HO or no HO?

[grizz441]

Grizz,

The scenario you just described isn't really an isolated 1 v 1 though, if cons are 4k out and closing in on the fight.  That just happens to be a break from multiples fighters engaging each other.  However, the original post showed the only other con at 9.1k away, so that's the true 1 v 1 fight that can happen in the MA.

You're right about the point you're making for that scenario, but the two scenarios should be viewed differently different.

Guppy never specified isolated 1v1 hehe.  A lot of the time you might think that you are having a 1v1 but there might be cons just out of icon range coming towards you.  That's still only an eta 30 seconds away.  As Del says (but doesn't preach), "If you think you are having a 1v1 in the MA, your SA has failed you".  This is generally true.  Most 1v1s I engage in in the MA come with a reasonable degree of uncertainty of if and when they will be interrupted by approaching enemies.  The only way to deal with this uncertainty is to kill the enemy at hand as quickly as possible.  Any delay in that and you are risking wasting more E, more fuel, and most importantly, potentially crucial time that could mean whether you are prepared for the next fight or not.  

I do agree, however, in the rare instances that I am fighting a true isolated 1v1 in a sector with like 2 bad guys and I know with a high level of certainty it will not be interrupted, I will fight for the fight, even sacrificing all energy related advantages to fight the one guy who keeps upping to fight me.  This is rare in the MA.

[katanaso]

Guppy never specified isolated 1v1 hehe.  A lot of the time you might think that you are having a 1v1 but there might be cons just out of icon range coming towards you.  That's still only an eta 30 seconds away.  As Del says (but doesn't preach), "If you think you are having a 1v1 in the MA, your SA has failed you".  This is generally true.  Most 1v1s I engage in in the MA come with a reasonable degree of uncertainty of if and when they will be interrupted by approaching enemies.  The only way to deal with this uncertainty is to kill the enemy at hand as quickly as possible.  Any delay in that and you are risking wasting more E, more fuel, and most importantly, potentially crucial time that could mean whether you are prepared for the next fight or not. 

I do agree, however, in the rare instances that I am fighting a true isolated 1v1 in a sector with like 2 bad guys and I know with a high level of certainty it will not be interrupted, I will fight for the fight, even sacrificing all energy related advantages to fight the one guy who keeps upping to fight me.  This is rare in the MA.

I got ya.  I'm still putting things into the context of the original post.

And yeah, I recall the day when I was a few months into AH and kept upping a Spit to fight your 109, which you continually killed, even asking me something akin to wanting to stop since I was losing each time within 2 turns. 

[Zoney]

I would not take that shot in a 1 on 1 "controlled airspace" duel.

I would take that shot in the main arena.

I would take that shot in an FSO and be thrilled to get it.

[Yenny]

As Grizz describe that's how I fly in MA. It's faster kill and continue to fight, then die and fly 5-10 min back to the fight.

[grizz441]

Got into a good fight with Grizz tonight and we ended up in one of those situations described here.  I did not have guns on. He did.   He didn't take the shot.  I commented in reference to this thread that he hadn't taken the shot.  His comment was 'it looked too much like a HO shot", also mentioning it might have looked more so on my end.

Whoops I missed this post.  The reason I did not take the shot was because I felt that you could get nose around on me for the HO and it was foolish to stick in there and line up the shot with that potential on the table.  Had I felt you were lagging the turn a little bit more and I saw more of the top of your plane at the time I made my decision, I likely would have continued on my flight path and taken the shot.  So in all honesty, my decision was based largely on angles and risk/reward, and less on honor.  Although it was an honor to fight your 38G last night.  

[Ump40]

Only in air combat is it honorable to shoot a man in the back.

lol...then were was your honour last night?..You came blasting into a fight while i was 2v1 with a couple P40's, firing face on in your C2 on more than one occasion..not that i care..i just think that this is a funny statement from you..<S>

[waystin2]

Whoops I missed this post.  The reason I did not take the shot was because I felt that you could get nose around on me for the HO and it was foolish to stick in there and line up the shot with that potential on the table.  Had I felt you were lagging the turn a little bit more and I saw more of the top of your plane at the time I made my decision, I likely would have continued on my flight path and taken the shot.  So in all honesty, my decision was based largely on angles and risk/reward, and less on honor.  Although it was an honor to fight your 38G last night.  

