Ferdinand

[Butcher]

Well people, the main argument against the Pershing is as follows: define squadron strength for GV's.

Do you count a Fighter Group as the same as a Panzer Division? A squadron? Who's standard Division strength do you go by? Do you use each contry's for their own additions?


You have to answer all those questions before you can answer the question "did the Pershing see action in 'squadron' strenght?"



As for the Ferdinand: +1. Would have tons of weaknesses, but would be damn near invincible from the front. We'd have only 1 gun in the entire game capable of engaging it frontally.

Problem is there's going to be a perk value on that, instead of having something useful - it will end up a B-29. Everyone voted on it, but when the reality strikes that the "perk value" - squeakers just got to scared to fly it, unless they climbed above 35k to use it.

I Rarely see Tiger 2's off concrete, adding another concrete wonder does the game no good. The M18 gets plenty of action, rarely once a tour do you see a King Tiger ever attack a base, or ever leave concrete.

Ferdinand in which its mobility is absolutely a joke, so leaving a base would never happen as its to vulnerabile and would be outrageous in perk value.
How high in a Perk Value? I would guess slightly smaller then a King Tiger now, based on gun performance and armor that cannot be penetrated.

Adding something like the Jadgpanzer IV/70 would be a lower cut perk option, with the same gun the Panther uses and a smaller silhouette then the Ferdinand, the difference would be it would probably cheaper then the Panther (5-10 perks), basically a M-18 without the speed and a monster gun and small silhouette.

Difference between M18 and JP IV/70 is the JP is armored and would not be damaged by aircraft guns. Basically you are trading lack of speed for armor and a gun. Where the M18 is highly mobile tank hunter, the JP is a Tank Ambusher.

[Debrody]

He-162s seen combat too... i want them!
One do-335 chased down a tempest on the deck, i want it!
Meteors were killing 50 flying Bombs, i want them!
This kind of logic is a fail.

Thats why i dont request for the 44M Tas, what had the panthers gun and 120mm sloped frontal armor. One was completed:


There are many awsome choices, i hope some of them are under developement:
-Jagdpanzer 4: 80mm sloped frontal armor, the panthers gun, very low profile, been used in large numbers. Could be a kick butt little perked gv.
-IS-2: 120mm sloped frontal armor, 90mm of side armor (!), even the bottom had 60mm sloped armor (!), a 122mm monster gun, many were built, seen combat many times, even against tiger2s. Disadvantages: very slow reload rate (40 secs), only 28 rounds on board. Would need a massive support group (m3 supply, supporting medium tanks), but imo it has place in the game.
-Szu-100: jagd-t34, low profile, had a very good 100mm cannon, but only 45mm of armor. True, the t34 has only 47mm too... Would be a good ambusher, half-way between the m18 and the t34/85.
-Hetzer: a small little ambusher, 60mm frontal armor, sloped with a better angle than the sherman, very low profile, had the panzer4's gun. Wouldnt be perked.
-Stug3: slightly worse armor than the hetzer, with the same gun.
-PanzerIII J: 50mm frontal armor, 50mm kwk39 L/60 cannon. Weak, little firepower, but still capable in close combat and ambushes.
-KV-1: well armored (70mm on turret sides and turret front, 90mm gun mantlet, 75mm sloped frontal armor, but only the t34/76's weak cannon, also slow moving.

Some late war monsters what could meet the criteria:
-Jagdpanther. 80mm sloped frontal armor, the tiger2's monster cannon. Invincible in a frontal attack, but vulnerable on the sides.
-Jagdtiger: very heavily armored, armed with a 128mm pak44/L55 cannon. Now this could destroy a tiger2! From 1000 meters it could penetrate 143mms of armor at the impact angle of 30 degrees. (!) The couple were delivered to the front seen very heavy combat, destroyed hundreds of alied GVs.

The very large majority of the tank battles were between the SU and Germany. Its a fact. Thats why it would be ideal to have many german and soviet tanks.

