No AXIS attack at C94?

[Viper61]

Curious as to what happened to the AXIS attack to C94.

The 325th VFG (ALLIED) had the defense of the boats.  We engaged about 7-9 109's at about H+35ish just east of the boats.  Fight lasted about 7-10 minutes.  We lost 3 AC and the 109's lost a few as well (probably 4-6) plus some damaged that headed back SE.

We figured we were engaging a Fighter Sweep and then repositioned for the what we expected to see which was higher JU87's coming in.  Never saw any.  Stayed on station until H+110 and then RTB to tower.

Boats did stay in grid 13,10 as I had command all night.  No bombs fell, no bomber AC sighted, no damage to the boats.

It was a good fight with the 109's.  These match ups (Hurri's, Spits and 109s) are pretty even.

Just wondering what happened.

Viper61
Ops Officer
325th VFG

[Reschke]

Something tells me that those Stukas got mauled on the way to the target and never got there. I remember seeing something about a bomber flight getting wiped out but don't remember what the target was they were to hit.

[Bannor]

We were escorting Stukas when the
Hurris came in. We engaged while they went low and away from us. Great fight tween the Hurris and our 109s. I hit 2 of them but didnt seem to cause any damage. I finaly went down. Well fought!
<S>

[bc21]

Ju-88's that hit A-9 never saw an enemy con.

[Vulcan]

Ju-88's that hit A-9 never saw an enemy con.

Nightmares swept A9, we engaged Hurri's over 9 and spits south of 9. Think we got fairly mauled but emptied them of ammo

[Big Rat]

Nightmares swept A9, we engaged Hurri's over 9 and spits south of 9. Think we got fairly mauled but emptied them of ammo

Thanks Vulcan,

You evident;y did a great job since we saw nothing over target and only 3 spits on the way out that didn't persue into the channel.

 
BigRat

[Butcher]

367th turned to engage those 109s then ditched them the second the Stukas were called out, from the time it was called out about 3 minutes all the stukas were wiped out.

[Viper61]

Bannor:

  It was your squad that attacked C94 then?  There are a few other post's about A9 and I wanted to clarify.

  Did the JU87's ever make it to the boats then?  We never saw them and there wasn't any damage to any of the boats.

[Bannor]

Viper, our group was to attack the shipping in sector 13.11, primary target. We were only at 10k to 13k with the the stukas below us at 5k when 5 or 6 Hurricanes came in from the west above us. I know they were able to slink away from the battle bt I'm not certain if they made it to target. Still waiting for the logs.

Just saw the logs. The 324th made it to target, C97. They did a fair amount of damage. WTG!

[SlipKnt]

@ Viper -

VF15 was assigned to hit the 12, 10 shipping then move to 13, 10 (secondary), then 13, 11 (other secondary).

We came in (in our Stukas of Death) and reigned fire from the sky (literally, some got flamed on the way with viz on the boats) and were engaged by Spits & Hurris.  Our primary group had a disco and lost 1 forcing us to send more planes into the first target.

We dropped the first set of DDs (all 4) and payed the price trying to get our last group to 13, 10 but we lost our escort (they were there but all became engaged low trying to get us out to hit your area).  

We were coming from the WSW as well as another group from the NE I believe to hit you all at once.  I don't know what happened in the NE but we all died bravely in the WSW.  We did manage to get a couple kills in the Stuka but was an early ending for us last night.

Now I know why the Stuka wasn't used much after the early part of "The War".  

Sorry you guys didn't get much action.  The stone wall in front of you was thick.  LOL

Hope this helps shed light on what happened.

 



  

[FiLtH]

Thanks Vulcan,

You evident;y did a great job since we saw nothing over target and only 3 spits on the way out that didn't persue into the channel.

 
BigRat

 Vulcan had all the spits to himself for like 15 minutes or so. Heck of a job!

[Viper61]

Bannor / Slipknt:

  Probably need to clarify here as I think theres confusion as to which CV was which.  My questions and comments are in regards to CV 94 in 13.11 which was the most northern CV Task Group.  Not the 2 CV Task Groups in the south which I think your referring to.  Also Bannor the 109's we first engaged were above the cloud layer operating about 22K.  We had Hurri's at 14-16K and higher Spits at 25-26K and hit these 109's from high and low.  The Logs show these kills from "THE UNFORGIVEN". 

