Author Topic: On Sleep and its Deprivation  (Read 5267 times)

Offline titanic3

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #60 on: October 08, 2011, 09:39:39 PM »
I'm 19, all through high school and even now, I slept for about 6 hours. If you feel like crap in the morning, take a shower. 10 minutes of your time wakes you up instantly. I'm so used to it now, that if I don't shower in the morning, I can't open my eyes until halfway through the day.

Let's be realistic, it's really hard to find a person that gets 8-9 hours of sleep every night. Most get 5-6 and some even less, and some only get naps because they wake up randomly in the middle of the night. Suck it up, when you get a job, it's going to be worse or the same.

Take a shower, go for a run, or drink coffee if you want, that's how I get through my 5-6 hours of sleep.

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Offline GNucks

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #61 on: October 08, 2011, 10:13:25 PM »
Here's a video that follows an experiment run by Dr. Claudio Stampi. In it he is testing the Uberman's Sleep Schedule of polyphasic sleep. The test subject was able to to adapt to sleeping only 3 hours a day (six 30min naps) and was able function remarkably well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myi2sRph69A

Here's what Dr. Piotr Wozniak has to say about the subject:

Quote from: Polyphasic Sleep: Facts and Myths by Dr. Piotr Wozniak (Jan 2005)
Polyphasic Sleep

Polyphasic sleep is quite widespread in animal kingdom. In a recapitulation of phylogeny, human babies also sleep polyphasically, and gradually lose their nap slots until they become roughly biphasic around the age of one. Human adults, as much as all great apes, are largely biphasic. Although a majority of westerners do not nap on a regular basis their alertness shows a slump in alertness in the middle of the subjective day. This slump can consolidate in a short block of sleep in free-running conditions.

The theory behind the Uberman's Sleep Schedule is that with some effort, we can entrain our brain to sleep along the ancient polyphasic cycle and gain lots of waking time on the way, mostly by shedding the lesser important stages of sleep (e.g. shortening Stage 1 of NREM, which seems to be just a transition state to the more "useful" stages of slow wave sleep).
http://www.supermemo.com/articles/polyphasic.htm#Polyphasic sleep

Quote from: Polyphasic Sleep: Facts and Myths by Dr. Piotr Wozniak (Jan 2005)
Claudio Stampi

Probably nobody knows more about polyphasic sleep than Dr Claudio Stampi. He dedicated his life to understanding ultradian rhythms and the art of napping. His passion for the idea was born three decades ago when, as a medical student, he was also a passionate solo sailor. He studied sleep in dozens of individuals taking part in competitive sailing. He studied sleep patterns for NASA. He studied polyphasic sleep in laboratory conditions. He strapped his subject with wrist-worn activity monitors and EEG electrodes. He is a worshipper of napping as nothing counteracts sleep deprivation and fatigue better than a nap. In his work, he looks for ways towards improving alertness and survival in life-threatening situations, esp. long-distance boat racing. Yet he is not recommending the polyphasic schedule for normally functioning creative individual who can afford a full night of healthy sleep. His alleged "recommendation" is just one of those myths circulating along with the polyphasic sleep meme. Using polysomnographic tools, Stampi looks for troughs and peaks of alertness. His research tries to capitalize on understanding those ultradian rhythms and maximizing the effectiveness of napping, primarily by optimizing the timing of naps. Today he is the most recognized expert in the field.

Stampi has shown that polyphasic sleep can improve cognitive performance in conditions of sleep deprivation as compared with monophasic sleep: Individuals sleeping for 30 minutes every four hours, for a daily total of only 3 hours of sleep, performed better and were more alert, compared to when they had 3 hours of uninterrupted sleep. In other words, under conditions of dramatic sleep reduction, it is more efficient to recharge the sleep "battery" more often. Many use this as the argument for the superiority of polyphasic sleep, while silently skirting around the fact that Stampi also notes that the performance on polyphasic schedule is still far less than that in free running sleep conditions.
http://www.supermemo.com/articles/polyphasic.htm#Claudio Stampi

Scientists are still learning about sleep, and apparently there is no one way to sleep. All this copy+pasting is just food for thought.

