Question for HTC: New Fighter Poll

[Brooke]

Putting out a new airplane would take a significant amount of work.  Folks with exposure to the software business or software development or 3d modelling or skinning will tell you that it is not a trivial amount of work.  There's researching and gathering the performance data, getting the 3d and appearance data, making the 3d model, skinning it, making its flight model, testing and tweaking to make sure the performance is as you intend, putting it into a patch, testing prior to release, etc.

Oh and BTW, if there WAS a way to try out a plane, in some way, shape, form or fashion, then perhaps we wouldn't have the hanger queens we are starting to get.

Most of those planes are used a great deal in special events.

One more thing about filling out plane sets, if that is such a concern for.....well whomever

Whomever = the folks who care a lot about special events or historical significance.  It is a sizeable number of players.

, then where's the HE111 among others? 

I would count others such as D3A, B5N, Spit I, Hurri I, C.202, SBD, TBM, G4M, Brewster, P-40, P-39, B-25C, Bf 110C-4b, Bf 109E, Boston III, F4F-4, etc., which aren't the most-popular late-war Main Arena planes, but are all used a lot in special events.

There seem to be two broad groups of players:  those who don't fly in special events and those who do.  The former's main focus is the late-war Main Arena and how planes will compete against late-war fighters. Nothing wrong with that, but it isn't the only portion of the player base.  The latter care about planes that are historically important even if they don't do well vs. late-war fighters.  The two groups are, I'm guessing, about equal in number, because in some votes we get winners like the B-29 (which is not very useful for special events) and in some votes we get winners like the B-25 and the P-39 (which are not ueber vs. late-war planes but are very, very useful in special events).

In the vote where the B-25/P-39 ended up winning, the He 111 got a decent number of votes.  (I think so did the Pe-2, which is very interesting because that really tells you that some history buffs are voting.)  At any rate, the lack of an He 111 is not because people don't care about historical significance or don't want the He 111 -- it tells you that folks wanted the B-25 and P-39 even more than the He 111 and the Pe-2.

[AWwrgwy]

DUDE.......need i remind you that it's been done before? Remember a foray into what what was going to be "Combat Tour"? While it didn't focus on new planes per se, it did offer some a chance to "try out" a whole new arena.


Nutz

Who got to try Combat Tour?

What was it like?

 



wrongway

[Karnak]

Karnak, if this were true then again, where is the 111? It surely was a "core" aircraft. Please think about what your saying before posting.

Nutz

The He111 is not the be all and end off of gap fillers, the Ju88A-4 more or less fills that slot.  Compare that to the Japanese medium bomber situation prior to the G4M1 being added.  The Ki-67 would flat out outrun the early war American stuff, and those that could catch it crawled headlong into firepower far better than a 1942 Japanese bomber should have.

There are few players here who spend more time thinking about gap fillers and the like than I do.

[Nutzoid]

I'm afraid you are universally wrong on this subject. There is nothing else to say. Not one thing you have said is remotely correct in regards to how things work or even should work.



P.S. Nutzoid, Combat Tour? Are you confusing the old name of the AvA as an arena you could join? Because that was called Combat Tour for a while as well. The main differences were code based and many of the improvements have been integrated into your current Aces High game engine, not the least of which is the strat model, moving strats, offline AI, improved grapics and many other subtle differences. They put the effort it. They didn't rescind that effort and say "Nah... Let's go back to AH1 base code" when they cancelled it. They decided it was taking too long and keeping them from better work, but they never added something to the game as a trial then removed it if unpopular. Not actual content. Settings, sure... Things that took a line of code and that's it, sure (server limits, if you recall?) but not actual content.

Well you say I'm universally wrong. How do you figure that? I was basically thinking out loud. (you might have discerned this from my first post on the subject) Perhaps I wasn't clear. I wasn't saying we SHOULD have a way of testing out a new plane, I meant to say IF we could have a way of testing it, it might help eliminate  some future hanger queens. So your comment about "not one thing you have said is remotely correct" is in itself not correct. The inference is that I somehow know what goes into bringing a new plane into the game. I assure you I do not. Simply speaking, it would be nice to be able to try them out, say in the training arena, for example.

With regard to Combat Tour, I'm talking about the plan to have a new arena where we "construct" our pilots in there and fly them, earn medals and so forth. AI's were to be a big part of that. So yeah, that's what I meant about "trying out" a new addition to the game. Simply a way to try out some new stuff, that's all.

Nutz

[Brooke]

By the way, Nutzoid, please come play in the next scenario "Enemy Coast Ahead" with us.  It starts mid November.  Come get more play time on the special events side.

Spit 9, Spit V, Typhoon, Mossie, and B-25C vs. Bf 109G-2, Bf 109G-6, FW 190A-5, FW 190F-8, and Ju 88 in a 1943 fight for dominance over the English Channel.

