More Japanese planes!!!

[Krusty]

The aerodynamics don't support it being a better plane.

It was, however, much more reliable. While it was slower, there is some discussion elswhere that the Ki-84s suffered horribly, especially later in their production runs. The best Ki-84s were the first ones, and production and performance and quality declined from there until the end of the war. Planes would not even make de-rated power, ending up running as slow as a Ki-100, in some cases the Ki-100 being faster.

So even though it's not a monster, in some cases the Ki-100 was better than the Ki-84s, depending on the plane (which Ki-84) and the pilots. In AH we don't have reliability problems, so a fully de-rated engine (that we have already) would out-perform the Ki-100. About the same as you could imagine it would out-perform the Ki-61.

[nrshida]

There was not even a snowball's chance in hell the Japanese could build them in production because they couldn't even produce piston engines with the proper tolerances and metals to sustain power. Jet engines have much higher tolerance requirements and engineering precision.

Rockets? Sure... maybe. But Jumo clones? They must have been high to even think of it.

You know Krusty, your continuing comments implying the Japanese were a race of idiotic inept morons is beginning to border on racism, and I object very strongly to your wording as well as your underlying opinion.

As a matter of interest and fact, and as a counter example to what you are claiming, the licensed Japanese version of the Daimler Benz engine used in the Ki-61 was manufactured to closer tolerances than the German version, their eternal blueprinting and searching for more power from that unit eventually leading to reliability issues.

It was in fact a shortage of a very specific set of materials, both for the German jet engines as well as the Japanese version that limited gas turbine manufacture. These materials, which you continually and ignorantly call simply 'metal' most especially being the high temperature steels needed for the combustion stage, alloys containing cobalt or nickel which was very difficult to obtain.

Why don't you tear your wartime propaganda posters off the wall Krusty, and drag yourself into the present. 

[icepac]

I think we need a properly modeled ki61 before adding a ki100.

[HighTone]

I think we need a properly modeled ki61 before adding a ki100.

May I ask what you feel is wrong with our Ki-61-I-Tei version we have now? Other than needing(in needing I mean I would like it....lol) the updated graphics model.

[nrshida]

It's overweight.

[Krusty]

You know Krusty, your continuing comments implying the Japanese were a race of idiotic inept morons is beginning to border on racism, and I object very strongly to your wording as well as your underlying opinion.

So you're the one spreading that lie about me? This is not the first time those words have been thrown at me, but I thought it was another individual rather than you. I have corrected them too many times before. If you don't understand what I'm saying don't slander me and spread lies. Ask me. Because clearly you have it wrong and I've already stated this recently and in previous discussions.

[Butcher]

You know Krusty, your continuing comments implying the Japanese were a race of idiotic inept morons is beginning to border on racism, and I object very strongly to your wording as well as your underlying opinion.

As a matter of interest and fact, and as a counter example to what you are claiming, the licensed Japanese version of the Daimler Benz engine used in the Ki-61 was manufactured to closer tolerances than the German version, their eternal blueprinting and searching for more power from that unit eventually leading to reliability issues.

It was in fact a shortage of a very specific set of materials, both for the German jet engines as well as the Japanese version that limited gas turbine manufacture. These materials, which you continually and ignorantly call simply 'metal' most especially being the high temperature steels needed for the combustion stage, alloys containing cobalt or nickel which was very difficult to obtain.

Why don't you tear your wartime propaganda posters off the wall Krusty, and drag yourself into the present. 

There's a fine line between what Krusty is talking about, and in fact the Japanese were in no position to Produce and Industrialize Engines or aircraft frames, which is due noted for the main reason they needed to attack Pearl Harbor to gain the Oil and Raw materials to wage war.

True the Japanese closely blueprinted the DB Engine from the Germans, frankly they had no inline engines or any capacity to make them at this point.

And I agree, they could of spared a few rockets from the Me-163 but no way they had any capacity to design or clone the Jumo Engines, perhaps if the war did last longer however it was clearly fantasy for the Japanese to believe they could produce let alone industralize the nation with the Materials they obtained, it was really a matter of do or die, if they didn't get the supplies then the war in China would of severely hammered them down.