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Offline Penguin

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #62 on: October 08, 2011, 11:11:00 PM »
Your blaming this on being pubescent.  Then maybe you have a point because none of us giving you advise never were.  :rolleyes:  Everything I have said I have said considering how I felt back then and what I did to get over it.  You asked what you can do to improve your paper but everything stated about proving points by showing where you got your info falls on deaf ears.  I do not think you want that, but to only make your paper better to prove your point.  You must, and this is the third time I have asked, provide the study that you said was done that you are backing so much.  If you continue not to do so, you will continue to get the negativity you are receiving from others.  I'm trying to help you out here but it seems that's not what you are looking for.  You have not experienced life as much as others yet who have been through it.  Yet you continue to go with what you want because you want what you want.  Stop talking about melatonin and other such so called studies if you do not provide the actual study!   If that's the case, then what you call an essay is only an argumentative paper meant for a debate.  Either way, you are not providing enough facts to make your point and those on your school board who have been through adolescents will see it the same way.  If you truly want to try this out with us, then give us what we ask for.  We've been there, done that.


Here is the name of the study, I believe that I've already posted it, but here it is again.

Danner F; Phillips B. Adolescent sleep, school start times, and teen motor vehicle crashes.  J Clin Sleep Med 2008; 4(6): 533-535

Look it up, it was published in the Journal of Clinical Sleep Medicine (JCSM) in September of 2008.

Here's a video that follows an experiment run by Dr. Claudio Stampi. In it he is testing the Uberman's Sleep Schedule of polyphasic sleep. The test subject was able to to adapt to sleeping only 3 hours a day (six 30min naps) and was able function remarkably well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=myi2sRph69A

Here's what Dr. Piotr Wozniak has to say about the subject:
http://www.supermemo.com/articles/polyphasic.htm#Polyphasic sleep
http://www.supermemo.com/articles/polyphasic.htm#Claudio Stampi

Scientists are still learning about sleep, and apparently there is no one way to sleep. All this copy+pasting is just food for thought.

Scientists are still learning about everything, from atoms to zygotes to 1-dimensional strings to the billions of lightyears of the universe.  Just because we are learning about something, does not mean that we do not understand what we have learned.  I find the report interesting, though.  However, students are not able to have free-running sleep schedules, nor can they sleep during the middle of the day.  We're stuck with a biphasic system, so we need to make the most of it.

-Penguin
« Last Edit: October 08, 2011, 11:16:54 PM by Penguin »

Offline GNucks

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #63 on: October 09, 2011, 08:18:02 PM »
However, students are not able to have free-running sleep schedules, nor can they sleep during the middle of the day.  We're stuck with a biphasic system, so we need to make the most of it.

Half the man's sleep was during the day, so how can you say a student can't go to bed when the sun's up and wake when it's down? A student may be stuck with a biphasic schedule, but the study I cited shows you are perfectly capable of sleeping no matter the time of day.

If you still have trouble, get thicker drapes. And check this little gizmo out, supported by the very foundation you listed in your bibli: http://www.usa.philips.com/c/light-therapy/11625/cat/?tab=Wake+up+naturally#/cp_tab4

Quote from: Phillips Wake-up Light
It’s an alarm clock that wakes you by gradually getting brighter 30 minutes before your wake up time, simulating a natural sunrise. It’s a more natural way to wake up that may give you more energy and improve your mood in the morning.

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Offline canacka

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #64 on: October 09, 2011, 08:29:33 PM »


Here is the name of the study, I believe that I've already posted it, but here it is again.

Danner F; Phillips B. Adolescent sleep, school start times, and teen motor vehicle crashes.  J Clin Sleep Med 2008; 4(6): 533-535

Look it up, it was published in the Journal of Clinical Sleep Medicine (JCSM) in September of 2008.


-Penguin

I saw that one in the bibl. but what about the one I originally talked about in which you said you read her study, and she was correct in her findings?  The one from Colorado?  Besides, I, like whoever your intending this paper for, should not have to do the leg work themselves and look it up or take your word for it.  Give me a link or something but don't tell them to look it up.  If you want to make your point with whoever in your school board sees this, provide it.  If not they will discard it without a second thought.
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Offline Meatwad

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #65 on: October 09, 2011, 08:46:27 PM »
There is an easy solution........... Go to bed earlier. Dont play on the computer, social network, or stay up past midnight cause "everyone else does it"

