Author Topic: KI-84  (Read 20843 times)

Offline kilo2

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #30 on: June 30, 2011, 06:44:16 PM »
over inflating my ego is imposable...my di...err ego was huge... long before AH :D

thanx my Muppet brothers  :salute




 

Looks good.

To me you cited your source and building on top of a template and then saying you used the template is ok. People in any art take things from each other all the time either purposely or inadvertently. For instance in writing you may find two similar phrases in two different books by two different authors.
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Offline ink

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #31 on: June 30, 2011, 08:11:22 PM »
TY kilo

 :salute

Offline Dragon Tamer

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #32 on: July 01, 2011, 08:42:04 AM »
You can change the look of the weathering in gimp by using the airbrush to lightly apply a more neutral color to the plane's base color.  I do it by making the entire base layer the way I want it to look, add a little airbrush weathering on a seperate layer and then use the smudge tool to work it around until it looks right.  Sometimes this can take several hours so clear your schedual.  If you are seeing a different color than what others are telling your then maybe your need to modify the settings on your monitor, or it is possibly time to get a new one.

Offline ink

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #33 on: July 01, 2011, 09:38:34 AM »
You can change the look of the weathering in gimp by using the airbrush to lightly apply a more neutral color to the plane's base color.  I do it by making the entire base layer the way I want it to look, add a little airbrush weathering on a seperate layer and then use the smudge tool to work it around until it looks right.  Sometimes this can take several hours so clear your schedual.  If you are seeing a different color than what others are telling your then maybe your need to modify the settings on your monitor, or it is possibly time to get a new one.

thanx for tips  :salute

I didn't see it but once it was mentioned, I went back and then I saw it big time :rofl

I am reworking the whole thing,It's gonna be similar but......it certainly isn't gonna be sea-foam green, and a tad more weathering. been at it all night :t

Offline Krusty

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #34 on: July 01, 2011, 11:24:58 AM »
Not one person said it's perfect. It's the first draft of the guys first skin. Sorry you don't want INK and his " ego" in your little sandbox krusty. If you have nothing other to say than your typical " it's sucks" then just work on the assumption we all get you won't like it.

Slash, you apparently don't frequent these forums too often. Without overgeneralizing too much these forums provide feedback, sometimes needed feedback (needed negative feedback) to let somebody know their work is lacking, or needs improvement. We don't get petty about the skins in question, mostly just look at the work and the details on the skin.

And, er... your "other" muppet brother was saying it was PERFECT, and you other muppets were sharing similar sentiments. I don't care if YOU don't like me slash, I don't think about you enough to worry about it. Don't presume to know me or my responses and please don't inject your own little issues into a thread that doesn't need them. This is a thread for a first-time skinner and his first efforts. Look back almost 10 years on this forum and you'll see anybody else doing this might get laughed out of the community. We're trying to be supportive and guiding, and you aren't helping by trying to imply I'm the bad guy. Take it to the O'club. You won't find me there so have at it.


EDIT: As for Ink, I look forward to more screenshots whenever you get around to them!

Offline ink

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #35 on: July 01, 2011, 11:42:54 AM »
Slash, you apparently don't frequent these forums too often. Without overgeneralizing too much these forums provide feedback, sometimes needed feedback (needed negative feedback) to let somebody know their work is lacking, or needs improvement. We don't get petty about the skins in question, mostly just look at the work and the details on the skin.

And, er... your "other" muppet brother was saying it was PERFECT, and you other muppets were sharing similar sentiments. I don't care if YOU don't like me slash, I don't think about you enough to worry about it. Don't presume to know me or my responses and please don't inject your own little issues into a thread that doesn't need them. This is a thread for a first-time skinner and his first efforts. Look back almost 10 years on this forum and you'll see anybody else doing this might get laughed out of the community. We're trying to be supportive and guiding, and you aren't helping by trying to imply I'm the bad guy. Take it to the O'club. You won't find me there so have at it.


EDIT: As for Ink, I look forward to more screenshots whenever you get around to them!


 :headscratch:

which Muppet said it was perfect?


to be honest Krusty, I have been working on it all night, but because of yours and fencers attitudes I have no desire to show you the progress.

fencer straight up lied about what I claimed, and you have this holier then thou attitude that grates on me.

like here when you say a Muppet was saying its perfect.....and no one even came close to saying that, its stuff like that...well I will stop.

you did not give any constructive criticism, you basically said it suked and I was completely doing it wrong, I gave you a clue as how to give proper constructive criticism, but yet here you are......ahhh screw it, dude Im done dealing with you, not worth the headache, been up all night and I got work to do. 

you'll see it once its DONE :aok

Offline Krusty

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #36 on: July 01, 2011, 12:05:21 PM »
Ink

As to the perfect: I will say sorry for mis-reading IrishOne's post, but the rest of the back-patting posts shared the same sentiment. I will leave it be and try to stay on topic.

Now to the heart of the matter, you taking offense at my and Fencer's comments?

I think you have the entirely wrong attitude for it so far. I said "it's not all that great" and you can look up the quotes. I never said it sucks and you seem to be reading from Slash's comment. I'm not posting out of arrogance nor do I think Fencer lying about anything in this thread.