[cobia38]

  it doesent matter how much armor you have, a well placed egg will still send you to the tower 

[1Nicolas]

He-162s seen combat too... i want them!
One do-335 chased down a tempest on the deck, i want it!
Meteors were killing 50 flying Bombs, i want them!
This kind of logic is a fail.

Thats why i dont request for the 44M Tas, what had the panthers gun and 120mm sloped frontal armor. One was completed:
(Image removed from quote.)

-PanzerIII J: 50mm frontal armor, 50mm kwk39 L/60 cannon. Weak, little firepower, but still capable in close combat and ambushes.

If they Add The Panzer Mark III Special(PzKpfw III Ausf J) Add the Crusader medium cruiser tank and the Valentine tank both with 2pdr Cannon(40mm) So it can actually compete

[1Nicolas]

We have none in game i said.

Im asking for it!

[Ack-Ack]

And theres reports of Pershings nocking out KT's from 1000yrds.  granted, it took one pershing 4 shots to finally nock it out. (First shot was an HVAP, 2 Were AP, then the last was an HE to set it ablaze)

Please either cite or post the reports of a Pershing scoring a kill at a thousand yards or more on a German tank/vehicle. 

ack-ack

[Ack-Ack]

One do-335 chased down a tempest on the deck, i want it!

A Do 335 never chased down a Tempest.

ack-ack

[Debrody]

A Do 335 never chased down a Tempest.

ack-ack

whats the reason you had to post it? Does it makes any difference in my point?

edit: kukac

[Ack-Ack]

whats the reason you had to post it? Does it makes any difference in my point?

correcting an error.  don't get your panties all wadded into a bunch, it can lead to chafing.

ack-ack

[Spikes]

Ferdi would be pointless to add. End of story.

[Tank-Ace]

With the near-guaranteed death to bombs unless you're opperating under the cover of a horde that could disable the base faster than you yourself could drive halfway, yeah, all high-perk tanks are going to be concrete sitters.


Untill we get heavy FlaK cannons with puffy shells, odds are high perk tanks will almost never be used offensivly, since theres either highly dangerous 17lbers on base (to panther, Tiger I, and all tanks less armor than the Tiger II), or the near-certianty of aircraft making the kill, even if theres another King Tiger or Ferdinand to fight you.


Fact of life is:  uncontroled interference by A/C = camp.

[Butcher]

A Do 335 never chased down a Tempest.

ack-ack

I Do know a Tempest tried to chase down a Do-335 which he opened throttle and took off, was a book written by one of the aces, Do 335 however, not sure if they seen combat, I do know mainly prototypes were built.

[Ack-Ack]

I Do know a Tempest tried to chase down a Do-335 which he opened throttle and took off, was a book written by one of the aces, Do 335 however, not sure if they seen combat, I do know mainly prototypes were built.

Yep, you are correct.  A flight of Tempest led by a French ace spotted one flying tree top level and they dove to engage but the D0 335 left in the dust as it ran off.  The Tempests did the chasing, not the Do 335 like was previously claimed.  It would have been interesting to find out what would have happened if the Do 335 decided to stick around and fight.

ack-ack

[Butcher]

Yep, you are correct.  A flight of Tempest led by a French ace spotted one flying tree top level and they dove to engage but the D0 335 left in the dust as it ran off.  The Tempests did the chasing, not the Do 335 like was previously claimed.  It would have been interesting to find out what would have happened if the Do 335 decided to stick around and fight.

ack-ack

I believe if I remember correctly it was a Prototype and unarmed, however did his claim ever get verified? Apparently it was written in his book and his debriefing suggested it to be a "Do-335" however the test pilot of the 335's claim it was never under attack by any Tempests for that matter.

I remember researching it a few years back and drew a blank, one "theory" was do-335's were being tested around a Dornier Plant, after claims of a secret german aircraft that could outrun allied planes, which swiftly caused allies to advance and try to capture the Dornier Plant, which I believe this to be a myth, I do recall something like 15 Do-335s were completed, plus you figure a few prototypes.

Would be quite interesting to see how it handled in game, sadly not being in any kind of squadron strength would severely punish it.