  Appreciate the ARR comments, gives me a better idea of what happened combined with what I saw during the fight.  Always like to know so I can improve our owns squad performance from week to week.

  Slipknt don't worry about us not seeing enough action.  All about accomplishing ones mission and I don't mind nights when the squad survives after seeing a brief fight    And in this case that "Brief Fight" was a fun one too!!

  Now if I am reading your comments above correctly the AXIS mission with the JU-87's was to roll from one CV target to the next CV target or to assign 1 squad to strike all 3 something like that?  If so a volition of the FSO rules has taken place.  Separate targets are required to have separate strike packages (squads), in this case at least 3.  Rolling targets in mass or splitting up large squads to Strike separate targets isn't allowed anymore.  Assigning strike packages "secondary" targets to ensure distruction of a Primary target by another and different Strike Package is authorized.  But the plan must have a Primary Strike Package assigned to each target and they must be a separate group and or unit.  So in this case 1 squad could not be assigned to strike more than 1 CV task group as its primary target per the rule as I understand it.

  I am not complaining at all here.  The rules are the rules and its for the good of all.  And we all need to follow them "If" there was an issue here.  If not disregard please.  My comments stem from the fact that no JU-87's attacked C94 and due to its location accidentally being shot down by another ALLIED unit would have been slim to none as the 325th VFG was the only ALLIED squad operating in that northern area and the most likely routes to and from that target area did not cross any other ALLIED defensive zone.  That being said we all know accident's happen and squads attack the wrong places from time to time.

  Again just trying to understand what happened in my area from the AXIS point of view.

[soggydawg]

SlipKnt and friends AKA: VF-15/WD 40/68TH LL were involved in operations on the W flank of the Evac Zone. Their primary mission was the DD targets in 12:10 with the option of continuing E and engaging targets of opportunity. This mission also had a high ratio of 109 assigned with the hope that they would draw some of the defenders W out of 13:10. The Unforgiven squad had a similar mission on the E flank of the Evac Zone.

Operation “ Oh No This Is Not Good” involved the 334Th FS/Fate/JG77/JV44 squads. Stuka flown by 334th/JG77/JV44 were to share an escort provided by  Fate/JG77 to the coast and then split the Ju87,s with 334th hitting 13:10 and JV44/JG77 stukas  diverting E into 13:11

However.

We were bounced prior to reaching the coastline. The close escort sacrificed themselves to allow the stukas to escape, and we found ourselves pushed low and off to the W. Long story short there was a bunch of unescorted Ju87's trying desperately to blend in low on the water, and the 13:11 strike got picked off before we made it out of 13:10.

Sorry to the 325th VFG, we so wanted to blow up your ships, perhaps next time. I trust the Unforgiven gave a good account of themselves. I hindsight perhaps I should have assigned an alternate route for the 13:11 strike but I was hoping to pass undetected while you fighter jocks were knife fighting in the clouds.

<S> To a determined Allied Defense.

<S> To a motivated Axis attack.

<S> To everybody who chooses to spend a little time in a cartoon plane on Friday night.

Freytag
   

[Bannor]

Viper, I m thinking the secondary targets were provided in the orders as follow on strikes, as the Stukas would have to re-arm after their first strike. As for the contacts made, we were at about 14k when we spotted the Hurris and being about 7-9k above the stukas, they would be well out of icon range for you to see as they slinked off towards the sw. The fight with the hurris was intense. <S> Budgray!

[SlipKnt]

My comment was for VF15 and escorts.  I thought something was coming from the NE.  They got jumped and that actually explains the communication problems we had in trying to communicate who was still up and who was where as we tried desperately to move toward our secondary target.

Didn't realize they all got wiped out enroute.  WD40 and 68th punched us through to the first target but like I mentioned previously, we were trying to hold some of our flights up high so they had a chance to get to the secondary targets.  In the end, we all went to the deck at our primary and all died early after sinking the 4 DDs there. 

I don't think there were any violations in all honesty.  VF15 wasn't sure who else was attacking the area to the NE.  We knew someone was because 68th had to sweep through and try to help get them in up in the northeast too. 

That evac zone is an extremely difficult approach considering the DAR protection on both sides of the channel.