Fencer didn't lie. Where did he come close? He posted all of 2-3 comments in this thread. It's not like there's much chance. You seem to be thinking something else when you replied to his comment and you said "I never said I took credit for the weathering" -- and I think this is your misunderstanding. He never mentioned weathering specifically. He's talking about just using the default and painting the tail markings on top.

Just to make sure we're on the same terminology: Weathering is final subtle details on a finished skin. Exhaust stains. Dirt kicked up from wheels. Oil leaks. Paint chips. Gun gas streaks.

You are saying you "took" or "kept" this or whatever you want to call it, you kept the default weathering. Only, you can't "keep" the weathering, because it's part of a flat 2D bitmap. The finished package is the final skin. You do anything at all on the skin when you use it as a template, and the weathering is covered up. The only way to keep the weathering is to not put anything over it. To use effects to tweak it, or to use translucent layers that let it show through.

The end result is you're not making the bitmap, it's all just the same default. You're modifying and tweaking it.


Maybe to use an analogy you can relate to more?

Say I took your painting that was the equivelant of 50+ hours of work, hung it in a shadow box with a red light shining on it and called it my own artwork? Clearly some effort went into it, but the main focus is the painting, which I did very little to.


How about this... You're new to skinning and limited on time. Normally I advocate that ALL new skinners MUST learn to do their own panel lines and rivets, etc. It can seem daunting and the first time can take a little time, but it's mostly mental and not due to effort. In your case, I'll share with you my Ki-84 file.

I think you're doing it the way you chose to do it because you don't want to do panel lines or rivets or any of the finer details. You have this feeling it will take too much time and you may or may not be right. If I gave you a photoshop file (.PSD) with layers would that free you up a bit to fill in your own work a bit more? Kind of like giving you a paint by numbers and you get to choose all the colors etc but the lines are there. Saves you some time. What do you think?



P.S. in-progress screen shots and the feedback you get along the way are 100000 times more valuable than after-the-fact screenshots where you are reluctant to change anything. Only posting "DONE" screenshots won't be very helpful to you, the person creating it. I would encourage you to keep posting more. People understand they are works in progress, but new skinners also have to understand they aren't picasso right off the bat, too :)
« Last Edit: July 01, 2011, 12:08:13 PM by Krusty »

Offline oboe

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #37 on: July 01, 2011, 12:11:46 PM »
You should've seen my first skin, ink.   I was proud of it at the time, but looking back I can now say it was the absolute worst piece of junk I have ever seen.   (It was a 354th FG P-47D with the yellow cowl and black skull and crossbones - I think Fencer? has a very nice version of it ingame now).

Skinning takes time to master and experience to develop an eye for details.   My advice is don't rush it.  Do show it, and ask for pointers and tips.   Show up close detail of sections of your skin - 3/4 views are nice for overall but its hard to comment on details if we can't see it really close up, from a number of angles.  Can't tell you how many things (errors) I found in my skins - and I rarely posted more than promo shots so I lsot the opportunity for input from the real experts here.

Take an hour or so and look at every Ki.84 custom skin in external view, up really close  - go around and around it, zoom out and way in.  I look at (and I mean examine in detail painstakingly) works by the top skinners - I esp like Cactuskooler's latest works - for inspiration.   Greebo and Fester also strike me as the most detail-oriented and have styles that I'd like to learn how to do.  Experiment and try to duplicate the effects you like in your skin.

Take a look at Greebo's well-worn Soviet A-20 sometime.  That one snuck in under my radar but since I discovered it I think its one of the top skins in the game.
The paint wear on that one is incredible.

And welcome to skinning.     It really is a good feeling to be able to create something and contribute to the game.  Good Luck!

 

Offline ink

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #38 on: July 01, 2011, 12:19:12 PM »
You should've seen my first skin, ink.   I was proud of it at the time, but looking back I can now say it was the absolute worst piece of junk I have ever seen.   (It was a 354th FG P-47D with the yellow cowl and black skull and crossbones - I think Fencer? has a very nice version of it ingame now).

Skinning takes time to master and experience to develop an eye for details.   My advice is don't rush it.  Do show it, and ask for pointers and tips.   Show up close detail of sections of your skin - 3/4 views are nice for overall but its hard to comment on details if we can't see it really close up, from a number of angles.  Can't tell you how many things (errors) I found in my skins - and I rarely posted more than promo shots so I lsot the opportunity for input from the real experts here.

Take an hour or so and look at every Ki.84 custom skin in external view, up really close  - go around and around it, zoom out and way in.  I look at (and I mean examine in detail painstakingly) works by the top skinners - I esp like Cactuskooler's latest works - for inspiration.   Greebo and Fester also strike me as the most detail-oriented and have styles that I'd like to learn how to do.  Experiment and try to duplicate the effects you like in your skin.

Take a look at Greebo's well-worn Soviet A-20 sometime.  That one snuck in under my radar but since I discovered it I think its one of the top skins in the game.
The paint wear on that one is incredible.

