

Just consider that I'm being pre-emptive  


Now that the il2 has been denied F3 view, it is only fair to do the same to other planes that are used in a "gamey" manner. The consensus on these boards seems to support the change for the il2, so then it is only fair to move forward with the other planes in question  

 ( Remove F3 from any plane with "fixed forward firing guns" )

 


JUGgler

[BnZs]

I would be quite happy to remove F3 from the *game* myself.

Look at it this way, If HTC goes to optional load out in the future (which would be good) and 1 of those options is a decent gun pointing out the front of the FU88 and the FU88 still has F3 view at that time, the cackles and whines would be unbearable. It is a good plane and it turns quite well F3 view just would make it all the easier!

Just consider that I'm being pre-emptive  


Now that the il2 has been denied F3 view, it is only fair to do the same to other planes that are used in a "gamey" manner. The consensus on these boards seems to support the change for the il2, so then it is only fair to move forward with the other planes in question  

 ( Remove F3 from any plane with "fixed forward firing guns" )

 


JUGgler

[Beefcake]

Look at it this way, If HTC goes to optional load out in the future (which would be good) and 1 of those options is a decent gun pointing out the front of the FU88 and the FU88 still has F3 view at that time, the cackles and whines would be unbearable. It is a good plane and it turns quite well F3 view just would make it all the easier!

Just consider that I'm being pre-emptive  


Now that the il2 has been denied F3 view, it is only fair to do the same to other planes that are used in a "gamey" manner. The consensus on these boards seems to support the change for the il2, so then it is only fair to move forward with the other planes in question  

 ( Remove F3 from any plane with "fixed forward firing guns" )

 


JUGgler

Yes, the B25 is a serious threat to the arena, lets get rid of that gamey F3 view. That will cull the horde of B25 dog-fighters ruining the game!  On some levels I can understand removing F3 from the IL-2, however, removing F3 from the remaining bombers with fixed forward guns would do nothing but further limit their use.

[Karnak]

A-20G, D3A1, SBD-5, Ju87 and perhaps the Boston Mk III and TBM-3 I can see.  I don't see a need to remove it from the B-25, B-26 or Ju88.

Tu-2, when added, will be a bit of a dilemma due to it being essentially a twin engined medium bomber....that happens to have a fixed 20mm cannon in each wing root.

[Shuffler]

Just don't touch my bomber.

[321BAR]

A-20G, D3A1, SBD-5, Ju87 and perhaps the Boston Mk III and TBM-3 I can see.  I don't see a need to remove it from the B-25, B-26 or Ju88.

Tu-2, when added, will be a bit of a dilemma due to it being essentially a twin engined medium bomber....that happens to have a fixed 20mm cannon in each wing root.

B-26 flown dweebily can succeed in killing some A/C and so can the B-25H


hell i even downed an F4U1A with a JU88 once...

[BnZs]

Gentlemen, the simplest expedient is to retain F3 mode but remove the ability fire guns in it.

[IrishOne]

Gentlemen, the simplest expedient is to retain F3 mode but remove the ability fire guns in it.

still no good, as it offers unrealistic views, which in some cases can and does provide an unfair advantage.   how many accounts of dogfighting bombers are there really?  besides SBD's and other single engine close air support aircraft.

[SmokinLoon]

Gentlemen, the simplest expedient is to retain F3 mode but remove the ability fire guns in it.

Easiest way for HTC to implement it.  I agree.

However, I think the thought process should go deeper than that.  First, I agree with BnZ's statement: Eliminate the ability to fire in F3 view.  Then, I think HTC could set up a flow chart of qualifications for which aircraft can have it based on XYZ criteria.  I suggest forgetting the classification of the aircraft as a starting point, case in point being the 2 Mossi versions: same exact aircraft, same exact real world view capabilities, yet 2 very different Aces High view abilities.  The role, abilities, speed, ordnance, early way vs late war, color, altitude, blah blah blah, etc, should not be an issue, imo.  What the people inside that aircarft could actually typically should determine if it has F3 capability or not.

I think it should be a plane by plane examination and the ability should be based on the position of the eyes within the aircraft. 

[gyrene81]

sorry jugler...can't agree with it at all...as loon stated, bnz's idea would be a good starting point.

[IrishOne]

sorry jugler...can't agree with it at all...as loon stated, bnz's idea would be a good starting point.

still no good, as it offers unrealistic views, which in some cases can and does provide an unfair advantage.   how many accounts of dogfighting bombers are there really?  besides SBD's and other single engine close air support aircraft.

[gyrene81]

can't agree there either irish...you're talking about cutting off the nose to spite the face...all twin and quad engine bombers have restricted views from the pilots seat...aside from the b26 and a20 none of the bombers have enough guns that can be fired from the cockpit to be a real threat to a 300+ mph late war fighter...and none of them have enough maneuverability to be a real threat...people who get shot down by the 7.9mm guns on the ju-88 got stupid at some point.

[hotard]

Funny how cobia38 out flys most fighters in the A-20, yet it still has f3, while GHI's IL-2 doesn't.. Guess cobia isn't killing the AH sacred cows like G did.