 :rolleyes:
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Offline USRanger

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #66 on: October 09, 2011, 08:50:17 PM »
Sleep is not important.  Ask the Army! :D  I sleep 3 hours a night.  Just something ya get used to.  If I sleep longer, I tend to get bad migraines.  I'd rather be tired than go through that hell.
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Offline Tyrannis

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #67 on: October 09, 2011, 09:11:12 PM »
Sleep is not important.  Ask the Army! :D  I sleep 3 hours a night.  Just something ya get used to.  If I sleep longer, I tend to get bad migraines.  I'd rather be tired than go through that hell.
i get the same if i happen to get on a 3 hr nap a day routine, then one morning happen to sleep 7 hrs, i'll wake up with a headsplitting migraine. :uhoh

Offline Penguin

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #68 on: October 09, 2011, 10:53:59 PM »
I saw that one in the bibl. but what about the one I originally talked about in which you said you read her study, and she was correct in her findings?  The one from Colorado?  Besides, I, like whoever your intending this paper for, should not have to do the leg work themselves and look it up or take your word for it.  Give me a link or something but don't tell them to look it up.  If you want to make your point with whoever in your school board sees this, provide it.  If not they will discard it without a second thought.

I don't know where to find it, but I have a paper copy.

There is an easy solution........... Go to bed earlier. Dont play on the computer, social network, or stay up past midnight cause "everyone else does it"

 :rolleyes:

Do you honestly believe that if I were voluntarily staying up at night that I would have gone to all this trouble?  I'm not stupid.

-Penguin
« Last Edit: October 09, 2011, 10:57:55 PM by Penguin »

Offline Jayhawk

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #69 on: October 09, 2011, 11:50:36 PM »
I don't know where to find it, but I have a paper copy.

Do you honestly believe that if I were voluntarily staying up at night that I would have gone to all this trouble?  I'm not stupid.

-Penguin

I haven't been following your discussion with canacka, but cite whatever source you've got.  Author, title, year, journal, page, etc.
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Offline 2ADoc

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #70 on: October 10, 2011, 02:02:15 AM »
There are many sleep aids available in this day and age, and many of them are free.  Since you are using both puberty, and hormones as the reason for teenagers not being able to sleep.  Here is a suggestion, take your IPhone, android, or iPad into the bathroom, or someplace you can be alone, go to one of the multiple sleep assistance sites watch a sleep assistance video, or pictures, and spend some time meditating on what you have seen, I promise that in a few minutes you will be ready to sleep, and it will also be a good work out for your dominate hand and arm.  I assure you that this method of sleep assistance has been working since before there were iPads iPhones, and smart phones.  Not only that it does assist in the curbing of the over aggressiveness due to raging hormones.  I can not give any sources for this but I go promise it will work.
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Offline bozon

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #71 on: October 10, 2011, 04:04:27 AM »
I find that the time and timing at which I wake up is much more important that the overall length of the sleep. If you wake me up at 05:00 I will be a zombie no matter if I slep 3 or 8 hours before that. Timing means when in the sleep cycle I wake up and how. If someone wakes me up from deep slumber and I have to jump out of bed, it will take me hours to recover from that. If on the other hand I wake during shallow sleep and given a few minutes to roll in bed before getting on my feet, I will be fully awake once I wash my face.

This also changed with age. My 20s were the easiest in sleep. I could go with 4 hours a night for very extended period and quickly wake up even in the middle of the night. As a teenager the mornings were difficult. Now in my late 30s I can still manange with 4-5 hours a night, as long as I dont wake up before 06:30 or so.

I can believe that shifting the highschools sched an hour later will improve the situation for teenage students. Absolute time matters, not just the total number of sleeping hours. This is true especially in winter when in many countries the waking hours are still dark.
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Offline coombz

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #72 on: October 10, 2011, 06:19:12 AM »
I stopped reading at "High School Students are chronically sleep deprived"

:rofl  

high school students don't know how easy they've got it
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Offline Jayhawk

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #73 on: October 10, 2011, 10:00:17 AM »
I stopped reading at "High School Students are chronically sleep deprived"

:rofl  

high school students don't know how easy they've got it

You make it sound like High School students did the study themselves.
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Offline skorpion

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Re: On Sleep and its Deprivation
« Reply #74 on: October 10, 2011, 03:22:39 PM »
You make it sound like High School students did the study themselves.
last year in middle school the 7th graders had to write about a rare animal, and get this-it was actually published on a website.


maybe highschoolers did write this?