And welcome to skinning.     It really is a good feeling to be able to create something and contribute to the game.  Good Luck!

 

now that is awesome advice!!!!!! Thank you :salute

Offline Krusty

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #39 on: July 01, 2011, 01:13:23 PM »
Response yes/no to my offer?

Offline Megalodon

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #40 on: July 01, 2011, 02:47:03 PM »
I snipped just a few of your responses there.

<snip>

1) You are right they were not black. However it was not a kamikaze plane.

<snip>
<snip>
<snip>
<snip>



This very aircraft attacked US ships off Okinawa on May 25th 1945 on a Kamikaze strike..No? none made it to the ships?....all the pilots died? I might be wrong.
Okay..Add 2 Country's at once, Australia and France next plane update Add ...CAC Boomerang and the Dewoitine D.520

Offline HighTone

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #41 on: July 01, 2011, 03:08:53 PM »
Pay no mind to the man behind the curtain INK  :salute

I think you have a good start on a skin I would love to see. Keep at it, so that I may have the pleasure of flying in it one day  :airplane:

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Offline Krusty

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #42 on: July 01, 2011, 03:20:16 PM »
This very aircraft attacked US ships off Okinawa on May 25th 1945 on a Kamikaze strike..No? none made it to the ships?....all the pilots died? I might be wrong.

Good question, and one up for a bit of debate. Back when I did my 57 Shimbu-Tai skin the big debate was "it's a kamikaze skin!"

I was a little skeptical but at the time I understood it may not have been accepted into the game. I mentioned the debate to HTC when I submitted and said I'd leave it up to their choice. After this I found more info. I found that the Ki-84 units were attached to kamikaze missions but as escorts. The commentary was that the Ki-84s were too important to waste in that way, and escorted the kamikazes in to the target (if they could).

Now, you could say maybe there's a misunderstanding in some of the source material in what part of the mission these planes in the 58th ShimbuTai held, or perhaps they were an exception to the rule.

It's up for debate but I'm inclined to think they had so many thousands and thousands of planes ready and willing to be made into kamikaze (including a number of Ki-43s and older models in flight schools). I think they were not the actual suicide attackers themselves, thus weren't truly kamikaze. Just regular fighters in escort missions.

That's what I'm going with until a better argument comes forth or more info.

Offline ink

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #43 on: July 01, 2011, 03:28:42 PM »
Response yes/no to my offer?

 I didn't read your response at first...honestly it don't matter, I know I put a lot more work into that first one then you and fencer want to admit,  yours and fencer's analogies of the painting I did is no where near the same thing, for one I took that painting, from a clean canvas drew an outline and painted it from there, it has around 250 layers of paint, the big difference is most anyone can take GIMP or paint shop and make a skin or be an "artist", very few can do the painting the way I did. I have been an artist my whole life, I've done huge wall murals, have sold many pieces of artwork, besides the 24 years of Tattooing, I am not a computer geek I have only been using computers for as long as I have been in AH, hell AH is basically the reason I got a computer, been using GIMP about 5 years off and on.

 I was under the impression the default is there for us to modify, and that's exactly what I did.

 it truly is all good, I started again, this time I am stripping it down to the very basics and working it up from there, I have already put down an uncountable number of rivets, that is easy, hell its all "easy" just time consuming.

this response from you was much better and way less holier then thou, so I figured I should respond back.

I am all set with the file, actually your responses got me angry (not that difficult of a thing to do) and in turn pushed me to really think about how to do it, with minimal time and maximum return, definitely gonna take longer then I was hoping but whatever, it is gonna be a sick skin that even you will be surprised at.

I do appreciate the offer of the file.

Offline ink

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Re: KI-84
« Reply #44 on: July 01, 2011, 03:34:10 PM »
Pay no mind to the man behind the curtain INK  :salute

I think you have a good start on a skin I would love to see. Keep at it, so that I may have the pleasure of flying in it one day  :airplane:

Thank ya :salute

Good question, and one up for a bit of debate. Back when I did my 57 Shimbu-Tai skin the big debate was "it's a kamikaze skin!"

I was a little skeptical but at the time I understood it may not have been accepted into the game. I mentioned the debate to HTC when I submitted and said I'd leave it up to their choice. After this I found more info. I found that the Ki-84 units were attached to kamikaze missions but as escorts. The commentary was that the Ki-84s were too important to waste in that way, and escorted the kamikazes in to the target (if they could).

Now, you could say maybe there's a misunderstanding in some of the source material in what part of the mission these planes in the 58th ShimbuTai held, or perhaps they were an exception to the rule.

It's up for debate but I'm inclined to think they had so many thousands and thousands of planes ready and willing to be made into kamikaze (including a number of Ki-43s and older models in flight schools). I think they were not the actual suicide attackers themselves, thus weren't truly kamikaze. Just regular fighters in escort missions.

That's what I'm going with until a better argument comes forth or more info.

there is so much mis information out there, and a lot of the Japanese records were destroyed, I have read that they were used as kamikaze, and that they were not...all I know is as soon as I saw the skin I wanted to fly it  :airplane: