Author Topic: Early War Tanks  (Read 862 times)

Offline DMVIAGRA

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Early War Tanks
« on: October 28, 2011, 05:45:44 AM »
I'll add more to the list in the future....



M3 Lee


Dimensions

Weight:
27.2 t

Length:
5.64 m

Width:
2.72 m

Height:
3.12 m

Armour

Armour (range):
13-57 mm

Performance

Speed (max):
42 km/h

Armament

Main weapon:
75 mm Gun, M3 (1)

Secondary weapon:
37 mm tank gun (1)
.30 cal. Browning Machine Gun (3)




BT-7


Dimensions

Weight:
11,5 t

Length:
5,58 m

Width:
2,23 m

Height:
2,25 m

Armour

Armour:
13 mm

Performance

Maximum speed:
86 km/h

Armament

Main weapon:
45 mm tank gun




MK II Matilda


Dimensions

Weight:
26,5 t

Length:
5,92 m

Width:
2,51 m

Height:
2,39 m

Armour

Armour:
80 mm

Performance

Maximum speed:
24 km/h

Armament

Main weapon:
40 mm tank gun

Secondary weapon:
7,92 mm machine gun




Hotchkiss H-39


Dimensions

Weight:
11 t

Length:
4.22 m

Width:
1.95 m

Height:
2.15 m

Armour

Armour:
40 mm

Performance

Speed:
28 km/h

Armament

Main weapon:
37 mm SA18 (1)

Secondary weapon:
7,5 mm Reibel (1)

Offline ImADot

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #1 on: October 28, 2011, 08:41:00 AM »
Since they removed the interiors to make modelling quicker and easier, I see no reason to not start adding more Early War vehicles.
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Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #2 on: October 28, 2011, 09:37:37 AM »
The German Panzer III J/J1 (with both short/long barreled 50mm), British Valentine IV /IX (both 40mm and 57mm), and Soviet T70 (45mm) tanks would be the best additions for the EW arenas and AH.  All three were very numerous and very important to each country in the early stages of the war.   
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline Tyrannis

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #3 on: October 28, 2011, 10:51:28 AM »
Why the m3 lee hasent been added yet is a mystery. Its like leaving the p40 out of the american lineup.

Offline bortas1

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #4 on: October 28, 2011, 01:08:51 PM »
 :salute i agree to have these tanks. but anyone notice that the bt7 and the french tank have bling? food for thought. oh btw didnt us called that m3 grant and the british call them lees?
« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 01:10:29 PM by bortas1 »

Offline guncrasher

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #5 on: October 28, 2011, 01:35:23 PM »
Those tanks suck in wot against similar tanks and the fights are at less than 500 meters imagine putting them here against better tanks. 

Semp
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Offline Tyrannis

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #6 on: October 28, 2011, 01:38:25 PM »
Those tanks suck in wot against similar tanks and the fights are at less than 500 meters imagine putting them here against better tanks. 

Semp
If these types of tanks were added, Other Late EW tanks like the panzer IV F and t34 would most likely be perked.

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2011, 01:41:22 PM »
Those tanks suck in wot against similar tanks and the fights are at less than 500 meters imagine putting them here against better tanks

Semp

 :bhead

First, do NOT compare WoT game play vs AH, they are different things entirely.  Secondly, you need to be reminded that the focus is EARLY war, not your standard of late war Tiger, Panther, M18, etc.  If you compare anything, compare the T34/76, T70, Valentine IV, M3 Grant/Lee, M3/75mm half-track, Panzer IV F1, and Panzer III J/J1.  Focus.  :aok  
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #8 on: October 28, 2011, 01:44:04 PM »
If these types of tanks were added, Other Late EW tanks like the panzer IV F and t34 would most likely be perked.

Possibly with a 1 and a much lower ENY.  The rate of fire for the T34/76 is so slow that getting in to range of it to defeat the armor may not be all that difficult.
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline guncrasher

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #9 on: October 28, 2011, 05:38:49 PM »
If these types of tanks were added, Other Late EW tanks like the panzer IV F and t34 would most likely be perked.

none of those tanks could kill the panzer or the t34.  take for example the bt7, I get into battles with tanks 2-3 tiers above me and all they is look at me until they get tired of me pinging them from behind then they turn and I die in one shot.

these tanks were nothing but coffins on wheels of a bygone era.  they were present in ww2 because there was nothing better available for everybody.  what I find funny is people play wot then come here and try to post what they see over there.  I wish they would also think about how exactly would you use these tanks?  they cant kill a building, or any of the current tanks, well perhaps the jeep or the m3.  it's like the tiger in mw, up one and you will kill all the other tanks, unless you are dumb enough to let them get close to you.

but threads like these are nothing more than hey I play wot.

here I"ll give you an example of how well regarded the bt7 is in wot.  not even gonna mention the hotchkiss or the matila as they are so slow they wont be used at all.

http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/20555-tips-for-using-the-bt-7/

one last comment, guess what happened to hundreds of bt7's on the battle field?


semp
you dont want me to ho, dont point your plane at me.

Offline Tank-Ace

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #10 on: October 28, 2011, 06:15:21 PM »
Panzer III Ausf. E
Panzer III Ausf. J
Panzer III Ausf. L
You started this thread and it was obviously about your want and desire in spite of your use of 'we' and Google.

"Once more unto the breach"

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #11 on: October 28, 2011, 08:34:17 PM »
none of those tanks could kill the panzer or the t34.  take for example the bt7, I get into battles with tanks 2-3 tiers above me and all they is look at me until they get tired of me pinging them from behind then they turn and I die in one shot.
these tanks were nothing but coffins on wheels of a bygone era.  they were present in ww2 because there was nothing better available for everybody.  what I find funny is people play wot then come here and try to post what they see over there.  I wish they would also think about how exactly would you use these tanks?  they cant kill a building, or any of the current tanks, well perhaps the jeep or the m3.  it's like the tiger in mw, up one and you will kill all the other tanks, unless you are dumb enough to let them get close to you.

but threads like these are nothing more than hey I play wot.

here I"ll give you an example of how well regarded the bt7 is in wot.  not even gonna mention the hotchkiss or the matila as they are so slow they wont be used at all.

http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/20555-tips-for-using-the-bt-7/

one last comment, guess what happened to hundreds of bt7's on the battle field?

semp

Again, you're comparison of WoT and AH is quite unbecoming.  They are 2 very different platforms with 2 very different objectives.  

You are making comparisons between the LW tanks and the EW tanks, which is not what you need to be doing.  I doubt you will find anyone that will argue that the Pzr III is inferior to the Panther, but that isn't the point.  Currently, the EW server and EW scenarios can use the Pzr IV F and the T34/76.  If the Pzr III, Valentine, or BT7/T60/T70 were added, it was add more diversity to the EARLY WAR tank set, that is it.  It isnt about the EW vs LW tanks or EW tanks in the LW arena, it is about filling in tank sets.  

The German 5cm KwK 39 L/60, British 2 Pdr (40mm), and Soviet 45mm 20K M34 L/46 all have enough AP ability within 1000 yards to make the Panzer IV and T34/76 think twice about being the king of the battlefield.  

Also, if you say "these tanks were nothing but coffins on wheels of a bygone era.  they were present in ww2 because there was nothing better available for everybody.", then that tells me you seriously fail to understand the transgression of warfare and tank development from 1936 to 1945.  Obviously, SOP, tactics, and logistics played a major role in why each country did what they did and developed the material and tools they ended up with.  FWIW, I've not ever really endorsed the slower Churchill or Matilda tanks, in AH simply because of their 15mph max speed they would be left behind.

Of course each of those tank could take down a town building, it will take more shots but then again those smaller caliber tanks were not meant to engage soft targets generally, hence the Panzer IV and larger type "infantry support tanks".  Those smaller caliber tanks will have a much higher rate of fire to make up for the lesser HE effect.  Based on the current AH standards, these intermediate calibers will take 5-7 shots to take down a building.  Add in about a 3 second reload rate and at most it will take one of these EW tanks 21 seconds to bring down a building.  By comparison, the T34/76 can bring down a building in 2 shots over 18 seconds.  Two peas in a pod, I say.      
« Last Edit: October 28, 2011, 08:36:27 PM by SmokinLoon »
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline guncrasher

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #12 on: October 28, 2011, 09:24:45 PM »
I am only comparing wot and ah because this ideas for tanks are coming from wot.  you cannot tell me that all of a sudden people starting researching tanks.  if any of this tanks proposed gets added, it will just add 3 more tanks that will be guaranteed to get killed in any scenario.  unless you add more really crappy axis tanks to ew and for them to be used only in scenarios only.  and then ban the more advanced tanks for they will easily kill the slower tanks.  reminds me of the time we had metal sunday.  the allied tanks got slaughtered by the tigers.

so you are talking about adding 6 or 7 tanks that will hardly get used due to them being ineffective even in scenarios, when the time could be better spent on airplanes.

out of curiosity how often are ew scenarios played?


semp
you dont want me to ho, dont point your plane at me.

Offline SmokinLoon

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #13 on: October 28, 2011, 11:46:14 PM »
I am only comparing wot and ah because this ideas for tanks are coming from wot.  you cannot tell me that all of a sudden people starting researching tanks.  if any of this tanks proposed gets added, it will just add 3 more tanks that will be guaranteed to get killed in any scenario.  unless you add more really crappy axis tanks to ew and for them to be used only in scenarios only.  and then ban the more advanced tanks for they will easily kill the slower tanks.  reminds me of the time we had metal sunday.  the allied tanks got slaughtered by the tigers.
so you are talking about adding 6 or 7 tanks that will hardly get used due to them being ineffective even in scenarios, when the time could be better spent on airplanes.
out of curiosity how often are ew scenarios played?
semp

Again, you are making assumptions that LW "best of the best" tanks will be up against the "crappy" EW tanks.  You're missing the point entirely.  Perhaps a a few Tiger tanks will get worked in to some EW North Africa scenarios, but they would be few and far between.  Nothing a few fast moving M3/75mm could not deal with, a close shot to the Tiger's side of rear would suffice.         

If there is an EW scenario in North Africa, with the Allies having the M4/75, M3/75, Valentine IV, and M8 vs the Axis having the Panzer IV F, Panzer III J, and a few Tigers the battle will be fairly even.  If the scenario is on the Ost Front and the Allies have the BT7 or T60 and T34/76 vs the Panzer III J and Panzer IV F1/F2, again the battle would be more fair than you think.  The T34/76 would be a handful to deal with no doubt, but you are making it sound as if the T34/76 is as capable as a Tiger II in shrugging rounds off.     
Proud grandson of the late Lt. Col. Darrell M. "Bud" Gray, USAF (ret.), B24D pilot, 5th BG/72nd BS. 28 combat missions within the "slot", PTO.

Offline guncrasher

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Re: Early War Tanks
« Reply #14 on: October 29, 2011, 01:13:34 AM »
did you notice the size of the gun on the bt7?


semp
you dont want me to ho, dont point your plane at me.