Also Krusty will agree on one thing, doesn't matter what the japanese were going to build the Army/Navy would never agree to anything regarding cooperation, and its industry was neither any better.

Perfect example was given in a book called "Fire in the Sky" (I believe i can't recall 100%) a Japanese fighter base at Lae had a few damaged aircraft and 1 completely destroyed aircraft - all the parts from this one destroyed aircraft would repair 3 of the damaged fighters, however the poor japanese maintenance guys had to wait for spare parts rather then ingenuity like the Americans did at Guadalcanal - Torpedo Squadron 8 landed and didn't have 1 flyable aircraft after the battleships bombarded, I forget who did it, but one of the commanders of Torpedo 8 gutted a bunch of planes to piece together a single TBM so it could bomb Japanese artillery positions.

[Arlo]

Ok Ok Ok ....



The Japanese version of a Lavachian?

[nrshida]

So you're the one spreading that lie about me? This is not the first time those words have been thrown at me, but I thought it was another individual rather than you. I have corrected them too many times before. If you don't understand what I'm saying don't slander me and spread lies. Ask me. Because clearly you have it wrong and I've already stated this recently and in previous discussions.

What a typical Krusty reaction. Many people have said similar things, therefore there must be someone coordinating an attack on me & that explains the consistency.

If you've heard those comments many times before and the people who have made such comments have no contact with each other, then that makes you the constant.

Are you really so arrogant that you can't even consider the possibility that what you say can be interpretted this way? I suggest you read back some of your recent posts on Japanese aircraft threads and see if there might be a common theme to your posts that might be giving people this impression.

Something is only slander if it is untrue. Criticising the quality control or availability of equipment is one thing, implying they were unintelligent, incompetent and inferior as a race is unacceptable. Everytime you cross that line, I'll be here to remind you


And just the same as your other posts from Krusty's Imaginarium in every technical aircraft discussion that comes up: stating something, no matter how many times, does not make something true. Your single biggest limitation Krusty is that you know or feel you are right all the time.



Butcher I think a shortage of special materials, a constant destruction of equipment, manufacturing installations and skilled labour should not be misinterpreted as stupidity, ineptitude and inferiority. Krusty stated the Japanese couldn't operate essentially the same machine tools that manufacturers in the West had and I gave a counter example.

Also in response to your statement, I respectfully suggest you read about the development of the engines for the Nakajima Kikka. In the end they produced there own axial flow turbojet, the Ishikawajima Ne-20, based on a handful of photographs and a single cutaway drawing of the BMW 003. A remarkable engineering achievement under those working conditions.



For those especially interested in the Ki-100 and Ki-61, here is a recent discussion where three separate literary sources were revealed suggesting the Aces High Ki-61 is overweight, and some discussion of the types and some pictures made in the R.A.F. Museum of the final existant Ki-100:-

http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,297618.45.html
http://bbs.hitechcreations.com/smf/index.php/topic,296722.0.html

[Slash27]

Also in response to your statement, I respectfully suggest you read about the development of the engines for the Nakajima Kikka. In the end they produced there own axial flow turbojet, the Ishikawajima Ne-20, based on a handful of photographs and a single cutaway drawing of the BMW 003. A remarkable engineering achievement under those working conditions.

I knew I had read that somewhere

[1Boner]

KI-84lb  "might" be an easy addition.

[nrshida]

Yes. Comparitively easy

[Mitsu.]

Ki-84-I-b 500 built. 660km/h?
It would be perk plane...

Ki-43 must be added first. (I still want to see Ki-100 in AH though)
It was IJAF's main fighter during war.

[nrshida]

Mitsu san, could you please cite your source for your figure of 500 built. If you have any additional information you would like to share, please pm me.


I know it's not relevant to the Wishlist, but since it came up and out of interest, apparently one Kikka survives and may now be undergoing restoration. Here is a picture and a video where you can appreciate it's diminutive size (compared to the 262). Its empty weight was something like 60% that of a Vought Corsair.

Click on the picture for YouTube vid:-