[Nutzoid]

Putting out a new airplane would take a significant amount of work.  Folks with exposure to the software business or software development or 3d modelling or skinning will tell you that it is not a trivial amount of work.  There's researching and gathering the performance data, getting the 3d and appearance data, making the 3d model, skinning it, making its flight model, testing and tweaking to make sure the performance is as you intend, putting it into a patch, testing prior to release, etc.

Most of those planes are used a great deal in special events.

Whomever = the folks who care a lot about special events or historical significance.  It is a sizeable number of players.

I would count others such as D3A, B5N, Spit I, Hurri I, C.202, SBD, TBM, G4M, Brewster, P-40, P-39, B-25C, Bf 110C-4b, Bf 109E, Boston III, F4F-4, etc., which aren't the most-popular late-war Main Arena planes, but are all used a lot in special events.

There seem to be two broad groups of players:  those who don't fly in special events and those who do.  The former's main focus is the late-war Main Arena and how planes will compete against late-war fighters. Nothing wrong with that, but it isn't the only portion of the player base.  The latter care about planes that are historically important even if they don't do well vs. late-war fighters.  The two groups are, I'm guessing, about equal in number, because in some votes we get winners like the B-29 (which is not very useful for special events) and in some votes we get winners like the B-25 and the P-39 (which are not ueber vs. late-war planes but are very, very useful in special events).

In the vote where the B-25/P-39 ended up winning, the He 111 got a decent number of votes.  (I think so did the Pe-2, which is very interesting because that really tells you that some history buffs are voting.)  At any rate, the lack of an He 111 is not because people don't care about historical significance or don't want the He 111 -- it tells you that folks wanted the B-25 and P-39 even more than the He 111 and the Pe-2.

Brooke, I have flown in almost every event since Stalin's Forth, IIRC.  I'm not talking about filling the plane set, I'm saying that most of the players in the game choose the plane with the most anticipated "wow" effect. Plane set is the last thing on most of their minds, IMO. While it's true that we have BIG gaps in the plane set, these polls seem to be geared toward the folks looking for the next cool or uber ride. I'm all for the historically correct plane for scenarios.

Nutz

[Nutzoid]

By the way, Nutzoid, please come play in the next scenario "Enemy Coast Ahead" with us.  It starts mid November.  Come get more play time on the special events side.

Spit 9, Spit V, Typhoon, Mossie, and B-25C vs. Bf 109G-2, Bf 109G-6, FW 190A-5, FW 190F-8, and Ju 88 in a 1943 fight for dominance over the English Channel.

Check the registration page. Been there since the second day, or there abouts

Nutz

[Karnak]

Another question I have is where the "hangar queen" line is?

In Tour 140 the P-51D got the most kills of any fighter at ~25,000.  What kill number denotes a hangar queen in relation to that?

[Nutzoid]

Another question I have is where the "hangar queen" line is?

In Tour 140 the P-51D got the most kills of any fighter at ~25,000.  What kill number denotes a hangar queen in relation to that?

Maybe it's late IDK. But read your question and see if you can answer it.

Nutz

[Nutzoid]

Dude... you have little common sense if you think it's possible to try something on the part of all the players of the game BEFORE it's actually added to the game....

Further.... Your comment "if they could test them all for popularity first, we'd have no hangar queens" is also seriously lacking in common sense.


EDIT: I think you're also super-imposing YOUR own idea of what is good and useful on the game as a whole. Who's to say the D3A isn't worth every second of effort they put into it? It sees no MA use but it's used widely in almost any PTO setup. In fact the ones that plug holes often get used outside their own scope because the holes are often too big for 1 plane to plug. They often sub for other planes as well. Your entire idea is based on the thought that you don't consider some planes worth being in the game (that are already) if they sit unused. That's just faulty thinking IMO.

Do you read what you write or just dump and leave? I've "super-imposed" nothing. I've never mentioned the D3A in any post of mine. You and others have. Humm are we to gather from this that some out there DO believe it's a hanger queen? LOL You'll not hear or see me write that it is. I know it gets used. Hell I've used it myself. Oh and Krusty, your dead wrong. The D3A has made a splendid target in the MA on several occasions! 

Nutz

[Nutzoid]

Later all, I'm out.


Nutz

>pfft<

[Brooke]

Check the registration page. Been there since the second day, or there abouts

Nutz

Heh!  OK -- good!  Sorry for not looking first.  Thanks for flying in it (although I wish you were flying with me on the LW side ).

[Karnak]

Maybe it's late IDK. But read your question and see if you can answer it.

Nutz

You're response makes no sense.

It is going to be a personal opinion.  Some people might say less than 10,000 is a hangar queen, others might say less than one kill a day, most somewhere between the two.

[Butcher]

Another question I have is where the "hangar queen" line is?

In Tour 140 the P-51D got the most kills of any fighter at ~25,000.  What kill number denotes a hangar queen in relation to that?

look at the kills for a P40C - its a hanger queen for LWA, I-16 is probably up there, C202 etc

[Karnak]

look at the kills for a P40C - its a hanger queen for LWA, I-16 is probably up there, C202 etc

Yes, but what is the cut point? 

<x kills/month = hangar queen

solve for x.