I'll give you this Grizz.  You are honest and it is appreciated.  I'll take the low angle shots when presented in the MA's. You may only have that one chance, especially against a great fighter pilot such as Corky.

[Midway]

  Well, based on everything I'm reading here, and knowing my original question was a close call, if I had to do it again, I'd take the shot.

At the time I didn't know if anyone might be just outside icon range or upping from the enemy base, and I wouldn't want to end up even slower and lower than I already was.  I had a good shot, took it, and glad I did, although i understand some might consider it cheap.   It was close, but I'd rather gather up alt and speed, which takes time, for the next fight than to keep this one going any longer since we already dropped our speed and alt so much.

  The key point being it will take some time to rebuild E after a slow turnfight, so the quicker one can get started the better.

Thanks for taking a look at it.  Much appreciate the feedback.

 

  DMGOD for a fun fight which did last several turns.  

[vNUCKS]

ROFLMAO...

HO???  not even close!!! 

in the air:

 

and then on 200:

 

and again on the forums:

 

[crazyivan]

ROFLMAO...

HO???  not even close!!!  

in the air:

 

and then on 200:

 

and again on the forums:

 

Thank you, I find this hilarious myself without all the "By gawd Watson, I do believe that was a quarter deflection shot." Looks to me like one if not both were setting up for the head on. As for someone's 200 antics STFU and get a new plane it gets old. The real question to me is why Midway, was not trying to dodge that Tangzu guy 1-10 yrds off his 6 the entire time? WTG Midway

[Vuokko]

MA: Shoot, nowhere near the HO

DA, challenged to duel: No HO, will shoot without a doubt

DA, friendly duel: No HO, but hold your trigger, better changes will come

DA, dueling ladder etc: No HO, but just wait

[Yeager]

Only in air combat is it honorable to shoot a man in the back.

I remember an interview with air combat veteran OBee O'brian where he described dogfighting as akin to being in a bar fight, and the best way to win a bar fight was to get around behind the guy and stab him in the back.  He survived his air combat experiences to grow into old age so he must have had something going on there.

[Midway]

Thank you, I find this hilarious myself without all the "By gawd Watson, I do believe that was a quarter deflection shot." Looks to me like one if not both were setting up for the head on. As for someone's 200 antics STFU and get a new plane it gets old. The real question to me is why Midway, was not trying to dodge that Tangzu guy 1-10 yrds off his 6 the entire time? WTG Midway

That is an annoying avator.  Have you considerred switching to Spikes' avatar? 

[truss51]

Guppy never specified isolated 1v1 hehe.  A lot of the time you might think that you are having a 1v1 but there might be cons just out of icon range coming towards you.  That's still only an eta 30 seconds away.  As Del says (but doesn't preach), "If you think you are having a 1v1 in the MA, your SA has failed you".  This is generally true.  Most 1v1s I engage in in the MA come with a reasonable degree of uncertainty of if and when they will be interrupted by approaching enemies.  The only way to deal with this uncertainty is to kill the enemy at hand as quickly as possible.  Any delay in that and you are risking wasting more E, more fuel, and most importantly, potentially crucial time that could mean whether you are prepared for the next fight or not.  

I do agree, however, in the rare instances that I am fighting a true isolated 1v1 in a sector with like 2 bad guys and I know with a high level of certainty it will not be interrupted, I will fight for the fight, even sacrificing all energy related advantages to fight the one guy who keeps upping to fight me.  This is rare in the MA.

+1

[crazyivan]

That is an annoying avator.  Have you considerred switching to Spikes' avatar?  

The 200 ch comment was for the other person involved in the fight. I have nothing against spitfire besides a love for killing them so you go givem hell. As for the boobie avatars, I've found some but photobucket doesn't like boobies. Have fun.

Edit: would be nice if you also backed off 200 a bit. I know, I know, it's fun. But consider your ways, it'll go far to repair your good name.